As a fellow BW of black raven, we learn to protect ourselves.

This happens when you have a spouse whom you mistrust, a spouse that behaves in sneaky and selfish ways,
and you witness this for years, finally to be proven that you did need to protect yourself!

Don't even go down that path of blaming black raven for her actions, they are all reactions to yours.

I agree there too, and I asked her to stop explaining as I dont think I have any reason for her to explain anything to me.

I just want US to work. And if not I still have issues and I want them fixed.

You dont crave attention or validation from anyone anymore?

Can you clarify when your last A ended, please?

IHS,

Happiness and contentment come as the result of BEING GOOD. Of choosing admirable actions.

Things like joining a men's bible study.

Work outs with your spouse.

Surrounding yourself with good people to whom family means the world. Guess what? Those people will ADMIRE you for being a good husband and father!

Helping others HERE is a great way to get admiration for DOING GOOD.

See, admiration is a genuine emotional need - there is nothing wrong with enjoying being admired - but you must BE ADMIRABLE. When you do truly admirable things and get GENUINE ADMIRATION for those things, you will no longer be interested in cheap flattery...

Something else I discovered - that though cheap flattery could send me soaring to the highest of highs back then, any slight or perceived slight could send me to the very depths of darkness...Why? Because I allowed others to tell me who I was - what was good or bad about me, instead of KNOWING MYSELF based upon my own fruits...You see, today if someone told me that I was a horrible wife or mother they could go bite bricks - that would roll off my back - why? Because I KNOW I am a great wife and mother - my life bears the fruit of that as proof...it's undeniable...

You must believe yourself to be good and worthy - How? Feelings follow actions - When you DO GOOD, you will FEEL GOOD...It really is that simple - I've lived it and know it...

Mrs. W

IHS,

Were any of the OW married or in a commited relationship, if so you need to appologize to the innocent spouses your have harmed.

Gamma

Mrs M

Thank you that was truely meaningful with constuctive critisism and advice that address what I have wrong with me (Not all of it) but a root issue, I will do think about what you said, tomorrow actully I am going to print it and put that in my office

Thank you

Yup and I agree, I will tomorrow

I do want to make one thing very clear to you, IHS, your need for validation and attention is NOT what caused you to have your affairs...

You know what did? SHODDY BOUNDARIES. period. paragraph. the end.

Once you live with EXTRAORDINARY PRECAUTIONS in your life, you will NOT have affairs. It will not be possible.

So sure, your need for validation and attention did make you more susceptible to having affairs while living without boundaries, but it did not CAUSE your affairs...Do you understand what I am saying? If you don't, please don't hesitate to ask, okay?

Mrs. W

IHS,

A little tip...I would encourage you to answer ALL QUESTIONS asked of you here. I realize that it gets tough when posts come quickly - things get all jumbled in your brain and you forget, but go back and read each post carefully and answer.

#1, That is just the polite thing to do when people take time out of their day to post to you, and

#2, it will help YOU tremendously to get it all out there...It's good openness and honesty practice...

Something that helped me loads when I first got here...I read other threads...I found myself getting so MAD at the WSs being described...At first it didn't even connect for me that *I* was that person, but eventually it sure clicked, and I can't tell you how beneficial that was to my taking full responsibility for my adultery...it was HUGE and oh so helpful to our recovery...Right now, you must focus on your situation with full attention, but even so, jumping in to help another person can also help you guys - sure, you don't know all the MB stuff YET, but you may still have something of value to add - try running it by b_r first and see what she thinks - do you know that Mr. W and I solved a lot of our own problems by dealing with the problems of others? It helped us to talk about things in the third person first! We brainstormed together about certain situations - it brought us closer - 5 years later we are still here posting together - it gives us even more common ground - it keeps marriage at the forefront of our minds...This place has been a blessing to us in many, many ways...I pray that it will be for the two of you as well...

Mrs. W

IHS, my XWH was also a gigantic admiration/attention junkie, *especially* when it came from women.

He never saw a difference between genuine admiration -like from his family and from the friends who actually knew him -

and the fake sucking-up from people who just wanted something from him and quickly realized he was a very easy target - like the cheap girls he hired who could get all the perks and promotions they wanted by making a boyfriend out of their boss, and like the Big Corporation who used him to the max to make big bucks for them even as they watched him throw his family into the garbage.

The difference between Real Admiration and Fake Admiration?

Respect.

I don't think my XWH knows the meaning of that word. That's why he doesn't know the difference between Real and Fake.

Real Admiration comes from people who genuinely know you and care about you and do NOT want to see you do anything that could cause you harm.

Fake Admiration comes from people who are using you get what THEY want - like perks, promotions, dope, groupies, whatever it is - and care absolutely nothing if you end up dead, divorced or in the gutter. They'll just move on to the next target.

Fake Admiration is like a huge flashy ring made out of glass. It will break and cut you at anytime and is worth absolutely nothing.

Real Admiration is like a small and perfect diamond ring that will last forever and make you proud to wear it.

Please don't fall into the Fake Admiration trap that my XWH did. He threw away a wife, two children and two grandchildren who all loved him but could not play second fiddle to his cheap and greedy groupies and sycophants.

I hope you will be wiser.

My wife(SMB)wrote a post some time back that may help.... much along the line of what Mrs. W. is saying;

IHS,

When I first got here, it was 7 months after my affair ended, but I still needed some smacks upside the head to see myself more clearly; and I recall that over the next few weeks, your wife was one of the many people who chipped in with a well-aimed slap. So I am doubly sorry to see you here in this way.

I was an admiration junkie, too. So... what are the things you want to be admired for, and by whom do you want to be admired?

On somebody's thread, back in January 2010, your wife posted, "The husband I have TODAY is a keeper." See, you had her admiration, even after all you'd put her through.

What are you gonna do to earn it?

ihurtsomeone....

I hate to say it, but it feels to me like you are dodging a very important question.
When did the last affair end?

Why don't you want to answer that question?
Because it hasn't ended?

What are you still hiding?

You cannot and will not recover your marriage without being ruthless with yourself about telling the truth.

I know what I am talking about here. My H came here and dodged accountability when people asked him uncomfortable questions. He lied to the people who took time to post to him. And yes, he was still (or again) in his A and that's why he acted that way.

Those actions caused me to suffer incomprehensible trauma. Extended and repeated D-days are torture of the cruelest kind. You are savaging your wife's soul.

When are you going to stop the cruelty?

Thanks all!!

And LG...you owe me a dollar for giving me a hard time about my descriptions. I'm going to make tst give me one too.

..or maybe I owe you a dollar. Thank you.

I will now go back to washing the dishes and will NOT post in this thread, ever ever, ever again.

b_r, you must not do this. You must not post on his thread.

You especially must not post to answer questions that your H has been asked. We want to hear his descriptions and explanations. We will then deal with how he sees things - not how you see them.

BR, what about his work computer? Is it a laptop and is it there at home?

ihurt,

You must keep posting here today and responding to what we say. I think that, until your first coaching session, this forum will be your lifeline. You need to show your wife that your marriage is the most important thing in your life and that you will do ANYTHING to save it. You cannot learn what to do if you do not keep in close contact with us.

Agree!!! b_r

We need - he needs - YOU need for HIM to do the heavy lifting, and that includes hitchin' up his big boy underbritches and answering for himself...

Regarding this last one being a PA or EA - I suggested IHS take a polygraph, and he said he agreed with everything in my post - set one up, b_r...I would have told him to set it up, but I've been told by a few BSs here that a WS is not trustworthy enough to choose their own polygrapher - that is likely true, so on that one thing, I would advise you to do the choosing...

But, b_r, do NOT come back and post to this post of mine on IHS's thread...Seriously, it will not serve either of you well to post on each other's threads...



Mrs. W

ihurt ~

Schedule yourself a polygraph and go take it to prove to b_r that what she has been told thus far is the truth and that there is no more.

You need to get that part overwith before she can begin to believe a word you've said.