I found out last night that my husband did something really stupid. He's been out of state for the past 3 months for training, and the weekend before last he went out with some of the guys, and a few girls, to a strip club (there's not a whole lot of anything to do where they are). I usually have no problems with him going to a strip club, we have gone to a few together and I'm seriously fine with it. But this time I had a bad feeling about it. It turns out that after the strip club, and getting extremely drunk, they all went to a hotel room to drink some more. Where they are and what they are training for this type of activity is already illegal, so they all got in trouble for that, but it gets worse. Some how an orgy got started. I only wish that were an exaggeration. He hasn't given me very many details because he is so ashamed of himself. He was too drunk to be able to remember how things got started, and he doesn't understand why he did it. He was involved, briefly, with one of the girls (there were 2). After a little while he realized he was doing something stupid and that he could lose me because of it, so he stopped. He was waiting to tell me until I get to see him in person again (not for another 2 weeks) but because they all got in trouble for the "hotel party", and he's in more trouble because of what happened at the hotel and the fact that he's married, he had to tell me because I could be contacted because of it. Of course he'd rather it come from him than some stranger on the phone asking me if I knew about what happened and if I'm going to divorce my husband over it, which would make it more likely that he'll get kicked out because of what happened (they don't want people being distracted by turmoil in their personal relationships) but of course he's already at risk of getting kicked out because he messed up. Now I should say that my husband has some "sexual issues" that he has struggled with for the entire time we've been together, but he's been really good at hiding it. I've found a few things in the past that have caused arguments, things that go beyond that occasional adult movie (which I am fine with to a certain extent) like nude a topless picture of his ex-girlfriend (taken by a friend, not him...long story). That time I almost left him because I felt betrayed, so now I can't even begin to explain how hurt and disappointed I am. However, I know this entire thing happened because he has an issue with sex and he was drunk, he didn't do it intentionally because he's unhappy with our relationship, he was just ridiculously stupid and he needs help. I know a lot of people will think "oh like Tiger Woods and Jesse James" but really he has legitimate issues that are related to his bizarre family and the environment he was raised in. They felt that it was "ok" to date multiple people at the same time and his parents are now swingers (although they are very discreet about it so we didn't know about it until a few years ago), so for him having multiple partners is "normal" but the fact that it was without my knowledge or consent is not. It was cheating, plain and simple, and he knows that, but because of his strange beliefs he didn't have the self control to prevent this from happening. Hence the needing help. So really I don't know what to do. I don't want to leave him, my husband is everything to me, he is my world. He said the same thing about me when he told me what happened and I know he would be crushed if I left him. It sounds to me like if I were to leave him it would put him in a really bad place where suicide would become an option. I'm still on the fence as to what to do, I can't see how we can fix this, but I don't want to give up really. When we can I think we will try going to a marriage counselor to see if we can work on fixing this, but I won't see him for 2 weeks, so for right now I'm really struggling with this. I need advice on how to go about working on this with him, especially during our separation right now when we can only talk over the phone or on webcam. Does anyone know anything about the sex addiction treatment programs or even just have an opinion on the drunk stupidity part of this? I'm in a different situation since this wasn't a prolonged affair, he wasn't "in love with" or even attracted to this person before it happened...it just did, because everyone was drunk and he had no self control. So I'm having a hard time finding information or help on how to deal with this. Any constructive advice would be most appreciated.

**edit**

Ditto!!!

I'm 25 and I'm serious. I am absolutely crushed and was hoping for some real advice not rude criticism. If that's how you answer posts for advice then you shouldn't bother answering.

Keep it respectful and try to help this poster!

DIVORCE!!!!!!!!! If this is even true, this guy is messed up. You're 25? Get out now, RUN..........A MILE

Hi Revera, and I agree my post was insulting.

On the other hand noname, what are you really looking for here. I have been married for 41 years. My wife and I or neither of us have gone to a strip club. How do you two think that could ever enhance your marriage. Marriage is an exclusive relationship, and for your information the only time in that relationship that the two people would ever want to see another person partly or mostly undressed is Within the marriage. Period.

So, that being said, what are you attempting to accomplish here. I hear no emotion on you part.

Regards, Tom

nonamepixie,

My first job out of college was with an elite consulting firm, and our first three weeks were at a training facility where a married manager showed me -- a naive college graduate who didn't appreciate that married men had affairs -- his room and told me he wanted me to work on his assignment. I darn near didn't get out of there without some very regretable memories.

The reason why I am telling you this is that your husband was in a situation that was bound to lead to trouble, and it starts with drink. At minimum, ask him not to drink again unless he is with you.

As Tom said above, you might want to look at what you find acceptable. I heard of a Jewish saying that is something like "put a fence around the law", and that saying appeals to me. You don't want to go right to the edge of violating a law because you could well go right over the edge. The decisions your husband made -- to have a job with a three month assignment out of town, to drink, to go to a strip club... these were all circumstances under his control. He got in so deep that he didn't manage to get out before he had a real problem on his hand.

Work with him on not getting into the circumstances in the first place. Harley calls it "extraordinary precautions." He sounds highly motivated to change. It may surprise him that you'll start by asking him not to drink except in your presence.

Cherished

PS. Nothing in what you wrote gives me the idea that he has any sort of issue with sex that is anything out of the norm for a man.

How long have you been married?

Have you any kids? (you can list them as DD2 for dedicated daughter 2 years old)

Did he date other people while you were engaged?

Is this the first time something like this has happened, or you have ever suspected anything?

Being raised in a household where open relationships is common and adultery is the norm can in fact lead the children of the household to treat marriage the same way their parents did. More than likely your WH may not ever respect marriage the same way you do, and this is very troubling to me. It will always be a conflict of ideals for the rest of your marriage unless one of you changes, and change is very tough. Change must be done in the daily thoughts and habits and no one change change another person, you can only change yourself. I'm very hesitant giving advice on this one.

Thank you Revera.

Tom, I'm surprised you think there was no emotion in my post. Maybe that's just because I was trying to keep it short (didn't work so well) and also trying to keep from totally breaking down. I'm living with my parents (my husband and I moved in over a year ago after several layoffs made it impossible to live on our own) and I don't want them to know what's going on. This is not something I really want to share with anyone, hence going to an anonymous forum. It seems lame, but I don't know what else to do. I've been emotionally numb today for the most part, I didn't want my emotions interfering with my job today. This is my last week there and so I can't take time off to deal with this. So I'm forcing everything down below, ya know? Besides, how much would it really help my situation to be an emotional wreck and scream and cry to you about what I'm dealing with?

As for what I want... Really I want for this to never have happened, but I don't have that option now. I want to move on with things, but I'm not sure if I should move on with or without him. I can't see my life without my husband. We've literally grown up together and he's always been there for me, he's my everything. So finding out that this happened is heartbreaking. I don't want to be the wife of a cheater, but I don't want to give up either. This isn't like him, not really. Yes, he has his issues, and I don't really want to get into that in anymore detail than I did in my original post because it's something extremely personal, and it's also uncomfortable to discuss. I just wanted to give some background, so maybe whoever reads my post can understand that there is an underlying sexual/behavioral problem that came out with the alcohol to cause this. If it weren't for the drinking I don't believe this would have ever happened.

That all being said...I don't know how to move on. I don't know where to begin to try to fix this, especially since he's still out of state until the beginning of next month. If he doesn't get kicked out then I'm supposed to go visit for his graduation in two weeks, then we'd come home and have to move out of state a week later. There's a lot going on so having to deal with this on top of everything is just overwhelming. I don't know what to do, I don't know what to say, I don't know who to turn to. Plus with his training our schedules don't match up at all, I literally have to stay up until 1 am to be able to talk to him at all, otherwise I have to try to sneak text messages to him while I'm at work. So we pretty much don't have any time to discuss any of this to try to figure out what's going to happen next or how we're going to try to fix this. At this point I don't think divorce is an option, I don't want that, and I wouldn't know what to do if I left him. He is my life, I don't think I can live without him.

As for the strippers... I guess I'm even a little relaxed about things like that. But I know I've also been to indulgent in his behavior. That will be something I will have to work on. Before this all happened, I had tried to be strict with that kind of thing. I tried to keep him from doing that or looking at adult videos/etc. It made things worse. So I thought if I tried to be more accepting, more open, but also try to bring him to me instead of closing myself off to him that it would help. In a way it did. Our relationship got stronger, we enjoyed each other more emotionally as well as romantically. I had thought it was helping him to leave behind his "addiction" and to come back to me. Apparently he was just getting better at hiding things from me. And now this.... He has taken a big step by getting rid of any adult material he had on his laptop with him at training, and is vowing to get rid of all of it once he gets back home. It may not seem like anything major, but it is. It's a huge commitment for him, and I've never seen him so disgusted with himself. So I think he might have finally realized how wrong it was that he had taken it so far, and he feels like he was pulling me into it, dragging me down with him. He was extremely upset when he said that.

Seeing him so...heartbroken, over what he did to himself, and to me, was very painful for me. I felt bad for him. But I also felt so angry because he brought this on himself. He really messed things up, and could have ruined a lot more than just our marriage with his actions. His career, reputation and our future together (not just relationship wise but financial well-being) are now on the line. I know he's carrying a lot of guilt, so I'm trying not to be overly harsh on him because I don't want him doing anything stupid, but it's hard. I hate him for what he did, but I also still love him. I want to work things out but I can't see how we can get past this. More because what he did was just so ridiculously stupid. I had told him that night, when he told me where he was, before things went wrong, that I was upset with him. First time ever I've been truly upset with him for going to a strip club. I had a horrible feeling about it, I knew something was wrong or would go wrong. I was hoping he'd respect that and stop drinking and leave. Call a cab or something if need be. But he didn't. So I'm angry that he didn't respect that I was upset, that he didn't listen to me. But I'm also angry at myself for not being more straight forward and forceful. I'm angry I didn't say "You need to leave, NOW." I had the right to I know it, but I was being too lenient with him. Now I don't know what to do.

Where do we go from here? What should be our first step if we want to try to work this out? Is there a time when I might "know" that it's not going to work out and I need to get out before it tears me apart or how do you know? Mainly, how do we start trying to fix this while he's still away, when we have limited contact? Next week once I'm done at my job we'll be able to talk during the day, but until then I have to deal with this gnawing at my insides while I'm at work. I don't know how I'm going to get through the rest of the work week.

Sorry I missed this one writing my reply to Tom. We have been married two years this June, have been together for over 6 and have known each other since we were 5. We weren't super close during grade school but "went out" in middle school. Really we just would watch movies together over the summer, never even kissed, to his disappointment. We don't have children but were about to start trying for our first before this happened. Obviously that is going to be put on the back burner as we need to get our marriage straightened out before we bring children into the equation. He did not date anyone while we were engaged. Before he proposed our relationship was a little rocky. He was afraid to commit, I suppose partly because the strange relationship beliefs growing up but also because a previous girlfriend he had given a promise ring to had cheated on him. He was devastated. So it's that much more frustrating that now he's gone and done the same thing...even if unintentionally. We took a few "breaks" when we first started dating, even tried having an "open" relationship which only lasted about a day. I just couldn't stand the thought of him doing anything with anyone else while we were supposed to be together. That went on for about 2 years. Then he finally realized that he was putting our relationship in jeopardy, that I was the one he wanted to spend the rest of his life with so he shouldn't want to date other girls. I know he was faithful the entire time we were exclusive and I know he didn't sleep with anyone after we first started dating, not even when we were broken up and he was free to. He's really rather conservative about that, since he's been hurt by it before. Or he used to be at least.

I think in a way he idealizes his parents relationship, how they're swingers. He admitted to me last night he wanted to be like them. But after what he did the idea sickens him now. He's so ashamed of what he did, I don't think he wants any of the things he used to want. He says that he wants me and only me, that he wants to change and to make things better, that he wants to be there for me more than he has in the past. I believe him, I can see how much this is tearing him apart, but it's hard for me to trust him after everything's that happened. I'm afraid something like this could happen again.

Please don't. You've had a lucky escape. Find someone else

Perhaps a good first step would for him to attend AA while he is finishing training. Order how to survive an affair. If you want to stay togather put togather a list of conditions for reconcilation. IC for him, MC for both. Calling the Harley's.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure what IC or MC means, or what you mean by "calling the Harley's". Is there a link somewhere for the abbreviations/alliterations that people use here?

I can only imagine the conflict you are going through.

You make it sound like it were a one night stand based off peer pressure and booze. That you two were together for years and years and nothing like this has ever happened before.

Then there is this little twist of how he idealizes his swinger parents, that you tried an open relationship but it didn't work for you, and he is addicted to porn to the point that it effects his marriage and I would expect work.

My quick knee jerk judgment is to say this guy is a huge project that may never come out the way you hope it will. Do you want to spend your youth trying to fix something that is broken, or do you want something that was never broken in the first place with nothing to fix?

I'm so sorry you are here. Its getting late, tomorrow more people will be on ready to help, and well rested. In the meantime read up on the basics, read some articles, read some threads, read, read, read.

Yeah we get carried away with acronyms here. I like the acronym in an acronym. Here is a link to a quick acronym guide.
Acronyms

nomane, read everything on this site.

Drinking is no excuse to cheat. We are grownups and have choices. Most of your post was making excuses for him.

It is good you do not have children.
It will take much work to get this M on track.
No more strip clubs
No more porn
Have you husband be tested for STD.

That is a start.

Wheels spinning...it's kind of complicated, which I'm sure you have noticed, so it's hard to really explain everything and make sense. The drunken cheating wasn't even really a one night stand, it was started but never finished, I think he left. I definitely think it had a lot to do with peer pressure, he was around some very shady characters who have no respect for relationships. A bunch of guys looking to get laid really. And there were large amounts of alcohol involved. I honestly don't think it would have ever happened otherwise.

For the most part he's hidden his issues and the fact that he wants to be like his parents, it has come up in the past but only once or twice (once being when I found the picture I mentioned) and it's always "I'm working on it and I don't want to talk about it". He's too ashamed by it to want to discuss it, although we did discuss it at length after the picture. Otherwise the only other clues, that I overlooked at the time, was that I've known he's interested in having a threesome, seems like it's a lot of guys dreams to do this so I didn't think much of it, but he knows I'm not ok with it and that it won't ever happen. So he's never pushed it. Since all of this has happened he's told me he's ashamed of feeling that way though. Like I said in a previous post, he's now saying he doesn't ever want anyone else, not separately or involved with both of us. Just me, period. And while, yes, he had been interested in this sort of thing, he would have never done something with anyone behind my back.

I'm not sure if he really can change, since he's said in the past that he was trying to work on his problem. But he also never wanted to "get help" for it. This time he wants to get help, he wants to go to a therapist that specializes in this sort of thing. I'm hoping he's serious and that he'll go and it'll help. I had really thought he was getting better on his own though, that after the last time it came up, almost two years ago, he had finally snapped out of it. It took a while for things to get back to normal but after they did things were wonderful. And they had been getting even better, because of some exciting changes in our life coming up, until this all happened. So this is just totally devastating.

I hope that explained things a little better. I didn't really want to get that into detail about certain things but if it will help people understand what's going on then I guess I'll share it.

I agree with everything you said. I'm really not meaning to make excuses, but I guess it is sounding that way. I told him straight out that the alcohol wasn't an excuse, but I do feel that if it weren't for that and who he was hanging out with that this would have never happened. It's not an excuse, because he still had the choice to make at that point and he made the wrong choice, but those factors were the reasons that he had to make that choice in the first place.

I already told him to get tested. The good thing is he did use a condom, I'm assuming the girl supplied it because I guess she's a trouble maker and has been in trouble before (why he was hanging out with people like that, I don't know), so hopefully that was enough that he didn't contract anything from her.

Please read what you are writing. As long as he knows you will be making excuses for his behavior he will continue doing this.

What if he passes this training then he will continue working with these people. Maybe this is not the best job for him.

Every wayward has issues. So his parents were swingers does not mean that it is genetic.

I would call his job and expose this.