Folks:

The collective wisdom on this and other forums for Marriage Builders is truly awesome. I am sometimes just floored by what someone will say that just works.

And anyone can help. Yes you.

I see a tendency of people to hang back and wait for the "vets" to show up. Oh baloney. Yea, those who have been here a long time know a lot. So what. We are all amateurs sharing our peer opinions and knowledge. None of us are professionals like Dr. Harley and his team. I have even had a few people call me a vet. I am way far from that status.

You all have life experiences. Share them.

When you see someone hurting, give them a hug even if you can't figure out what to say. The interactions of those who are a part of a peer counseling group are important for those who come here for help, to be helped.

You never know when something can be important and will strike a chord.

Now it is that Dr. Harley is a genius. He not only sells great books, he has a private coaching center that helps people with custom plans. In addition, he sells the weekend retreats and the home study course. After all, he and his staff have to make a living.

Yet he also gives his knowledge away for free, right here. And amateur volunteers like me try to help as best we can, with full knowledge that some folks need a professional, which we often recommend for those not totally broke.

Again, Dr. Harley shares his genius level knowledge for free. The only price you pay is the time to learn, if you are willing. And not just interested in sticking your head in the sand and venting from the exposed part of the body which may help temporarily and is encouraged, but the name of the game is the plan. Got it, the plan and to plan takes knowledge.

If you have been helped, payback time is helping someone else. Lots of people do. But sometimes not enough. Late at night I see 10 people logged in, often newbies or names I don't recognize. Someone comes on and posts and nobody says a word of welcome, help is here, be patient and read all the good stuff. We care... Nobody. . . And that is just wrong. So I get on and post something short because I want to go to bed. I could use some help in the week hours

This is not a rant. It is an observation that each of you has something of value to contribute. Don't be shy. Jump in and say something nice at first until you get your confidence up, then be more specific and share your own life experiences.

If you screw up and Lord knows I have, don't worry about. You can always apologize, and the ones who have earned the title "Vet," will be along sooner or later to straighten it out if needed.

And you know what, helping others helps you. You find yourself looking something up or reaching inside for something you didn't even know you had so you can help someone in need. And when you do, the feeling is just, well, try it and find out for yourself . . .

Larry

"Yet he also gives his knowledge away for free, right here."

This is why I love this site so much. Many, many sites claim to have the "secret" to saving a marriage, and then ask for $$$ before they will tell you anything.

Also I've noticed over the years that sometimes the first sign of recovery is when a newbie starts reaching out to help others.

The only thing that is required to help around here is a rudimentary knowledge of Marriage Builders. One doesn't have to be a "vet" to know that. [whatever a "vet" means, I do not consider myself one for sure] I know people who have been here for 3 months who know more than some who have been here for 10 years! Barnboy and Markos already know more than me!

One thing I am very careful to do, since I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL, is stick as closely to Marriage Builders concepts as possible since that is what people come here for. People show up here in the depths of despair and I think it is real important to stick closely to the program so they are not misled or confused even further at an already confusing time.

They don't come here to hear my crap. My best thinking screwed up my marriage. I only know how to screw up a marriage, that is why I stick to Marriage Builders and keep my own opinion to myself if it interferes with helping others learn these concepts.

I would only encourage folks to learn the basic concepts and help others learn them too. And I hope we all remember the sign on the door says Marriage Builders.

Believer and Mel

I agree with your points:

Larry
________________

Okay folks, what did that cost me? I agree. That is one of the most powerful statements on this forum. And anybody can do it if they do, in fact, agree. Why is it so powerful?

Larry

I remember when I first got here. I read a lot of threads where the first posts were little more than "Sorry you're here. I know this sucks..."

But then people would tell us noobs that we should read the top three threads on JFO and be sure to read the Q&A columns on infidelity as well as the basic concepts. Usually within 2 or three interactions people would be directed to SAA and within a couple of pages would be told to check into the coaching center.

I wonder some times how the forums moved away from that advice...

Welcome to Marriage Builders. I know you are hurting right now but considering the situation you have come to the very best place you can be. Be sure you have read the Basic concepts and also check out the Q&A columns about infidelity. Many here have been in your shoes and can offer advice based on their own experiences. The very best advice can be had by calling the coaching center.

Read, learn, ask, share...

What makes this place such a powerful force is that because there are so many unique situations represented almost everyone has some connection to someone else and his or her unique situation. When I am totally stumped on what to say to help someone, others might have just the right thing to say.

So SAY it.

The posts that meant the most to me were the ones that said "I know this sucks. Sorry you find yourself here."

Those posts meant that I wasn't alone and that other people knew what I was feeling.

BTW, the posts I refer to weren't addressed to me. They were addressed to other people who were getting help before I ever registered to post.

Just say it...Empathy is the most amazing thing in days after discovery of an affair.

Mark

I have always learned by teaching. I learn concepts and then repeat them to others. It's great practice for learning to apply them to my own situation. And in an environment like this, you get good feedback if you insert something that violates the concepts into what you are trying to say, which is a very valuable check. If you open your mouth and say what you are thinking, you can find out a lot quicker if you are off base. Why waste time?

I saw a post this morning that expressed surprise that more people had not agreed or disagreed.

Uh, my point?

Don't leave it up to someone else. Express yourself. If you have been helped by this peer counseling forum, it is PAYBACK time.

So far, over a hundred people have read this thread with only a handful of replies.

Larry

Sorry, Larry - I was posting to a couple of posters who needed help.

Here's a reply.
Go get'em Larry!

I am not afraid to jump in and express myself

Well...sometimes I am.

I have learned so much by reading the free info from Dr. H but also by reading what other people are going theough and asking questions. I also learn by considering other people's cries for assistance.

This really is a great place.

Larry- Great point. I have often felt somewhat selfish on here due to being focused on my own sitch and thread. Even though I am not a 'vet', I can help others.

Part of me hesitates to offer advice as things haven't really been working too well for my situation regarding ending the A or WW being open to recovery.

Even though I may not be getting the results I want, these principles and suggestions from others have helped ME to deal with things better and ultimately to be a better man, father and husband.

I do feel I owe MB some payback and hope that maybe my sharing or posting on someone else's thread may help them as well.

Thanks.

EDIT- Not to sound like an excuse, but it is often hard to have the time to read through another thread to get caught up to be able to offer help. Sometimes I don't post because I haven't invested the time into reading back the history on their situation. I don't want to come off as flippant or insincere if I were to reply.

My reply. Great thread Larry!

Larry, you are so right.

For a lot of new arrivals, their frame of reference can boil down to that one line under the moniker:

Posts: _ _ _ _ _

And then we compare that line under OURS to that line under THEIRS. And sure, that may be a somewhat valid comparison in certain situations, but for you new folks, the number of posts DOES NOT define what you know, what you've experienced, or most importantly, how you can be helpful to another.

I have learned from the young to the old, from the new poster to the posting "machines". The key is have a desire, heck, a PASSION for learning. If you do, you'll look under any rock to pick up a nugget or two. And trust me, I look under A LOT of rocks........

Thank for pointing this out, Larry.

TB

I agree with paying back. That isn't the only reason that I post to people. I also learn from teaching the concepts. I read almost all of the threads. There are some threads that I still have to stay away from, for now(it's too painful for me). There are definitely times when I have to hold back on what I am saying because I remember what it was like when I first got here. Sometimes I even get to practice my avoidance of DJ and AO at some of the others posting.

Have I made mistakes, HECK YA. But what happened? I learned from it and grew. I have always been a person who would not be afraid to ask questions. I tell my kids all of the time that it's okay to make mistakes because that's how we learn. It's NATURE. That's what we are supposed to do as humans. Learn from our mistakes.

I have even had moments where I would post something to someone and realize that I could be using that same advice myself. Sometimes it is easier to look at someone else's sitch and see what they need to do rather than look at yourself. Be brave.

Thanx Larry. I will help you when I can.

One of the things that strikes me over and over is that there are MANY MANY people here, and they believe that we should strive for a great, in-love, amazing marriage. When I looked for other sites during the great crash in the fall, I wanted something Christian based, but most of the "advice" people who were hurting received was "suck it up and be content in the Lord" or "God didn't create marriage for us to be happy." Wha? I don't want to be my H's roomate; I want to be his wife, the love of his life. And MB challenges us to go beyond the status quo. I have a looooong way to go, but I hope I can at least help a few people while I am getting there.

I love that you wrote this oosi

Like SOL I feel selfish if I am on here getting advice and not taking the time to try and help someone else. Lately I try to make it on at least once per week to check in on my thread and read/hopefully help someone else.

OMG! This reminds me of the wounded "woe is me" Christian syndrome where it is supposedly a Christian's "lot" in life to suffer. I remember hymnals in church like, "I'll Fly Away!" and "In the Sweet Bye-and-Bye" (cause this mean old world is just so tough I can't wait to get outta here.) This is a pet peeve for me (can you tell? lol) because I was brought up this way.

WRONG!!! Just as there should be and can be JOY and PEACE in being a Christian (even when bad stuff happens!) there can also be JOY and PEACE in marriage. Dr. H has come up with some of the most profound (yet simple) plans for ANYONE to experience that if they're willing to shut up and listen and then work the plans.

Okay, rant over. (Whew!)

P.S. Even if the marriage doesn't recover, there is PERSONAL recovery that can happen as well. I've seen that happen over and over.

P.S.P.S. Oh, and JOY and HAPPINESS are not always the same.