Well, an update. Just got off phone with WH. After the initial 4 days of I'm sorry's and begging for another chance, he got quiet. I began to feel like he was confused still. Not clear on what he wanted, her, me, or neither. Tonight he said If I wanted a life with her now is the perfect chance b/c he's destroyed our life, his friends are gone, work reputation, etc. But said, I don't want her or I'd go. Swears on his life he's not contacted her this 1 week since newest DD. I asked if he was going to contact her, he said, I don't plan to. I said, plan to huh... Anyways, he then said something about I now I can't afford to hurt you again and I don't want to - and he wants to be sure about wanting me. Then he had to go to work. It really was time. So, he went from begging, to not wanting her, but not so sure about me. I'm so confused now I don't know which side is up. We will talk again later I'm sure. He said he'd call me later at work. What is this talk??? What do I say to him??? Do I really want someone who's so conflicted??? Is this fog talk??? I feel so rejected.

Your update says nothing about acting on the advice you were given.

Have you acted on the advice?

Have you done a nuclear exposure on both sides?

How about when he calls, you aren't available to answer the phone? Let him stew in it a bit. You could have been in the shower, taking a nap, reading a book? You need to know what to say to him and stick to your plan.

I wanna ask, what plan are you in? I know that you were in a false recovery but what is your plan now?

Your WH is confused because he is trying to figure out how to keep you on the line while having her too. You need to follow the MB plans and listen to the vets.

In fact, you paid a lot of money for professional advice from Steve. Are you acting as he advised?

Steve recommended that

1. You speak to WH briefly each day and monitor his attitude;

2. You wait to see what he does over the next 4-6 weeks;

3. You EXPOSE.

Are you going to do as Steve says?

Plan with Steve I posted earlier....separated, but able to talk briefly. Exposure is full blown on our side of the fence, months ago I called OW's mom. I'm still unsure of exposing to her friends, family.... I know she will get a hold of WH and they will talk. Afraid she'll get mad and fight harder for him rather than go away. Still may do it.

So if he is so intent on keeping her like you say, I don't want him. This is pushing me over the fence to just call it quits. I can't be second to her. I need help. I don't feel strong enough to sit here and wait for him to just discard me for her in 4-6 weeks. He's in this holding pattern... I can't take it anymore.

Thats ok. You should still expose. You don't avoid exposure just because they might contact each other. If they do contact each other that is still good because it will to discuss the CONFLICT, which won't be good for the affair. I would be sure and expose to the OW's mother and this time give her EVIDENCE so the OW can't deny it.

So, you have exposed the recent developments to them all?

Yes, all friends and family in our life know everything. I think your right Melody about the conflict between them. I will do it tonight or tomorrow.

Please comment on this babble of his. What is this???? Help.

We are going round in circles in our advice to you, but I'll give you the Plan B advice one more time.

Plan B is for when you "just can't take it any more". Plan B is for when, after Plan A, he gets used to having his cake and eating it. Plan B involves your withdrawing from all contact and thus leaving OW to meet his ENs. WH will be left with only OW to meet his needs. Frequently the OP cannot meet his most important ENs successfully.

You keep asking how you will know that the affair is over and that you can end Plan B. Your uncertainty about this seems to be the reason why you will not do Plan B but think of divorce instead.

As you enter Plan B, you need to give your H a list of requirements that he must meet in order for you to consider reconciling with him. An important requirement for you would be that you move far away from where you live now. If make vigorous efforts to sell your house right away, or to end the rental agreement, there is a good chance that by the time he is ready to meet your demands, you will have moved and he will be agreeing to move where you are. He is not likely to move away to be with you if he is still seeing OW.

You do not take him back now on the promise that you will move as a couple, only to see him drag his feet and eventually for you to find that he and OW are still in contact. You move alone and he will join you if he is serious about his marriage.

Because of his multiple false recoveries, you should not consider taking him back without his signing a post-nuptual agreement. This would give you all the marital assets should you be forced to divorce him after another FR. You can do a preliminary check in the next few days on the internet, or have a word with a lawyer, to see how a post-nup could be made binding. If post-nups are not legal in your state, you must look at some other way of transferring assets to you on his return, so that if he leaves you are not financially destitute.

You would be taking a risk by allowing him back after Plan B. Despite doing all you could do to establish openness and transparency (with email accounts, mobile phones etc) you would taking the risk that he might still be lying to you about contact, or might re-establish contact later on.

If he has no intention of ever having contact with OW again, or of leaving you - if he really wants his marriage with all his heart - then he will not hesitate to meet your requirements. He has no assets to lose if he stays faithful to you, but if he is still cake-eating, or is half-hearted about absolute NC for life, he won't take the risk of losing his assets. He will not agree to your demands, and you will know where you stand.

Other requirements would include things like MC with the Harleys, religious attendance and anything else you need to establish a new marriage. I can find a list made by the poster sexymambear later, if you ever decide to go with Plan B.

Plan B requires a lot of planning, which will take a few days, if not a week or two, to finish. You cannot just decide that you have had enough on a Thursday evening and go to Plan B on a Friday morning. You need to set up visitation arrangements for your children. You will need an intermediary to hand the children over and take them back, because you must not see or speak to WH. You need an intermediary (the same one, or another) to deal with all essential communication between you and WH, because you must not speak to him or email him directly. These are big commitments for friends or family to make, and they take time to set up. You need to establish a way for WH to support you and the children, including paying the mortgage if you have one, which might involve a legal separation agreement that spells out financial matters. And finally there is the Plan B letter, which explains that you are cutting all direct contact with H and gives your list of requirements; you need to see Dr Harley's model in his book Surviving An Affair and post your own version here for comments. You will need to draft a few versions.

Plan B must be set up so that it is so watertight, you will not have to break it to deal with some urgent matter. It takes time to plan.

You have every right to "call it quits" - I take it that means divorce - if you feel you cannot, or do not want to, recover your marriage after this affair and the multiple FRs. If, however, you would still be prepared to give recovery a chance if your H genuinely gave up the affair and wanted you in a faithful marriage, then Plan B is the way to go when you have had enough of his abuse.

It's babble, like you said. You're surely not hoping to make sense of the words of an insane, wayward addict?

Well; except there is the clear indication in his words that he is not committed to you. It is likely that this is because he is still seeing OW, but whatever the cause, he is not committed to you and the marriage. Not just now.

You do not take him back until and unless that spineless waffling back and forth STOPS.

Well I did it. Exposed through private FB messages to OW's family and friends. Thought I would know if they were still in contact too if WH heard about it. Well phone rang at 2am last night. WH, angry, what did you do? Said she sent him a FB message. So, I do think that is their only contact. Said he did not respond to her. His anger died quickly. He just couldn't believe I did it. Said they had not been in contact since DD one week ago and that I was "stirring *hit up." I did not back down and he did. I felt good that I caused her grief either way. He said he message said something like, your wife is sending letters to my friends and family. Tell her she better stop or things will get ugly. I'm like, oh honey, it's already ugly. I hope she just goes away and is tired of all this. She had been giving him ultimatums that last two weeks of contact. Hope I did the right thing.

WH still very silent. In a reflective mode. Not fighting for marriage, not saying he misses me. He does say he wants us, to fix this, and tells me he loves me. I'm not sure why he's sitting back on his heels. He keeps saying I'm emotionally exhausted, says he's not happy and not sad, just existing and processing the mess of his life he's made. Says he keeps asking himself why he did this. I think he is at times wondering if he really wants me or not. Is this typical? Saying he loves me but still questioning it. He really confuses me.

I talk with Steve again Tuesday. I think maybe Steve said give it 4-6 weeks b/c he knew WH would be in this funk. Is is withdrawal??? I can't figure him out at all and his not fighting for our marriage right now makes me feel rejected yet again.

It can't be withdrawal since he is still in touch with his GF. The affair is still active. Did you call the OW's mother and ask her for her help?

Why do you say it's active. Because she sent a FB message? I do believe there is no contact all week expect this one thing that happened b/c I exposed like I was told to do. That confuses me.

So what is this talking? I really need a little hope to hang on here.

I called OW's mother four months ago and she hung us on me, but heard all pertinent information.

BI, they are still in contact, which means it is an active affair. He has not ended contact with her. EVER. If he had really ended contact she wouldn't be able to contact him because he would have blocked access.

Can your mother call the OW's mother and speak to her?

Her access is blocked, but I checked and you can still get a message through. She set up some new, alias account and sent it that way.

I think I'm done with exposure. She knows. Her father got a message yesterday too. I'm not going to push that any more. Her mom hung up on me. I think it just shows the stellar person she as by the people that raised her.

But this explanation comes from your husband, BI. It is not believable. The fact is that he got a message and read it. Is it believable that he was up reading facebook at 2am? C'mon.

This is not believable. I assure you they are very much still in contact. And why would he care if you exposed? What would he have to be angry about if he is done, as he says? The fact that he even tried to manipulate you by accusing you of "stirring it up" is a clear indication the affair is not over.

He did next to nothing to block her from contacting him. First off, he could have easily blocked everyone who is not a friend. He didnt do that.

He can also look at her fb page as long as he has a fb page.

If he was serious about blocking her he would have just deleted his fb page.

Sure, ok, he could delete his page. She is blocked on his page, like I said, I did that and I have access.

BI, the basic issue here is that your H has never really ended contact. That is evidenced by his contact at 2am this morning. I don't believe for a minute that he was up reading fb message emails from ppl he didn't know at 2am. And then when he heard what you did, got angry about it. That makes no sense.

And no she is not blocked because she got through last night supposedly. If he were serious he would have just deleted his fb page altogether.

I think the basic problem, BI, is that you BELIEVE alot of the ridiculous lies he tells. I see so many red flags here that you don't see.