My H and I recently got back 2gether after about a 1 year separation. I found text messages and phone records plus PI info that proved H was having secret contact with his 1st child's mother ( a woman I can not stand). This has been a bad situation for at least 20 years and H supposedly could not stand this woman either, so I was devastated when I found out H was having contact with her. I also discovered an A H had with a woman that lived within walking distance from my job. When I confronted H, H also informed me that he had contacted another woman behind my back who he had relations with while we were separated about 12 years ago. This woman also became pregnant and H called her to discuss a child who she said was his. I put H out and we both had an A.Because H contacted this second OW she put him up for CS, they took a DNA test and the OC is H. This child is the same age as my middle child and H wants me to accept her because he believes he is justified because we were separated. I however do not want anything to do with the OC because OC is disrespectful, and has been sent to DJJ twice already. I believe that this OC is a bad influence for COM and every time OC comes around I resent my husband. I do not mind him having contact with OC all I ask is that H not involve me. However every time I refuse to deal with OC or let OC come 2 our home H calls the OM and starts talking about how I did him wrong. H even threatens to leave. I feel that his relationship with his OC is more important than his wife and COM. I tried to work on the marriage because of the COM but he makes me so angry with how he wants to force his OC on us. None of the COM want to have anything 2 do with the OC bcause of OC attitude & disposition. Not sure how to handle this H is determined to make us a big happy family & I am not having it. H is also going 2 1st child's mother's mother house to see H 1st grandchild and H thinks it is ok. I feel it is a blatant disrespect 4 our marriage and very selfish.

A marriage with both partners being wayward, multiple separations and affair makes the odds low for this marriage to be turned around.

You are right to want to exclude OC from your life. Your H is right to want to include the OC in your family life. This is normal for the both of you.

Problems are OC behavior. H won't go NC with your and his AP's. H allows OC to have unacceptable behavior in your home.

I suggest tha you call the Harley's even if your H does not want to counsel with them, you should counsel alone. They will give you plans on how to deal with this. They are also good at guiding you to get your H to talk with them.

What a mess.

I don't know if I see a resolution to this. Husband wants his child in his life, you don't.

I feel bad for all the kids that were procreated because of affairs and then forced not to have contact with a parent.

Well are you going to call the Harley's?

It is a mess and I will.

Where is your sympathy for the COM and the BW who didn't ask for this OC in THEIR lives? Let me tell all of you who have no personal experience with OC that IT IS PAINFUL and DIFFICULT to have contact. Some days the good outweighs the bad but it never, ever removes the pain of the situation completely. Even those that have OP out of their lives and are raising the OC as their own can tell you there is still some twinges associated with the OC. Add to OP into the mix and it is HORRID.

I love my H's OC. He and I have a great R but some days I just don't want him around. I have many days that I just don't want to continue C. I fear for the future when I may be forced to have some interactions with xOW. It makes me want to

It never ceases to amaze me how people can put all their sympathy toward the OC and not consider the utter devastation this has caused the COM and the BS.

Thank you for understanding how I feel. WH accuses me of wanting to keep up mess because I want NC with 2nd OC. WH also thinks he has the right to force 2nd OC on COM eventhough they have told WH they really do not want to be around the 2nd OC. WH 1st OC also wants NC with 2nd OC. All (COM & 1st OC) wanted to meet 2nd OC but after meeting 2nd OC things changed. 2nd OC is disrespectful, rude, and just has a bad attitude. 2nd OC also sat in my home and told COM that she does not like me & neither does her mother(OW). WH doesn not think this is a big deal. WH is always making excuses for his OC & even went so far as to tell me I could be a good role model for 2nd OC, however I do not want to. Isn't that the 2nd OC's mother's job? I think if the 2nd OC had been exposed to us at an earlier age perhaps things would be different. But what type of mother are you that it takes you 12 years to find out who your child's father is and then think it is okay for you to force your child (who has major issues) into an already established family. WH acts as though he can't comprehend this concept and flies off the handle bcause I will not go along with what he wants to do. NC is the best way I know how 2 keep my sanity. Isn't that my right?

It never ceases to amazz me that people blame the OC's. Can't blame the OC's they did not ask to be born. Blame their parents.

As melteach evident by her WH behavior this marriage has not and will not change so their never will be recovery.

All the reason more for them to speak with the Harleys.

Who is "blaming" the OC? Why is it so easy for people who have not had an OC situation forget that the BS and the COM are VICTIMS and are as innocent as the OC?

I (and as far as I�ve read) have never said there isn�t sympathy for the betrayed spouse. I was not an OC; however, my situation was one that I was not allowed to have contact with my biological father. I was told that he did not want to have contact with me sometimes because his then wife (my biological father and mother never married but he got married a few years after I was born) did not want me in the picture because they had children together. I was also told at times that it was him that did not want contact. This makes a child confused, feel unloved and wanted, and bitter. And they wonder why they aren�t good enough to be loved like the children that are included in the wayward spouses family.

The other child is a victim just as the betrayed family members are victims. However, the other child is often cast aside with nothing but an explanation later that the father had poor boundaries�oh well, too bad.


I suppose those that have never been in a situation to where they are not included in the other family don't understand the emotional trauma and devestation it can cause.

kilted, exactly WHO told you this? Your mother? I am sorry your father rejected you. It sure is easy to blame the step mother. It might not have been her. My oldest was born out of wedlock. Going into that situation I knew there was a chance my son would not have a father. After all I made the decision to keep the child, something his bio dad had no choice about. I could have given him up for adoption or even had an abortion. It was my choice.

My son's father saw him a few times the first year and then dropped out of his life until he was 6. The bio dad had gotten married and the wife made sure he was back in his son's life. They never have had a close R but at least he knew his grandparents before they died and I knew his step mom wanted him around. But again she had a choice. She knew about my son prior to marrying. I didn't get ANY choices other than divorcing my husband. My COM didn't get any choices either.

So after 4 years of knowing my stepson existed but not being "allowed" to be around him, my COM and I basically get him forced down our throats. Prior to this happening I was blamed by EVERYONE including my MIL for my H not being fulltime in OC's life.

"Casting aside" is pretty harsh term. Yes OC doesn't get a choice but most kids don't get to choose the circumstances of their birth.

My precious nephew (who passed away at age 14) never once met his bio father. Did nephew sufer or feel "cast aside"? NOPE. Why? Because my sister had loads of people in her life ready to step in and love that child. My sister never said anything bad about nephew's bio to him. Nephew had no reason to doubt he was loved and wanted in his little world.

In my case OW had lots of choices. She made the ones that suited her. She made choices that she felt gave her the best chance to "win" someone else's husband rather than giving OC access to his father and other siblings. These are choices, kilted, made by the adults.

I don't know sometimes why I continue to bother with MB except that the people here saved my sanity. I cannot believe how often we BW's get villanized for trying to save our families and our own marriages. This is a MARRIAGE BUILDING forum not a save one child at the cost to others site for goodness sake!!

To quote Dr. Harley, the owner of this site:

Nobody is vilifying the betrayed spouse. I�m sorry my posting comes across to you that way. All I was merely saying was I feel sorry for the other child. And somehow this turned into an uproar. And just as the betrayed spouse the family is victimized so is the other child. This will be my last post in this area of this forum as the entire not having contact with the other child makes me angry to no extent. This reminds me of some horrid Maury episode. I deal with adolescents everyday and see a lot of them in these type of situations and they do indeed feel cast aside, forgotten, and unwanted by a parent and the lesson they seem to pick up is one of irresponsibility only has consequences that fall on the other child that is not able to have contact with their other parent. Take it how anyone wants�that is how they feel.

Yes it was my mother that told me this. And when I was in my very late teens and met my father, he relayed the same message to an extent. Long story short is he did later try to get into being part of my life but things didn�t work out that way. It�s a long story that isn�t worth retelling for this purpose. I had a great support group, a loving family, and a wonderful stepfather that came along just before my teenage years. However, I was still very angry at the fact of what happened. Having had friends in the same boat as I was, most shared the same feelings despite having a loving family. Am I angry anymore? No. But I�m older, wiser, and have too much else to worry about than worrying about things that happened when I was a child. I do remember being suspicious of my step father for a long time. I had been abandoned once; I was sure it was going to happen again.

kilted, I am sorry for your experience growing up but put your self intot the shoes of the COM for instance. My DD is 17 now. She knew about the OC for nearly 3 years before she met him. When we finally got visitation she was excited. The reality was he is a stranger. He is so different from my kids. His mother appears to be nil on the discipline front. His behavior and anger were out of control when we first got him. He is a bit better now but DD really wants no part of him most of the time.

Why should she care? To her he is not really her brother. There is so much betrayal, anger and hurt associated with that child. Then her dads attention has to be directed elsewhere when OC is with us. Often times I get the responsibility of taking care of OC as well. I already have a lot on my plate.

Maybe it would have been different if we had V since he was a baby but the fact is the OP on this thread is dealing with a 12 year old child. I cannot imagine how nearly impossible that is! That child is a near stranger and his habits/personality are already set. It has been really hard with a 4 year old so I can imagine the difficulties with a 12 year old!

Kilted_thrower, I am very sorry that you did not have a good relationship with your bio father. I was very hurt when the DNA test proved OC was WS. Imagine finding out WS had you and some OW he barely knew pregnant at the same time and finding this out when COM & OC are 12 years old. Even so I have not asked my WS to have NC with OC, I just do not wish to have contact with OC at this time in my life. I do not blame OC, I realize that OC did not ask to be born. At first I attempted C with OC in an effort to support WS. I met OC and spent time with them on several occasions. OC is rude, disrespectful, and does not get along well with BS or COM. As I stated in an earlier post OC has been to DJJ twice and expelled from school twice. WS really has no idea why all of this occurred because I don't think he really wants to know. He just acts like all of this information is no big deal. Am I wrong to be concerned about who I allow to spend alot of time with COM? I think WS needs to find out who his OC really is before WS tries to force OC into the life of BS & COM. Once again I am not telling WS not to have any contact, just respect BS enough to let me deal with this situation in the way that is best for me.

I can speak to this from experience, since I am in fact on OC. My father was married with 3 children when he had an affair with my mother (the OW) and she became pregnant. So, here's my 2-cents (you get what you pay for).

There is absolutely no perfect way to deal with the situation of an OC. No matter what the decision is regarding C/NC, people will be hurt. Affairs hurt everyone, and affairs involving an OC are even more complicated and painful. That's just a fact, and there's no way to change it.

I saw my father once in a while up until I was 14 years old, mostly because my mother would take me to the nightclub where his band played once a month or so, or he would come over to our house late at night after he finished playing to continue the affair. That's all I knew of my father. I never met his family (I did meet my half-sister when I was 24, but I never knew any of them before that). I was not included in my father's life. I'm pretty sure his wife had no idea he was still seeing me and my mother all those years.

Did I feel left out, rejected, unwanted? Of course I did. Is that sad and unfair? Yes. I don't know how I would have felt if my father and his wife would have decided together to have contact and welcomed me into their home. That didn't happen, but I'm not sure I would have felt anymore connected to that side of my family under the circumstances. I'm sure his BW would have been resentful of my intrusion into their family. I'm sure his kids would have been confused by where I fit into the whole equation. I'm sure it would have been terribly complicated and uncomfortable for everyone involved in the situation. Would that have been any better than having NC at all?

It sucks to be an OC no matter what the adults involved in the situation decide to do. It isn't fair, but it is what it is. There is no good way to deal with this. I think everyone has to do what feels right to them and make the best they possibly can out of a terrible situation. Some families make C work, and some choose NC.

I don't think it's wise at all for a BW or the COM to be forced into C if they aren't comfortable with that. How is that going to benefit the OC, or anyone for that matter?

My childhood was very difficult because of the decisions made by the adults around me. A lot of children could say the same thing. I didn't have a father figure in my life and my mother was far from the perfect parent. I grew up with very twisted morals and a non-existent concept of right and wrong, and because of that, I made a lot of mistakes (see my signature line). But I have learned from those mistakes, and I have the maturity to realize now that I am who I am because of the sum of my life experiences. That isn't to say that I wouldn't have chosen an easier life given the opportunity, but that's not the way the world works. We're all given a hand, and we need to learn to play the hand we are dealt. There are so many things in the world that are unfair, and stomping your feet and pitching a fit and complaining about it will get you nowhere.

Writer1

I guess it's hard to break the cycle. Being an OC was not a positive experience for you, sorry.

If it was that bad of an experience why did you not do everything possible to break the cycle with you?

How did you fall into the trap?

The Road:

There are no excuses. I wasn't thinking straight during my A. I wasn't thinking at all, in fact. The possibility of bringing an OC into the world never even crossed my mind. I was simply acting impulsively and selfishly. My needs were getting met and it felt good, and I never thought it through more than that. There's a very good reason why they call it the fog.

Hindsight is 20/20, but there's no going back. At this point, asking "why, why, why" feel very much like beating a dead horse, and it won't change a thing. I did what I did, and it is what it is, so I have to deal with it and move on.

I will say that my OC is being raised under very different circumstances than my own. She has two parents who love her very much. She has siblings and grandparents and aunts and uncles who love her and accept her as part of the family. I never had any of that. When she is old enough to understand, she will be told the truth and given the opportunity to meet her bio dad if she so chooses. No one ever talked to me about anything. I knew about it all, but it was always hush-hush, don't tell anyone, don't ask questions. My OC will not be raised that way. She will always know that she is loved and wanted.

Not an attack on you writer. I speak in general now. Why do WW, WH, OM, and OW chose to not use birth control?

Not so much question more just wondering aloud.

So if it's not "so much question", you're not hoping for answers, either here or in your thread in SaA?

I think you just want to berate posters like writer1 but do not have the guts to do it directly.