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Originally Posted by MarriedForever
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What would you like Larry to do NOW? How long must he take the 2x4s? What do want from him NOW?

Personally I think it would be helpful if he had this ridiculous, justifying thread deleted and then started another thread apologizing to the board for his lack of total honesty in not admitting the M he was trying to save was actually an affairage.

But that's just me.

Leave us turn the tables a bit. I am going to start asking questions.

Did you see the post I made to MrsW?

How could someone post that they were NOT in an affair marriage and then in the next breath detail an affair marriage?

Larry


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Folks, with great regret I admit I read this whole thread. And NOW I am going to demonstrate why I pick Just Learning for a name on this site.

I thought this site was for helping people rebuild their marriages not just from affairs, but other domestic issues.

I thought the purpose of this site was to discuss and use Dr. Harley's methods so that other people may be helped.

I thought that the merit of the advice was to be found in the advice and not necessarily in the background of the person giving it.

I thought that people did not/ do not need to know my background of the details of my life to either accept my advice as worth considering or not.

I THINK I am too old to give an credence to the Facebook mentality that people should know all about me including my bathroom habits.

There only a few people who still post here that have ever met me and although we (off site) have things in common there isn't a one that could actually say they know me.

So label me "just learning" that what I thought is not valid.

I have not always agreed with Larry's advice, but I have found it well thought out and often in line with MB philosophy. He seems to be getting better at understanding Harley's approach and consequently his advice to people has more weight to it.

Please tell me how his involvement in a court case whos side was judged to be correct, affects his advice to newbie's here?

I understand Pep's response that she does not want to advise those who are not married and resented that this woman went so far as to register with another name and made up story to get her advice.

I have advised people that were found to be trolls. It never bothered me because they either used the advice or they did not and if it was good advice perhaps some other person reading it could use it. IF anyone looks far more people look at thread than post to them.

Perhaps I am completely out of the loop, but it seems to me good advice is good advice and the measure of that is in the person that reads it, acts on it and gets good results.

I would love to say that I always gave good advice, it was always taken an acted up, and that the people involved had a better life because of it. I cannot make that claim. Further, since I did not come here originally because of an affair, I guess it could be stated that any advice I give concerning an affair is worthless, although I have easily read 10 threads for everyone I have posted too.

My point? I see nowhere that Larry lied. I see nowhere that his advice is maliceous, and see plenty of places where his advice is very good. Seems to me the man may have learned something in his life.

So explain to me why this "witch hunt" 'cause after all I am just learning.

JL

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Larry - I notice still your lack of pursuit of the BIG issue here.

What about a betrayed husband who's separated from his children and you were part of that equation - the betrayal part and the keeping his children from him - and you mock the man for trying to gain some kind of contact with HIS CHILDREN!!!!

Where is your empathy? Where is your conscience for the core harm done to this betrayed man?

All you can do is quote how much of a legal lunatic he is - but no empathy for why he might be a little unhinged??

That is the biggest point of concern for me. Still.

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_Larry_ Offline OP
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I have attempted to answer every question directed at me.

I have provided facts as I understand them to be as they were then and as they are now.

I have asked questions as well. Most of the ones I have asked have been ignored.

I have more than admitted I was wrong. I have said "I was an idiot." I did that in one of the first posts I made on this thread and continued to say it.

Sharp (thank you, sometimes I might disagree) doesn't mean I know everything everyone on this board knows. There are holes in my knowledge. And I bet there are holes in the knowledge of everyone on this board.

Now ask yourself a question. Why is Larry doing this?

I assure you I do not need personal validation that I did the right thing, because I didn't. I don't need people beating on me about my "Lack of honesty," anybody can read what I posted that is all the proof needed to demonstrate my lack of understanding. I don't need to be rehabilitated. There are a lot of people on this forum who have been in the barrel in times past who are still here.

I could have taken the advice of someone I respect and just agreed with everyone and defused the situation.

So why am I doing this?

Larry

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I haven't a clue Larry. Why ARE you doing this?


Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
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“In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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Originally Posted by penaltykill
I look at it this way: I owe the people in my real life historical honesty; they are the ones I love and care for and with whom I spend my time. I don't owe posters on an internet forum anything of the kind. I make no secret of the fact that I am a FWW, but I don't go trumpeting it. If someone doesn't care for what I have to say, they are free to disagree with it or disregard it - it's that simple.

This seems like such a tempest in a teapot to me.

pk

Well, there you go. Just when I decide to jump into the fray someone yanks the words right out of my mouth. smile

I have always read Larry's posts with interest, and I believe that he is an intelligent man who is articulate and knowledgeable. To find out he is a FOM? Um. Okay.:::shoulder shrug::: I haven't invested a lot of personal emotion in Larry. FOM, OM, xOM, whatever. I read his posts, take what I need and put the rest on the back burner. I might need that info later, might not.

I don't think it's necessary to vet every poster on here before we decide if they are pure enough to espouse any particular view. I also don't plan my day out according to what a poster does or doesn't suggest. Hey, sorry, I don't know ya! smile I do think it's necessary to read posts and determine whether or not the solutions works and makes sense for each of us. That's important to me.

Now. I would have a problem with Larry if I knew him irl knew that he was not using Dr. H's principles as he says he does. In that case he shouldn't be on here, championing those same principles. IOW, talk the talk and walk the walk. I think that's what Larry's doing.



D-Day 2-10-2009
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Thank you Marriage Builders!

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Kayla

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What about a betrayed husband who's separated from his children and you were part of that equation - the betrayal part and the keeping his children from him - and you mock the man for trying to gain some kind of contact with HIS CHILDREN!!!!

Glad to answer that question, thank you for asking.

Once it sunk in that he was being abusive to his own children, we arranged for him to see them every possible minute. Read what I posted on that. He elected and made the decision to NOT have his kids. We negotiated 112 days total per year, then he backed out. It is my understanding, he did so because he still thought he had a chance to throw XW in jail. I do not have independent validation of that.

And I am not mocking the man. That is your word. You have no knowledge of the soul searching that went on between XW and me over this exact issue. I had been an every other week dad in a previous marriage many years ago and I hated it. If the man had showed one ounce of caring more for his kids than he did for getting revenge on his XW . . .

This revenge deal is part and parcel for way too many divorces. And it just isn't right. Neither is holding the kids back from their dad or mom. The child psychologist is the one who convinced us that something had to be done.

Not every "Betrayed husband" is a paragon of virtue. Some of them are real stinkers, which is reality. That has absolutely nothing to do with the simple fact that I screwed up and was clueless that I had done so under the definition of an "Affairage" until a bit more than a week ago. Wait...

I meant I long ago figured out I screwed up. That this also meant I was in an "Affairage" hit me between the eyes about a week ago. That added to my feelings of stupid and shame.

Larry


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Now. I would have a problem with Larry if I knew him irl knew that he was not using Dr. H's principles as he says he does. In that case he shouldn't be on here, championing those same principles. IOW, talk the talk and walk the walk. I think that's what Larry's doing.

I am trying bliss, I am trying.

Larry

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
Originally Posted by penaltykill
I look at it this way: I owe the people in my real life historical honesty; they are the ones I love and care for and with whom I spend my time. I don't owe posters on an internet forum anything of the kind. I make no secret of the fact that I am a FWW, but I don't go trumpeting it. If someone doesn't care for what I have to say, they are free to disagree with it or disregard it - it's that simple.

This seems like such a tempest in a teapot to me.

pk

Well, there you go. Just when I decide to jump into the fray someone yanks the words right out of my mouth. smile

I have always read Larry's posts with interest, and I believe that he is an intelligent man who is articulate and knowledgeable. To find out he is a FOM? Um. Okay.:::shoulder shrug::: I haven't invested a lot of personal emotion in Larry. FOM, OM, xOM, whatever. I read his posts, take what I need and put the rest on the back burner. I might need that info later, might not.

I don't think it's necessary to vet every poster on here before we decide if they are pure enough to espouse any particular view. I also don't plan my day out according to what a poster does or doesn't suggest. Hey, sorry, I don't know ya! smile I do think it's necessary to read posts and determine whether or not the solutions works and makes sense for each of us. That's important to me.

Now. I would have a problem with Larry if I knew him irl knew that he was not using Dr. H's principles as he says he does. In that case he shouldn't be on here, championing those same principles. IOW, talk the talk and walk the walk. I think that's what Larry's doing.


Unfortunatly, for me, I do find myself caring very deeply for a few of the the posters on this forum. It is actually why I have taken a break for a few months. It can be emotionally draining and I dont know for sure, but may hinder my own recovery. If I found out that I was being misled by a poster that I invested my heart into (not Larry per se, I am just sayin') I would be very hurt.

But I guess that is my own problem not necessarily the posters.


BW me-41
WH -39
DS - 9
married 12 Yrs together(?) 18 yrs when A discovered
DDay aug 2007
found MB dec 2007
Moved out april 2008
still seeing OW
Plan B

Okay I fixed the ages, it was looking screwy. smile
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Originally Posted by _Larry_
Yep. Here is an example. X wife and I were fighting her, uh, XH over custody. He was a complete jerk, telling the kids that our dog was from the devil, I was going to sell them south of the border to a bunch of "Mexicans." And those were just some of the milder examples. Others were calling her a "Ho," a slut, and not a Christian, yada, yada, yada. BTW, we did NOT have an affair marriage. I refused to have anything to do with her until the divorce was filed, then as a friend until it was final.

We spent about 15K moving custody to Texas where our recordings and the testimony of a shrink cooked his goose. He sued in KY in trial court, lost, appealed, lost, then KY Supreme Court.

During KY Supreme Court, the head Judge asked,"Did he really say that?" Lawyer said, "Yes, Your Honor, we have the audio tapes." "Ok," said Judge. End of trial.

Later on, there was a decision. Supreme disagreed with lower courts and MADE UP THEIR OWN REASON to deny what XH wanted. I still laugh when I think about it. That was NOT a slam at lower courts. That was a stick it to XH.

Larry
Larry, is my understanding of this correct?

Your XW was living in one state at the time of her divorce. You married and she moved to be with you in another state.

However, her XH had been awarded regular visitation by the courts in the first state. He could not exercise this legal right when you and your then wife moved the children to the new state. It was too far for him to see his children several times per week.

He sued up to Supreme Court level and lost, partly because you taped his furious telephone calls. His anger was no doubt at his impotence against the judicial system, which was allowing you to live with his children in another state.

Have I understood the legal events clearly? If not, could you please explain them?

The longer his children lived in the new state whilst the appeals were undertaken, the less likely the courts were to enforce their return to the old one. I would guess that your marriage and removal of his children to a new state had a lot to do with cooking his goose over his court-awarded visitation.



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Originally Posted by Just Learning
So explain to me why this "witch hunt" 'cause after all I am just learning.

JL

Witch hunt?

Well, I really don't know where to start. I guess just where it began for me.

I posted stuff (fluffy suggestions) to Larry on his (locked) divorcing thread, because, IMO he had his nose way too far into his XW's current marriage.

At the time, I thought Larry was husband #1, not husband #2.


It seemed he was out of line knowing so much about their marriage and being his XW's confidant. At least, it seemed that way to me. She is another man's wife now, and outside of shared custody issues, her marriage problems are none of his business.
Larry begged to differ.
XW's marriage is his business because her current husband is a (insert judgmental insults here), according to Larry.

OK. Fine.
I back off.

I especially back off because Larry has thrown in his opinion that XW has "RN syndrome" .... which is basically his opinion that nurses marry someone to rescue them. I sense this is a little dig at me. But, never mind.

OK.
Fine.
I back off.

Then, come to find out that Larry married XW 2 weeks after her divorce, and, larry fought the BH in court ... with the intention of denying the BH child custody.

So, it appears to me that XW's marriages are apparently Larry's business.
The marriage before Larry, and the marriage after Larry.


There is always a good reason why Larry makes XW's marriage his business, according to Larry.
The reason is because both those husbands were (insert judgmental insults here).

Beyond the past events, it appears to this observer that Larry is trying to break up her current M, for the same "reasons" he helped end her first marriage.

Call me a crazy witch huntress, but this seems VERY non-MB to me.

1. I was surprised to learn Larry was H #2. (not H #1)
2. I was surprised to learn Larry had been divorced 3 times, not once.
3. I was surprised to learn that Larry thought he was doing the right thing when he helped (then) wife take BH's kids out of state.

OK.
Fine.
I'll back off.



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JL

I could respond to your whole post, but I won't. You made your points as you always do, plenty of thought and plenty of perspective. And a bit of humility. BTW, your posts to TB about TB_11 I think really, really helped him - along with another guy whose name I forget, who backed you up.

Anyway:

Quote
I have not always agreed with Larry's advice, but I have found it well thought out and often in line with MB philosophy. He seems to be getting better at understanding Harley's approach and consequently his advice to people has more weight to it.

I left this board because the passion was gone and with it went my ability to help. Sometimes I felt as if I hadn't learned a darn thing. I decided to come back for a couple of reasons, one that I needed to be productive in something that interested me and two, I wanted to engage in an intensive study of Dr. Harley's methods and concepts - and his delivery technique.

I read threads and site information for a month before I posted to the first thread. Subsequently, I have a library of three books in a convenient location and I spend about 15 minutes a day reading. Before I post any thread where I have a doubt, I go to the site information or a book and try to find a reference to give me a better framework. I am a fairly fast reader, upwards of roughly 600 to 800 words a minute which covers a fair amount of ground in a 15 minute session.

The reasons for 15 minutes is that allows me to absorb what I am reading for comprehension. Thanks for noticing that I am getting better. I try.

And somewhere along the line, I never read a definition of affairage that I understood applied to me until a week ago.

Ouch.

Thanks JL.

Larry


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Originally Posted by _Larry_
Originally Posted by MrsWondering
Originally Posted by _Larry_
Well, we all have baloney detectors. I would appreciate reference to the thread you address. Once I know what you are talking about, I would be more than glad to address it. From what you say, you could be on to something. Could I have lied to myself in the past. Of course I could. As you well know, that capacity exists full blown in most of us. On the other hand, I would prefer to see it in b/w as opposed to your interpretation.

Sure, no problem!

The rest of your post I'll have to get back to you on, as I am busy packing for our family to go out of town...I may see if Mr. W has time, since the words you are questioning are his...

Originally Posted by _Larry_
rotflmao

Yep. Here is an example. X wife and I were fighting her, uh, XH over custody. He was a complete jerk, telling the kids that our dog was from the devil, I was going to sell them south of the border to a bunch of "Mexicans." And those were just some of the milder examples. Others were calling her a "Ho," a slut, and not a Christian, yada, yada, yada. BTW, we did NOT have an affair marriage. I refused to have anything to do with her until the divorce was filed, then as a friend until it was final.

We spent about 15K moving custody to Texas where our recordings and the testimony of a shrink cooked his goose. He sued in KY in trial court, lost, appealed, lost, then KY Supreme Court.

During KY Supreme Court, the head Judge asked,"Did he really say that?" Lawyer said, "Yes, Your Honor, we have the audio tapes." "Ok," said Judge. End of trial.

Later on, there was a decision. Supreme disagreed with lower courts and MADE UP THEIR OWN REASON to deny what XH wanted. I still laugh when I think about it. That was NOT a slam at lower courts. That was a stick it to XH.

Larry

[emphasis mine]

***LINK TO THREAD***

Mrs. W

I am so glad you posted that. I thought you might.

Read what I said. I didn't think I was in an affair marriage, then I detailed an affair marriage. Good grief woman, why on earth would I detail an affair marriage as I now realize it to be and yet deny that it was in the same sentence? Excuse me, I don't understand the finger point of my lack of honesty in what you posted.

Ever seen the WKRP episode where the Station Manager comes in the door and says, "Andy, I honestly thought turkeys could fly."

Larry

faint

Larry, I've been wayward, I recognize "tap dancing" when I see it...As Mel would say, "That's not even GOOD bullcrap!"

Really. Try again.

Know what's missing? Lack of a HUMBLE HEART. EMPATHY.

Instead you are giving us an "Okay, I screwed up, so sue me! Move on."...Not exactly repentance - It is OBVIOUS that there has been no "heart change"...and it is sad - FOR YOU - FOR YOUR CHILDREN...

There is no true ownership.

Not just on this either - You talked on another thread about your own son being a miserable human being - and you blamed his STEPFATHER for that...That really shocked me...Especially since you have admitted to being a WS in another marriage. Was it that marriage, Larry - the one that produced the son you speak so poorly of?

And YES, this is the SAME DEAL as the other board where you met your last wife - a married woman in crisis is a married woman in crisis...You advised a married woman in crisis and ended up having an affair with her! Your own extraordinary precaution should be to NEVER EVER EVER again advise a married woman in crisis on an internet forum...or anywhere else for that matter - That would be a HEALTHY BOUNDARY, Larry - A boundary that would protect YOU and others around you...

My affair was with an ex-boyfriend - Can you imagine the look on Mr. W's face if I were to begin communications with another ex-bf and then say to him, "Oh, it's not the same, honey - this guy and I weren't that close - we didn't date for as long as the OM and I did - this time it's cool!" Or some other such nonsense? I can assure you, I'd get my walking papers and Mr. W would be ABSOLUTELY CORRECT to do so...That would mean that I was still fine with practicing RISKY BEHAVIOR - that I was still cool with having SHODDY BOUNDARIES...He would be wise to run for the hills if that were the case! It's up to YOU, Larry to put extraordinary precautions in place - Will power is VERY unreliable - good solid boundaries are the ONLY way...

Larry, final question for now - How do you think Heartsore would feel if he knew that one of his chief advisors was an OM who helped a WW steal the children of a BH? Heartsore whose WW also took their children and moved to where OM lived...I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that he'd likely not appreciate that tidbit being withheld from him...

Mrs. W



FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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Originally Posted by Just Learning
I have not always agreed with Larry's advice, but I have found it well thought out and often in line with MB philosophy.

I will look for a MB philosophy reference which indicates it is a good idea to insert one's self into an X spouses current marriage.
Especially if the current spouse senses something is amiss, and becomes jealous.






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How do you KNOW I never admitted it? I was exclusively on Recovery for the first few years I was here.

I was exclusively on the Recovery board when I first came here as well, what does this have to do with anything?

Quote
Not once did I see that someone who was dating a married woman in process of divorce was committing either physical or emotional adultery, not one time.


Ohhhh...I bet and would venture to say that you DID (there are tons around, they stick out like a sore thumb WHEN you are senstive to them)...and I also would guess that the reason you didn't "see" them was because you thoughtit didn't apply to you. Your situation was "different", right? (You've already admitted that you were wrong here so I'm not saying anything you yourself haven't said).

Quote
How many times does that particular subject come up in context. I was blind, deaf and dumb, didn't see it, never occurred to me.

Right, as I said above...your sitch was "different". skeptical

Quote
I am not claiming an innocent "mistake." That is an untrue allegation. How many times do I have to say, "I was an idiot?"

Maybe I've misunderstood you...so you're admitting you were an idiot not only in having an A with a MW, but ALSO in supposedly not realizing it was an affairage AND admitting this to the board from the get-go?

ARE you admitting these things or only the OM part?




Me,BW - 42; FWH-46
4 kids
D-Day #s1 and 2~May 2006
D-Day #3~Feb.27, 2007 (we'd been in a FR)
Plan B~ March 3 ~ April 6, 2007

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
To find out he is a FOM? Um. Okay.:::shoulder shrug::: I haven't invested a lot of personal emotion in Larry. FOM, OM, xOM, whatever. I read his posts, take what I need and put the rest on the back burner. I might need that info later, might not.

But Bliss, can you appreciate that Heartsore [and I'm certain MANY others] DID invest in Larry - Heartsore had an email relationship with Larry - he did that based upon the belief that he was being helped by another BH, NOT an OM - NOT someone who had done EXACTLY what the OM in his case was doing to him and his children!

Did you know that Larry emailed Mr. W CONSTANTLY regarding the Heartsore situation? Do you understand that Mr. W would NEVER EVER have discussed Heartsore's situation with an OM?

Did you know that both Larry's and Mr. W's posts from HERE were used against Heartsore in court?

As I said earlier, ultimately Heartsore's WW was allowed to move WITH their children to where OM lives...Sound familiar? It chills my blood...

I would LOVE to be able to re-read the Heartsore thread knowing what I know now. Unfortunately that thread went "poof" because of all that Heartsore went through just based upon posts here on the forum...

frown

I have stated it before and I will state it again - It is my opinion that the perspective of people giving advice here DOES matter.

Mrs. W


FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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BW - me
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2 awesome kids
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Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
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Originally Posted by Pepperband
Originally Posted by Just Learning
So explain to me why this "witch hunt" 'cause after all I am just learning.

JL

Witch hunt?

Well, I really don't know where to start. I guess just where it began for me.

I posted stuff (fluffy suggestions) to Larry on his (locked) divorcing thread, because, IMO he had his nose way too far into his XW's current marriage.

At the time, I thought Larry was husband #1, not husband #2.


It seemed he was out of line knowing so much about their marriage and being his XW's confidant. At least, it seemed that way to me. She is another man's wife now, and outside of shared custody issues, her marriage problems are none of his business.
Larry begged to differ.
XW's marriage is his business because her current husband is a (insert judgmental insults here), according to Larry.

OK. Fine.
I back off.

Wait, wrong. You and SC convinced me that I was wrong. My concern was over the environment my son was living in and that NH was blocking communication that concerned son.

I backed way off. Son then got in trouble at school. A meeting was organized. Better communication is now in force.


I especially back off because Larry has thrown in his opinion that XW has "RN syndrome" .... which is basically his opinion that nurses marry someone to rescue them. I sense this is a little dig at me. But, never mind.

OK.
Fine.
I back off.

That was NOT a dig at you. That was actually something I learned from a couple of docs, a couple of nurses and another source. And the speculation was advanced about XW from an source I consider credible who knows her history well. I regret that you elected to take it personal.

Then, come to find out that Larry married XW 2 weeks after her divorce, and, larry fought the BH in court ... with the intention of denying the BH child custody.

See other posts. I had no intention of denying BH visitation - not my idea.

So, it appears to me that XW's marriages are apparently Larry's business.
The marriage before Larry, and the marriage after Larry.

There is always a good reason why Larry makes XW's marriage his business, according to Larry.
The reason is because both those husbands were (insert judgmental insults here).

Beyond the past events, it appears to this observer that Larry is trying to break up her current M, for the same "reasons" he helped end her first marriage.

Not in this lifetime.

Call me a crazy witch huntress, but this seems VERY non-MB to me.

1. I was surprised to learn Larry was H #2. (not H #1)
2. I was surprised to learn Larry had been divorced 3 times, not once.
3. I was surprised to learn that Larry thought he was doing the right thing when he helped (then) wife take BH's kids out of state.

OK.
Fine.
I'll back off.

**edit**

That is probably the most effective and devastating piece of criticism and conclusion I have ever seen on someone's character; as based on selected bits and pieces. **edit**

You sure you're right?

Larry

Last edited by Revera; 04/23/10 09:06 PM. Reason: TOS - personal attack
Joined: Aug 1999
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Pep,

You said
Quote
I will look for a MB philosophy reference which indicates it is a good idea to insert one's self into an X spouses current marriage.
Especially if the current spouse senses something is amiss, and becomes jealous.


I don't recall anyone saying that. But then I don't recall this thread being about that. I was started with Larry stating his ignorance of what constitutes an "affairage" and Harley setting him straight.

I see statements that he "took" another man's children by helping the exW, yet it was the courts that made that determination. I don't like how men get treated in court and I don't like seeing men losing the ability to see their children do to rediculous claims by exW's BUT, is that really the issue that is causing all of this?

IF someone asks me if this is the right thing to do, I will say no. But, I have conversed with many people on this site that did things I don't agree with when I find out about some details.

You don't like how he acted, I would agree if the facts are as you state. That does not invalidate good advice to someone seeking a path and a plan.

Larry answered the questions asked and the answers were not accepted, what is he supposed to do?

I am not defending his actions, I am questioning the reasons for the vitriol. I have seen it happen on this site too many times and frankly I don't like it much. It detracts from the purpose of this site. There have been posters on this site that were rude, mean, ignorant, and well supported. That I never understood and surely that behavior was more detrimental to the newbies here than whatever Larry has or has not said.

Hence my comments and question.

I will end with the thought that many people "believe" that it is OK to date if a divorce has been filed or a legal separation has occurred. Many people seem to think living together is the same as being married. I strongly disagree with both but then I am an old fart has was taught that living together was not a good idea and certainly NOT just like marriage and that married people were married until they were not. But, I will say many people don't think that. Apparently Larry did not. He now knows better and from Harley's letter he has a very good reason to understand Harley's point of view.

JL

Joined: Feb 2004
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Interesting that people are saying PSBU left "because" of Larry. Whenever a WS leaves it is because "they can't face the truth" or "they are as guilty as sin" or can't look at themselves".

If it is EVER suggested that someone's post or nastiness made them leave that suggestion is treated with disdain and laughter. I can find chapter and verse if you really want me to go through a ton of posts. ****edit****

Last edited by Dufresne; 04/23/10 11:30 PM. Reason: Personal Attack
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