Rizos, I would not even CONSIDER engaging in IB right now. That is what has worn your H down to a state of hopelessness. That would be like throwing gasoline on the fire.

Get this resolved before you move forward, Rizos!

Melodylane,

That's what I'm trying to do. To see if HE can Get it! School in PR starts in 2 WEEKS, and public schools in PR are not good. I'm only going crazy, because we don't have time to play games right now.

I don't know what to do... I might just cancel everything and the hell with everything. At some point I have to start thinking about my daughters. He is a grown up, and my DD's need me NOW...

Crazyness...

That is not for you to decide independantly. It is for the two of you to decide together. If he wants to back out of the move, then by all means, stop the move until you can enthusiastically agree on something. Now it is your turn to plan A and win him back. It will be much easier to plan A ElC since there is no affair partner pulling at him. You need to PROVE to him that you can change your behavior and your IBs are a thing of the past. This can't be done immediately, but rather over time.

Rizos, this kind of thinking drives ME crazy! Your HUSBAND needs you now the most. Your DD's need you to do everything in your power to help him through this terrible time and save your marriage. Telling him to "grow up" [ie: go to hell] is cruel and callous.

He has lost so much, and you cannot afford to dismiss his pain if you want to save this.

Yes, he is a grown up. A VERY WOUNDED grown up who has lost so much BECAUSE OF YOUR ACTIONS. Lets take some accountability here and remember WHY he is in this sad state.

Screw your plans, go help your husband.

Another question! I'm just trying to get my head straight!!

If ElC is depressed now(which he is), should I take in consideration his opinion? For him, everything is DARK,no options right now.I mean, isn't it like when someone is depressed and want to kill himself! Will you ask the person to get help, or would YOU make the call?

Please, tell me. I'll call everything off, and move on, if that what you suggest is best. You are the PROS on MB.

My friend, I see someone who is looking for rationalizations to pursue her OWN AGENDA and ignore her husband again. Not a good plan!

He is depressed BECAUSE you have not considered his opinion and because you have not shown him much empathy. He sees no future because of that.

So I ask you, Rizos, does it look like it would be wise to continue to ignore his opinion and selfishly move forward with your plans?

What can you do to give him hope? Frankly, Rizos, when I read your posts I do not see much here that would give him hope. When he asked for a divorce, your first response was to agree and tell him to buzz off. Not very empathetic at all.

Rizos, if you want to save your marriage, then I would put aside your temper and your selfish interests and show him that you are concerned about him MORE than your agenda. He has said he is sick of the IB and lack of empathy. <----that has to be addressed.

Rizos

You say your out of the fog but your actions and posting tell a different story, it's almost like you want to gloss over your actions that lead to this point.

ElC has lost everything that he has worked hard for because of your and his best friend actions, yet he has to man up and deal with this, by himself because you seem to think your the victim in this mess.

He loss his business, his friends lost there jobs, he had to deal with the OM on a daily, then on top of that threats with legal action from the OM to top it off, then for some reason you seem to think that he should be Plan A-ing you in this mess that you made with out any help from you, he had no soft place to fall to, and now that he had hit concrete, it still all about you and wanting him to be your soft place to fall to.

Big deal! Your girls are 5 and 7. They aren't going to miss much in school at that age. Buy yourself a phonics book and teach your girls to read. They'll be ahead of everyone else when they go back to school.

Work on your M. B/c remaining an intact family is FAR more important to your girls than missing a bit of school.

Ok then, staying in PR it is. If that's what he wants. Thanks... I will let him, pick up a new school in PR for them, and do whatever he needs to.

Me, I have to admit that I'm kind of happy that we are staying in PR. It's true, it was selfish to try to do what I want it.

Go take care of your husband! Your H is bleeding to death and you are worried about school. The marriage of their PARENTS is more important than anything.

Changing your attitude to make your H want to stay with you is your first order of business, Rizos.

I've already started to cancel moving plans(well we have to pay again to get our stuff back). I'm calling the lanlord lady to see if we can cancel the contract.

DD's are going to stay at the same school that they were in PR, and me I'm going back to school.

That's all for now... He doesn't want to even look at me, I'm fine with that. I'll do whatever he wants in relation to our DD's, and stay cool. If he wants to come back, perfect, if not I'll move on. I can not order him to come back to me... That's his choice.

Thanks for your support and help again.

You know, Rizos, it is this kind of attitude that has killed your marriage. Instead of being concerned about your H and saving your marriage, you just flick him off like it is nothing.

No wonder he doesn't see anything worth saving here. Can you blame him?

He has lost his career, lost his marriage, watched his friends get fired. And for WHAT?? A woman that then says "you don't like it, then lump it!" How could he possibly be interested in such a deal?

When a betrayed spouse goes through recovery, they hit a wall around the 9-12 month timeline where they ask themselves if the hell of recovery was worth it. That question is answered when they look at the attitude of their spouse and the state of their marriage. What do you think ElCamino thinks when he looks at his ungrateful, entitled, selfish, UNempathetic wife? He has lost so much and this is his REWARD?

Rizos, if this marriage collapses it will because of your attitude and not because of ElCamino. Keep that in mind while you are focusing on your AGENDA instead of your crumbling marriage. What you are doing is making this WORSE.

Rizos - there is NO empathy in this statement. There is no care, no love, and no protection for your victim. None.

If this is the attitude he has had to face day in and day out - it is no wonder he is at the end of his rope.

Your solution, as outlined here is MORE IB. Just with a twist to kind-of give him what he wants. Throwing him a bone, but you're still going to do it on your own terms, in your own way.

I get you Rizos. I do. You're like my grandmother, my MIL, you're like me. Our attitude is 'git er done. Make a plan - do it. No plan? I'll come up with one. Then just full steam ahead, get out of my way.

No.

Stop.

Breath.

Wait.

LISTEN to your husband. Don't go into fix it mode. Don't try to make a plan. Just listen.

Rizos, given that you have said you are willing to do what it takes to save the M, I am shocked at the things you are posting... You know that there is a good chance ElC is reading this, right? Go back and read thru this thread from ElC's perspective. Honestly, would what you have posted be encouraging to you if you were him?

You say that you are a "giver" and Plan A will be easy for you. Step up to the plate and start giving. Because I see a lot of talk but all your actions say "taker".

Stop complaining and feeling sorry for yourself. All of your actions and words should be done with ElC in mind, especially with thought to how injured he is. You do all this with the expectation of getting nothing in return from him.

Think think think before you act and don't do what feels naturally. Plan A ISN'T going to be easy for you because you are a "giver"...infact I think it's going to be the opposite for you.

That's odd, I think you mentioned something about concern over custody being jeopardized. Why would you be concerned with that if your plan, should he choose to divorce is to allow him to have the children?

There is nothing to talk about with an attorney if your plan is to tell your husband, you take the kids, you don't deserve to have them taken from you if you choose to divorce.

So help me understand why you would be talking about custody if you don't plan to take the children from him should he pursue the divorce?

This is what I was talking about. If you are not planning to take his children, why are you even talking to a lawyer about YOUR losing custody? It should be a done deal, Rizzos is the primary custodian, and you'll go along with whatever parenting plan he wants.

What is there to discuss with a lawyer?

You come across still foggy if you are thinking about being the primary custodian should a divorce action become final. Those who understand the damage they've done don't seek to make their betrayed spouse a visitor to their own children.

Rizzo,

Ya know, this could be so simple. You simply reach out and gently take his hand and lead him to where he will be safe and loved. It really is that simple and yet you are unwilling to do it. Why?

JL

PS: Where that loving and safe place is on the planet is not nearly as important as that there is one. It could be PR or it could be VA. You choose and lead him and then make sure he is safe and loved.

Rizos,

What is "best" for you in a divorce is not "best" for your marriage, nor is it "best" for your husband. Instead of focusing on what is BEST for you, try looking at what is BEST for your marriage for a while.If you can pull it off, what you will find is that what is BEST for your marriage will end up being what is actually BEST for you in the long term.

What can you offer EC to remain married to you? Why do you want to remain married to him? Why should he spend even one more day let alone the rest of his life with you? What will make the next 20 years so great that he will forget about the last year couple of years? These are the things that need to be your focus if you hope to save your marriage to this man.

Mark

Mark,

Thanks for your help. I think that ElC made up his mind already. I have to respect that.

I've decided to avoid making any decisions. I'll let him pick the new girls school, etc. I also won't do anything about the already rented house in VA, I will just wait, and do whatever he desires.

I call him, so that he could take DD's with him again, but I didn't say anything to him. I will shut my mouth for a awhile, and let him drive.

We'll see...