Phoenix,
trying to rationalize his state of mind does not work.
Yes, from your point of view he had it all and yet HE is unhappy and went and had an A and now he is acting like a teen (they all seem to regress into that stage!)
You H is exhibiting the cookie cutter wayward behaviour and you are still trying to make sense of it all.
I wish there was a quick way for you to kick him out.
Can you change the locks when he comes back from the camping trip and have him find a suitcase with his bare necessities on the doorstep?
blessing

I'm not tryig to ratioalize what he did, I'm just saying it is a shame to have it all and throw it away for nothing. There is no way you can rationalize what he did. He did what he did for selfish reasons and now has to live with what he has done for the rest of his life. Luckily, I don't. I know him better than he knows himself especially since he has opened up completely in the last 6 months. The guilt will eat him up and he will continue to spiral down in the bottom of a bottle. He will eventually be alone, even his buddies will eventually avoid. I guess that will be karma paying him back. I know that he is hurting right now and that in turn makes him mad, but that is something he has to live with. I care but don't care at the same time. I know that he thought if we could be friends and I continued to be his best friend then his guilt would be alleviated and he could still keep me in a way. But I showed him that was not to be. As I told him 6 months ago, it is all or nothing.

Still hoping and praying.

My Mom was a looker, very social, still goes aut dancing and is pretty healthy for 83. She was engaged to a guy when she was i7 but times were to tough for her family cuz her Mom died and she took over her role. Then at 30 she met my father and married to quickly but made the best of it.

The only Man she ever slept with was my Dad, even though she too was constantly propositioned to before, during, and after her marriage.

Sex is wonderful in its right place, but it has its place. People don't belieive in self control so they try to change the rules about it and they even make relationships all about it instead of just a part of them.

As i was writing this two cats were going at it at my house. They are both fixed and well taken care of, got thier shots, eat the right food, etc. The Male is the offspring of the female, go figure. Are people acting like animals? Methinks they would rather not think at all and are willing to use anybody for that ten minutes of physical pleasure and try to reason away how theres more to it than the act.

Granted there is birth control, abortions, and the opinion that sex can be had with no negative consequences having to be bore by the participants. Most consider it a right and call it "adult" activity.

You have to use your brain cells to understand thier are consequences to not controlling your natural human urges, Just like its important to control them when someone cuts you off on the thruway when they are afraid of being chewed out by the boss for being late at work and aren't controlling thiers.

In the end we will have to live with our consequences of our decisions as deep as we are willing to admit they exist, and the bulk of the world wants to get thier share at the expense of others. Take pride that its lonly at the top.

Oh yeah, having sex when you are ready to have a child when you are married, or just to enjoy and be close to one you love, is very healthy and normal in my opinion, but it is not the means to build a relationship. its the reward. But thats my opinion, some people require it, but to me it takes all the freedom out of it, which makes it a law that means people can find a way around keeping it, and it becomes a form of bondage.

Your doin great Traci IMO. I wish you could get him away from you somehow so he might change but it seems its impossible for you to go into a plan B.

Your anger is understandable but is it possible for him to straigthen out? Is it possible for him win you back? I don't see him changing unless you can get him away from you and this is tearing you up.

CP, I am not angry, just tired, disappointed, and at this point I don't care any more. Is it possible that he can win me back? I don't know, it depends on what he does and if I think he is sincere.

Still hoping and praying.

Traci -- You are coping well. I totally understand since my circumstances are similar. But in my situation, WH made one final decision, chose the OW, and walked out of our lives. And he turned on the "angry" faucet -- so any contact is a battle with him blaming ME for spending money unnecessarily on attorney fees and for not having a full time job and for turning the world against him.

Go figure.

And I too say "what a waste" of a 30 year relationship and a wonderful life. He had it made -- a wife who would do anything for him, kids who adored him (which is pretty hard with teenagers these days), a great job, no debt, family support -- THE LIFE.

But it wasn't good enough for Mr. I Want To Be A Rockstar. Actually, that was one of his favorite songs. He really did want the keys to the Playboy mansion. Guess that's the fantasy for a 48 year old midlife crisis guy.

And like you, I really was a great wife. He agreed wholeheartedly. But he chose Bimbo.

I questioned what was wrong with me for a long time. She's been around the block which I hadn't. WH and I grew up together. We were wild and crazy together. Now he wants to go back in time without me? Not fair!!

This just shows you that what you are going through -- how you feel -- I'm doing the exact same darn thing.

Him leaving took off a lot of the pressure -- I realize that now. I didn't have to try to talk with him -- or do for him -- especially knowing that Bimbo was doing all under her power to take him away and convince him he was entitled to be happy. We're entitled to be happy too. That means YOU, Traci.

Step away from the drama. Look at your situation from the outside looking in -- which is hard -- because this is one of those situations where it's hard not to take it personally. Because it IS personal. You just have to act like it's not.

You did a valiant job trying to convince him that he's on a bad path. He's headed for a cliff. He doesn't see it... probably won't until he falls off.

I still hope and pray, too. Let God handle it. He's quite capable of performing miracles. Have you read the book "The Shack"? Interesting reading when you are going through what we are right now. I learned to pray to the Holy Spirit more.

Sorry for the ramble and I apologize if I talked too much about me or repeated stuff I said to you before. I just wish our Hs would wake up and see what catches we are -- have always been. How we got them to where they are today. Well, not today -- the drama, the anger, the self-destruction -- that was caused by their involvement with OW. Really -- An A is the stupidest thing they could have ever done to someone like us. And guess what? We can't fix this one unless they WANT to fix it.

I DO hope karma hits them some day. Not necessarily for revenge -- but to make them a better person. So they realize there were real consequences for what THEY chose to do to their family. That this wasn't just part of life. This wasn't unavoidable. That THEY willfully and thoughtfully and purposefully CHOOSE to destroy us.

And if your WH is sulking around and making you feel miserable, he needs to leave. He should be kissing your feet for letting him stay right now and for continuing to offer your love and support and forgiveness. Instead he's feeling sorry for HIMSELF for missing OW. PLEAZZZZZE. You don't need to deal with THAT everyday.

Stay strong, girlie!!

Great Post HH.

Thanks,HH,for all your support. And no you don't ramble, everything you said makes sense.

H left around 12:30 today to go camping and he took avery large bottle of rum that he bought last night. Looks like he is going to hide in a bottle again. He is so stupid, the only person he is hurting is himself.

H keeps telling me he has no contact with OW in over 6 months even when I tell him that since he is leaving me he might as well tell me the truth. He says that he has no plans to be with her or give her any power over him. He gets mad when I tell him that I don't believe him and Bunderstands that and he wouldn't believe him either. But that he isn't having any contact with her. It doesn't matter any more. Even if he is seeing her it won't last.

I am gooing to continue with my life without him and continue going out with my friends. I am going to continue ignoring him the best that I can. If nothing else, it ticks him off.

Been figuring up my budget for the rest of the year and I'll be just fine. As a matter of fact if things go as I plan I will be able to save a nice chunk of money.

Still hoping and praying.

Hey, HH, you should read my journal. It is actually one very large ramble. I just ramble on everyday to my H in it and there is no rhyme or reason to it. Lol.

Had a great day at work and even got to go home early because the census went down a little. I feel great.

H is still not back yet from his trip to the river. H left yesterday with a large bottle of rum. Which means he got s--t faced last night. He is probably floating down the river today and getting drunk again. He isn't very smart. You can't hide from what you have done or run from it because it is always there and you have to face it sooner or later. But this is H problem not mine. I'm doing fine, he isn't.

Still hoping and praying.

are you going to Alanon?

Well, I was right, H never came home last night. Don't care any more. I know he did it to hurt me or to make me mad. He didn't succeed.

Still hoping and praying.

His pain has nothing to do with you. It is his journey. He is obviously going thru a lot of pain and there is a plan out there for him. Hopefully he will learn from it.
DO not take what he does personally. He has a serious drinking problem and you are ok living with him so you are also in need of help.
I do not want to be harsh or critical of you. But look at your situation,IMO, you can no longer go on this way.
blessing

This is for you not him. Have you checked any meetings out. You are living with an alcoholic and you cannot save him -- only yourself while he is going through this addiction to both the booze and OW.

Please you all, Phoenix, IMO , needs to be told to kick her WH out of the house.
How can she live in those conditions. Can't you see how much she obsesses about him? She can't plan B him nor plan A him-
She can only suffer like a dog.
It is time she puts a stop to this. If he has no place to go...well once has to live with the consequences of his actions. I am sure he can afford a youth hostel or a very cheap motel, or rent a room
blessing

I am D from my WH. He has not lived in our house since 10/08. I have been attending Alanon regularly since then.

The program is for me not for him. It affects the whole family and it helps me deal with my family in helping them.

I agree that WH needs to get out. He can go to a treatment center, he could move in with a friend or rent a room.

As long as Traci allows him to stay there; no changes will happen. She is not doing either of them any favors.

You cannot be in Plan B while being in the same house.

12 step programs are wonderful spiritual paths. They are hard and I have never had the courage to do the 12 steps.
IMO all of us regardless of our addictions should go thru the 12 steps. But look who is talking, me, who does not even have the couraga to approach it.
blessing

Ok everyone. I know you mean well but if I could kick him out he would be gone. But legally, he is on the house and I cannot make him leave. I see very little of him as it is. And I do this on purpose.

H's road to alcoholism is his own fault not mine and I can't help it if he is handling his problems and guilt through alcohol. At this point I am doing fine. I just don't care at this point. Let him destroy himself. He deserves it. I hope that doesn't sound too itchy.

But you do care, of course you do. ANd saying those things are only an attack against yourself and your integrity. He has none left and your resentment towards him are going to turn you into an angry person. He does not deserve to see your good qualities clouded by the results of his actions.
Your situation is difficult, I agree, but you could move out then. Could you?
Blessing

No I cannot move out. I pay for the house. I can't make a house payment and pay rent on another place. If I could I would have left already. Right now I am indifferent to him and his situation which is actually worse than being mad.