Ed,

I have not posted to you until now. The reason I am now is that I feel badly for you, but a little frustrated in reading your story.

Depression, Ed, is a fact of life. People do become truely drepressed, beyond their control, and they need proper treatment. How their partner reacts is an entirely different sitch. There are many times I have had to bundle my wife in the car and take her to a psychiatric unit. It is not rocket science Ed, it is just what you do for the one you love. You contact the psychiatrist ahead of time, and obtain permission for an admission. IF you had truely loved your wife you would not have let her get this far. So, do not please give Melody and others here the BS that you do not know what to do. The woman you are speaking of is Not your wife any longer, she belongs now to some other man. Get real please. You are not giving an example to the guys that come here and want help. They do not want to see this defeatest attitude. Most importantly Ed, she is no longer your wife.

Christ please give me patience!

Good Luck, Tom

But ed, that's exactly my point - you are NOT a family any longer and you are sending your kids a terrible message by pretending that you are. You are teaching them that no one has to invest in their family full-time. Part-time should be good enough. Parents can just drop in and enjoy some family time when they feel like it and then breeze out again when they get bored.

Your children are being taught that they should not expect a full-time mother. You have accepted part-time and they should, too. And I don't care that you don't "want" her to be part-time - she IS a part-time mother and you ARE putting up with it.

If you have not already, please read the MB thread below. You are becoming the poster boy for the Fantasy Divorce.

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2279757&page=1

Go out and find someone who is WORTH your time. Someone who actually cherishes a family, stop wasting your time on your EX wife she will NEVER change, start dating man and get your life back. Why is your ex wife still holding onto your balls??

Ed,

My kids are happy to see me and my ex around each other as well. I wouldn't take her back if all the women in the world disappeared tomorrow.

I don't want anymore of her poison in my life. I'd rather live 10 lifetimes without her presence. I'd rather jump naked into a swimming pool filled with double edged razor blades.

I'd rather clean all the bathrooms in grand central station with my tongue.

I'd rather shove an icepick under a toenail or two.

(I'm sure some will get the reference)

My point is that I know I can do better. Yes, my kids would be happy, but I would be miserable.

I value myself too much to put up with her anymore.

What you're teaching your kids right now is terrible. You're teaching them that a person can cheat and that they can be forgiven and have them return and yank you back and forth with manipulation.

What you're doing is traumatizing to your kids and will mess them up much more than if you tell her that she needs to stay in her house and that you're moving on with your life and that the kids will see her when they see her and you will see them when you see them.

"Ever since the day you left me,
I've been so miserable, my dear.
I feel almost as bad as I did
When you were still here."

Yes, another classic by one of the best musicians ever.

A few more:

I'd rather jump naked on a huge pile of thumbtacks, or stick my nostrils together with crazy glue.

Ed is in the "I've got a funny feeling, you don't love me anymore" stage.

Ed, read it. It's Weird Al. It will make you laugh at a minimum, but this is where you are. She keeps doing things and you keep saying, "I have this funny feeling....."

Here's that classic:

We've been together for so very long
But now things are changing, oh I wonder what's wrong?
Seems you don't want me around
The passion is gone and the flame's died down

I guess I lost a little bit of self-esteem
That time that you made it with the whole hockey team
You used to think I was nice
Now you tell all your friends that I'm the Antichrist

Oh, why did you disconnect the brakes in my car?
That kind of thing is hard to ignore
Got a funny feeling you don't love me anymore

I knew that we were having problems when
You put those piranhas in my bathtub again
You're still the light of my life
Oh darling, I'm beggin', won't you put down that knife?

You know, I even think it's kinda cute the way
You poison my coffee just a little each day
I still remember the way that you laughed
When you pushed me down that elevator shaft

Oh, if you don't mind me asking, what's this poisonous cobra
Doing in my underwear drawer?
Sometimes I get to thinking you don't love me any more

You slammed my face down on the barbecue grill
Now my scars are all healing, but my heart never will
You set my house on fire
You pulled out my chest hairs with an old pair of pliers

Oh, you think that I'm ugly and you say that I'm cheap
You shaved off my eyebrows while I was asleep
You drilled a hole in my head
Then you dumped me in a drainage ditch and left me for dead

Oh, you know this really isn't like you at all
You never acted this way before
Honey, something tells me you don't love me any more, oh no no
Got a funny feeling you don't love me anymore


ED! THAT'S YOU!

Most betrayed spouses are not ALREADY DIVORCED.


Yes, but you can only do that if the wayward is also willing to work on things.

Your wayward is not willing to work on things, and so you are getting the same advice that every betrayed spouse in your situation gets: move on, because your wayward is not willing to work on things.

I'm not really sure plunging into dating is the way to fix this, but I do agree that he needs to move on.

I think he needs a good solid year or two of learning to enjoy life without this woman.

She is a typical wayward. She's the typical kind that does not want to work on the marriage. You go through the plans to find out whether the wayward wants to or not. Typically in Marriage Builders you are supposed to respond to continued waywardness with Plan B. What preparations have you made for Plan B, Ed?

If this is a typical situation (and it is), let's respond to it with typical plans, shall we?

Ed, please go listen to this song. I think maybe it will help you understand the types of typical wayward situations where moving on is warranted:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/u...in=160610&Number=2392522#Post2392522

Ed,

There is a tremendous amount of joy with being with someone that doesn�t require �work� to be around. In other words, the normal �work� that goes into keeping a relationship healthy doesn�t feel like �work� because you�re happy to do it, she�s happy to do it, and it sort of feeds itself versus requiring a partner to engage with you reluctantly.

I have that now in my life. It�s a wonderful thing. I�m telling you that you can find that as well. It�s not going to come from your WXW, who will likely forever stay wayward.

It�s a classic case of �I hate you , don�t leave me!� It�s co-dependence and you�re playing into it.

I hear that... For a while a few months ago, I was dating and it was very refreshing to be around someone who acted like they wanted to be with me. But, I realized it was too soon for that and will not rush back into anything until I am ready.

My ex scheduled an appt with Steve Harley for next Friday. I told her I need to be away from her so not to plan on coming around. Steve told me he wants to talk to me after he speaks with her. It will be interesting to hear his take.

My guess is that he�s going to sell her on the MB principles, which is good, but I�m skeptical she�ll accept them.

She�ll continue searching for that sparks she says she�s missing, but that really is one of those things where you fake it till you make it.

The best thing you can do is shift into a mode of indifference towards her. Act like you are moving on with your life and you could care less if she�s around or not. If she asks to come over, say no. The kids are with her when she gets them.

Don�t explain. You don�t have to.

In other words, acting independent will make you much more attractive to her than anything else you can do. But I�m not telling you this to get her back. I�m telling you this so you can emotionally detach yourself from her so you can make a more objective judgment about her. The side effect will be her reaction.

She hate that you rejected her. That wounds her pride.

My advice is that YOU fake it till you make it. I completely understand how you feel. You are not yet emotionally detached from your ex, which is normal. You�d be abnormal if you felt nothing.

But that detachment must happen so you can see things more clearly.

Act divorced. That doesn�t mean you become an a$$. It means she is no longer your W and you must treat her accordingly.

I don�t invite my ex to come hang out with me in my home when I have the kids. I�m sure the kids would love it. But I know I wouldn�t.

Time to truly let her go, my friend. No matter what happens with SH. You need to detach so you can judge more objectively.

Perhaps that seeing this new man will give her that spark. THEN you can dictate the terms of reconciliation if that�s the path you wish to follow.

My guess is that you won�t want to expose yourself like that again.

Finally, don�t date. Don�t date for at least one year. Forget about woman and absorb yourself in your kids and your work. You�ll grow tremendously by doing so.

No worries...not another groundhog day!! This should probably be posted in the divorced forum, but I know this forum gets more traffic.

I'm looking for some advice on how to handle interactions with my ex. She clearly subscribes to the fantasy divorce school of thought, where we will still spend time together and thinks its good if our kids see us getting along together. Here is an example...our daughter who is in first grade has a school project where they are to pick a family picture and write a story about it. The instructions said that the picture did not have to be of your entire family...it could be just you, you and a sibling etc. So my ex prints off a picture from two years ago of all of us together.

I sent her a text saying that I didn't think we should use that picture because thanks to her and posom, that is not our family anymore and our daughter needs to accept that. She replied that is is good for her to see us together and that this is not hurting anyone. She also told me I need to stop being so angry. I replied that I am not angry at all. I just think we should be honest with our kids and that I have no desire to be friends with her or hang out with her.

She of course thinks I am crazy...she says she knows lots of divroced couples that get along for the kids sake. I was wondering if anyone here has some links to articles or other information explaining how to handle divorce with children. Or should I not even bother wasting my time with her? I just want to do what is best for my kids... Thanks!!

Boy, have I got a thread for you:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2279757&page=1


This is crazy backwards and is hurting your kids terribly by sending them a very, very warped message about what marriage and family really are. Please read the thread and see what you think.

What my suggestion for you handling your ex would be to Plan B her. Stop all direct contact with her, use an Intermediary.

Now, about your DD's project, have you read what she wrote? I would make sure that it said something like, "This is me with my mommy and my daddy. They got a divorce because my mommy had an affair. This is what my family used to look like." Okay, maybe not everyone would get their child to write something like that, maybe it's just ME.

You wouldn't be doing the wrong thing but NOT being friends with your Ex. You don't need to be friends with your Ex to be a good father. Take care of your DD, THAT's important.

Your XWW wants to be "friends" with you for two reasons:

1) To prove to herself that she didn't really do anything wrong. If you're still her "friend" then she didn't really hurt you that much - right?

2) To have in divorce what she wanted in marriage: Family time with you plus time with her boyfriend.

She is still in denial and still trying to cake-eat. As Scotty said, get an intermediary, go to Plan B and put a stop to this immediately if not sooner.

I agree that it is totally warped for her to suggest it is ok for our daughter to write a story about a family picture from before her affair. That is not our family anymore!! Just not sure if I can get her to see my point. My guess is she will never see things my way. That makes sense that she wants us to all get along and for me to attend her mothers 60th birthday party will of her family. I get along great with her family, but can't stand the thought of being around her. I know in certain situations (like our kids birthday parties) I will have to suck it up and deal with being around her.

On another note, what if she ever tries to bring OM to a kids' party. I don't think I could deal with that.

Who cares?? The woman lied to you, cheated on you and destroyed your and your children's family for some POSOM.

Now she wants to feel good about that and go on having family time when she needs a fix of that.

There is one consequence of destroying a family that she seems to have overlooked: NO FAMILY.

Please do not support her delusional fantasies in any way. You will only be doing a massive disservice to the kids if you do.

XWW was willing to destroy her/your family. Therefore, she doesn't have it any more and you are not about to pretend it does. End of story.

Why? Why torment yourself and send your children a false message that is really just a lie so XWW can feel good about what she's done?

Have separate parties. That's what Divorced means. You are no longer a family with XWW. By all means let the kids spend all the time with her they want, but NOT with you there. Families spend time together. You are no longer part of XWW's family and she is not part of yours.

Do you really want your kids to grow up with the idea that nuking your family and getting divorced is no big deal, because you still get to enjoy them when you feel like and can just go on cake-eating as long as you want?


See above. Problem solved.