The more you stand up for yourself, the more you STOP allowing his spitful spew to get in, the more he will push and hurt you.

You can't stop him, or control what he does or say. BUT you can take care of yourself and protect yourself. You can block him from facebook, you can do so much.

Protecting yourself and stopping the insanity will help you recover YOU...

My best advice anna, for whatever it is worth, is get to an attorney and file. File first and see what he thinks of that. I think he still thinks you are coming back or he would have dropped it by now. He keeps coming back either so he can feel big by abusing you or because he honestly does not know what he will do without you (maybe because he needs someone to be master over) and maybe he does love you but is just an abusive creep.

I do not mean this for spite, I think it would do the both of you a world of good for you to stand up in the ultimate moment and take the control of the situation. You will feel better about yourself and he will be upset and he deserves to be after what he has put you through.

I have had my share and about 20 others share of abuse in my life but I have to say, your H is probably the most controlling person I have seen.

This is all up to you of course and my advice is probably not good advice but it is what I thought as soon as I read this. You need to be first and best(in his eyes) once in this relationship. It may make him think when he sees the control in your hands and you will feel so much better about yourself, at least I hope so. You do deserve to feel much better about yourself. I don't think he is going to do that for you.

anna - you are married to a monster of a sex addict. That's why he behaves the way he does and treats you so horribly.

MB programs do not work when there is addiction to a behaviour or a substance.

There is nothing you can do to change an addict. They have to hit bottom and decide to change on their own - and they never do unless and until it becomes more painful to be an addict than it is to change.

This might help you understand the nature of addiction a little better:

Three Characteristics of an Addict
(by Mulan, compiled from multiple professional sources)

1) Lies. Addicts lie and lie and lie and lie some more. They lie and they hide things and they keep secrets, and they do this to protect their drug.

2) Escalation. Whether the addiction is chemical (like alcohol or heroin) or behavioural (like gambling or sex), the addict always needs more and more and more of the substance or behaviour over time to get the same high. They are literally burning out the receptors in the brain and it always takes a bigger hit to get a response.

If it's a substance, they need more of it and they need stronger doses. Alcoholics don't just drink a glass of wine at dinner - they progress to heavy doses of Jack Daniels. Heroin users progress to adding cocaine to the heroin to get a "speedball" - incidentally, speedballing is what killed both John Belushi and Chris Farley. And neither of them were speedballing on their first day of drug use.

If it's a behaviour, things get weirder and more extreme. Gamblers start making enourmous bets in order to get that same rush of excitement. Sex addicts need more partners, more porn and more extreme behaviour to get their same rush.

3) Selfishness. Addicts care about absolutely nothing and no one but their drug. They don't care about their spouses or their children or anyone else in their family. They don't even care about themselves, as they will readily destroy themselves if it means keeping their drug for one more minute. Selfishness and complete self-centeredness are the hallmarks of the addict.

Does any of this sound familiar?

Please get help for yourself. You may want to look up a group called "Recovery Nation", which specializes in dealing with sex addicts and their families.

You must protect yourself. You cannot help this man, but you can stop him from destroying you.

Mulan, how do you know for sure he is a sex addict? And not just a jerk and a liar?


I will think about filing first; I think it would be a good thing for me. I'll talk about it with my IC this afternoon.

I don't think he will take any action right away--he told me that I have to find a lawyer for us (he wants to do mediation) and get back to him about it. I know... right?

anna,

Check out what is available for you in your state. Does the fact that he had an affair make any difference? In my state my H could have buried me and dug me up and had sex with me before they would have ever considered anything his fault. See what your laws are. I would not do this for him, in fact I would not do anything for him. This should be for you.

You need to respect yourself and I say this with all the caring I can. I was you in many ways, my H was a bully and did whatever he pleased. He did not engage me to make himself feel good, he used me to cheat on to make himself feel good. If I had had any respect for myself or actually known what was going on (not enough respect for myself to find out) I would have been out of my marriage before I had children and I would not have to sit here wondering what I could have done with the 26 years of my young adulthood that I essentially let get pissed away by a rotten H. How sad to lose that much of your life to a lie. Don't do that, please.

If he won't work on this then there is nothing you can do except put yourself in the best, happiest place you can be.

anna, you already know what to do. You knew it when you posted that first post. Jennifer even told you what to do. Have you been in Plan A all of this time? Because you know that isn't healthy for you.

When I was reading your first post on this thread all I could see was an abused wife. I don't know if it is physical(although the alarm clock thing is scary) but it is most definitely emotional. Your WH is an abuser and most definitely a sex addict. To spend $200-$600 a month on porn is definitely a sex addict.

Here is something I found off of google. There are a lot more. Just google, "Signs you're a sex addict."


Does this sound like your husband? It does to me.

There is a lot to think about but I think the best course for you right now would be to go into a pitch black Plan B. Not just for your marriage but for YOU. You can do this. We will be here to help.

Does the answer to this question matter Anna? Personally, I think he is both. Go back to KA's post and re-read it. You need to stop enabling his bullying and his controlling abuse by cutting him off completely. Get into Plan B and block all means of communication.

Do it yesterday.

I usually just lurk and have no posts, so it's ok if you don't lend me much credibility but as someone who was in an emotionally, verbally, financially, and sexually abusive relationship, I was floored reading your post. It is very triggering to me, he sounds so much like my ex.

Please, please know that this is abuse and it is not ok. Just from what little you have posted, he is vile and manipulative and will likely go out his way to hurt you through the divorce. You are a thing to him, not a person. And though he spouts threats of divorce to manipulate you, he is likely in no hurry to actually file. He wants you in his control, not out of it, and prolonging the divorce process is a great way to do that.

Please do file first and get things started, and I also recommend going completely no contact. I know it's a part of plan B, and it's usually prescribed for trying to fix the marriage, but if I understand it right, it's also supposed to help you with your own recovery. Getting completely away from his hatred by going no contact would be a good start. Freedom is a long hard process sometimes, but it is a very worthy destination.

Finally, if I may, I really recommend Lundy Bancroft's book 'Why Does He Do That?' It's a very insightful book on the dynamics of abusive relationships. (I hope it's not a no-no to post recommendations for other books than the MB ones, I did glance through the rules, so I apologize if I've made a mistake!) It sounds like you have a very good IC. I bet she's heard of it, you might ask her if she thinks you might get anything out of it. I know a lot of women (and men) who have.

Great advice from a newbie, anoni_mouse! You should post more often. What's your story?

Good opening post anoni_mouse! You should post more!

And, it's perfectly ok to recommend books to people. It happens all of the time here.

Thanks for the feedback! I don't want to thread-jack so I'll try and keep it short. I originally actually found this place a few years back through the abuse support forum I still sometimes visit. I started reading here again when a good friend of mine discovered his wife's affair. They are currently legally separated. I did send him here, but he went back and forth on how hard he wanted to try and get the marriage to work. He seems to have called it quits now, but for the future of my own (currently wonderful) relationship, I've found the MB philosophy very insightful so I'm sticking around, reading, and learning

Anna, I think your husband may be a psychopath. Please read what I have posted below and see if it sounds like your husband.

A psychopath will use people for excitement, entertainment, to build their self-esteem and they invariably value people in terms of their material value (e.g. money, property, comfort, etc..). They can involve and get other people into trouble quickly and they seem to have no regret for their actions. To date there is no checklist of behavior and symptoms that will tell you with certainty whether or not a person is a psychopath. But there are warning signs.

Characteristics of a Psychopath
superficial charm
self-centered & self-important
need for stimulation & prone to boredom
deceptive behavior & lying
conning & manipulative
little remorse or guilt
shallow emotional response
callous with a lack of empathy
living off others or predatory attitude
poor self-control
promiscuous sexual behavior
early behavioral problems
lack of realistic long term goals
impulsive lifestyle
irresponsible behavior
blaming others for their actions
short term relationships
juvenile delinquency
breaking parole or probation
varied criminal activity

The idea that psychopaths eat people is a myth. In reality, a person with a psychopathic personality can lead what appears to be an ordinary life. They can have jobs, get married and they can break the law like anyone else. But their jobs and marriages usually don't last and their life is usually on the verge of personal chaos. They are almost always in some kind of trouble or they are not far from it.

A psychopath is usually a subtle manipulator. They do this by playing to the emotions of others. They typically have high verbal intelligence, but they lack what is commonly referred to as "emotional intelligence". There is always a shallow quality to the emotional aspect of their stories. In particular they have difficulty describing how they felt, why they felt that way, or how others may feel and why. In many cases you almost have to explain it to them. Close friends and parents will often end up explaining to the psychopath how they feel and how others feel who have been hurt by him or her. They can do this over and over with no significant change in the person's choices and behavior. They don't understand or appreciate the impact that their behavior has on others. They do appreciate what it means when they are caught breaking rules or the law even though they seem to end up in trouble again. They desperately avoid incarceration and loss of freedom but continue to act as if they can get away with breaking the rules. They don't learn from these consequences. They seem to react with feelings and regret when they are caught. But their regret is not so much for other people as it is for the consequences that their behavior has had on them, their freedom, their resources and their so called "friends." They can be very sad for their self. A psychopath is always in it for their self even when it seems like they are caring for and helping others. The definition of their "friends" are people who support the psychopath and protect them from the consequence of their own antisocial behavior. Shallow friendships, low emotional intelligence, using people, antisocial attitudes and failure to learn from the repeated consequences of their choices and actions help identify the psychopath.

Psychopaths with low intelligence or a poor education seem to end up in jail more than ones with a higher education. The lack of emotional insight is the first good sign you may be involved with a psychopath. The second best sign is a history of criminal behavior in which a person does not seem to learn from their experience, but merely thinks about ways to not get caught.

There is a growing discussion among researchers to suggest there may be a genetic influence that creates a psychopathic personality. The psychopath may lack the ability to physically feel what others identify as the physical sensation of guilt. They can feel fear, anger, sadness in the moment but not guilt for what they did or what they are about to do. Some sociologists believe that a sexually promiscuous psychopath who can live off others is a survivor and may represent one of many genes for survival in the human species. Even more surprising has been the observation that many adult psychopaths do not seem to benefit from support, counseling or therapy and may in fact commit crimes again and sooner because of it. Research using brain scanning technology has revealed that the brain of a psychopath functions and processes information differently. One famous brain imaging study showed that psychopaths can remain calm looking photos of dead bodies in automobile accidents where as other people were clearly upset. They don't use their brain they way others do. This suggests that they may be physically different from normal people.

Please stick to one thread. Let me backup everything that has been said.

You�re in an abusive relationship. My impression is that you�re a woman who has very little self esteem. Well, buck up!

You deserve better than this. Look at how he reacted when YOU took charge and said you had enough. He stopped bullying and started working with you until you went back to your old patterns of letting him bully you.

NEVER beg on your knees again. Not a single person on this planet deserves that. Kneel to God and no one else.

I say that as someone who did so when I was threatened by someone who was manipulative as well.

Feelings will follow your actions. Take the actions. File first, leave this loser, and consider yourself lucky to do so before he hurt you physically. You can do better.

There�s good men out there of all shapes and sizes and temperaments who are massive upgrades over what you have now.

Wow, just wow...

What is easy for others to see, and hard for you to see is the way he pulls you back in and pushes you away. He has learned he can keep hooking you back in by threatening D, and can manipulate you to live with his addiction by making demands. And he can push you away by saying it is your fault and he is not changing.

SA, like so many addictions, is an intimacy problem. He will NEVER be a good H while he has an active addiction. Can you live with that? Not at the rate you are going...you are in survival mode.

You need a break. And no matter WHAT you do, nothing is going to change your M. He is putting the blame on YOU which is a huge lie. If he truly wanted a better M, he would do it... He doesn't. He wants to live in this chaos and addiction.

So what are you going to do? Check and see if you have a Co-Sex Addicts meeting near you, called COSA. Or check into Al-Anon. You will hear some VERY similar stories. Start looking at what healthy behavior is like.

It is hard for you to be a good judge of what is right or wrong in your M because you've been told for so long that a turd smells like a rose... Sorry for the horrible euphemism, but he has you very well trained. He will not leave you, but will try like the dickens to get you back, under his control. why would he want you to leave, he has you trained to beg for the M?

You will NEVER be able to please him. His addiction and behavior has made him a VERY unhappy person and he has looked for everyone and everything to fill it, except himself. And until he starts looking at himself, he is a very dangerous person. Do NOT bring a child into this environment...

How has addiction played a role in you childhood? I'd be willing to bet you have lived with it before.

I consulted with a lawyer about that in April. It makes no difference whether he had an affair, in the eyes of the court. And now that we have been separated for six months (as of late June), it's possible to file for irreconcilable differences, which he can't contest as easily.

My IC said today that she thinks he is going to put up a lot of resistance to getting divorced--basically, that WH getting divorced will be like WH on steroids. I think I just don't care much anymore. It felt good today not to talk to him at all and to just have some peace. Hopefully it keeps feeling like that.


I agree. I am already feeling like I lost my entire 20s. I don't want to waste anymore time... I just want to be happy and have kids with someone who, you know, isn't a jerk.


I think if he actually wanted a divorce, he'd find a lawyer. He wouldn't wait for me to find one for "us." That in itself is kind of ridiculous. I think do think he thinks I'm coming back. But nothing's changed. I've been in Plan A for way too long. I do think it's time for Plan D. And yeah, my IC is great. Maybe it doesn't sound like it, but I have made a lot of progress internally.

Thanks for the book recommendation. I'll check my local B&N for it today or tomorrow. I am a teacher and off for the summer, so I have plenty of time to just read and do whatever I need to do. (Tonight, I am reading up on selecting a lawyer. And also looking at moving companies. It's probably smart to move all my stuff out--furniture and etc., I only took my clothes and things--before filing anything.)



This is all very true.


You know, the really weird thing is that I had a pretty good childhood. My parents are both great people, with no addictions or crazy drama, and they are still happily married after 37 years. They weren't always happy, but they worked through their problems, none of which involved other people. I was unpopular as a little kid--bullied a lot for being different and smart--and my brother died of brain cancer when I was in high school, but I wasn't abused or surrounded by people with poor boundaries. I was kind of the outgoing, leadership type through high school and college. Then I met WH. And, uh.... yeah. I changed, and not for the better.

Thanks everyone.

Anna,

I was in an abusive relationship when I was a teenager and young adult.

My BF would berate me and control me. It ultimately became a physically abusive situation.

I would apologize for HIS beating ME. Yep. I did that. On my knees.

He also gave me last chances to redeem myself. Told me that I was lucky that he was there for me, because nobody else would have me. At the time, I knew that he was right - he had put me in an emotional and mental position to believe this was true.

Then I began to understand that he was wrong, and that he was weak. I broke away from the relationship once, only to return again after he had "changed".

It got worse after that, after a sort of honeymoon phase where he was really good at making me believe he was better. He wasn't. He was just marking time.


I only found the courage to leave the final time after meeting my husband. I met my H on a Wednesday, (I didn't talk to him, just met him very briefly) and knew he was a terrific guy. I thought that this was the kind of man I needed in my life, that this was the kind of person who a woman should be around, that would be a man to have a true relationship with.

True to form, Friday night arrived, and my BF beat me up - again. This time he was vicious, and he beat me in public. The police put me in protective custody, as he took off out of town. I spent the night in the jail. When I called home from the jail to let my family know what happened, my DAD asked me, "What did you do that made him beat you up?" Yeah, that was some support, huh?

Anyway.

The next day, I went over to BF's house. I APOLOGIZED TO HIM FOR THE FACT THAT HE 'HAD' TO BEAT ME UP IN PUBLIC.

Yes, I did that. On my knees.

That was Saturday morning. Later that day, I went home. My brother and SIL were there, with my now-H. We talked all day, all night, and all day Sunday. Somewhere in there, he asked me to marry him. I said YES.

I called my BF on Monday, and told him that I was never going to see him again, that I was breaking up with him.

My BF was stunned. Of course.

He then asked, "Are you breaking up with me because I hit you?"

And I said, "Oddly enough, I SHOULD be. But no. I have found another man. I don't want to see you again."


My BF and I met and talked, several times, and he was like a little child. He was hurt, and tried to explain that he would change.

I was indifferent to him. I had the "love" beaten out of me, torn from me over the years of abuse.

All I had left for him was a grain of pity - because of his brokenness. I had found my own strength in knowing how weak he really was.


And how strong I really was in walking away.

Would I have left had I not found my H? I believe I would have, because the seed of thought had been planted, just in meeting him. I knew that feeling of meeting someone, and getting the feeling that there were relationships out there that did not include abuse, drama, hatred, cycles of rage, and all the rest that I was experiencing. Just meeting my H and hearing him talk with my brother and SIL made me see this.



Anna, you can - and should - divorce this man. Do not waste another day of your life chained to someone who values himself above all else, and who gets that value by stomping on YOUR emotion.

Because the next power play he gets is a physical one. Guaranteed.


SB

Anna,

Your story is heartbreaking. There can be, however, a happy ending to your story if you can find the strength to walk away and never look back. When I was your age, I was just beginning a career I loved. I had another year to go before I met my H and another four years to go before I had my first child.

Don't spend another moment worrying about whether you WH is a sex addict, a psychopath or just an abusive jerk. Don't spend any time thinking about him at all. Put your energy into getting the divorce done quickly and planning what the rest of your life will be like. Travel, reconnect with friends, move, go back to school, change your hair color, learn a new language, give your time to a good cause . . . A whole world of possibilities is there for you.

You mentioned moving your furniture and other things out of your house. If you do, please be safe. Check with a lawyer and the police to see what your options are.

Bea

Wow. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.

I am not worried that things will become physical--after 10 years and the level of frustration he has experienced already, I think it would have already.

But I am planning on moving on.

He is posting things to his Twitter account. Things like "Time to make a drastic change" and how he's "done with inconsideration," etc. I am wondering if he is posting them to send me a "message" without actually contacting me... essentially, whether it's intended for me or whether it's not intended for me specifically, but just what he's really feeling. I am quite surprised. Usually he never shares anything personal with anyone... he is a very intensely private person. (His family does not even know that we have been separated for seven months.) I suppose no one he really knows follows his Twitter account, for the most part.

I think I am going to just stop using Twitter. I only signed up for it anyway to follow his account, and I guess I shouldn't be doing that anymore.

It only takes one time for it to become physical, and it could end badly.

You should stop using Twitter. It is just making you question things further. Hope on the Plan B bandwagon and take it to the next stop.

You CAN and SHOULD go into PLan B ASAP.

Now that you have made that decision, can I recommend that you go dark? Change your cell no, email, get an intermediary, and STOP looking at his FB or Twitter. This will help you in moving forward and focusing on your personal recovery...


ETA: oops, posted this and then saw Scotty posted something similar!