I know you are all right, and I truly do see it. Yes, I am the conflict avoider, I just don't like to fight. I know that by doing the things he did he is trying to "play" the good guy and act like he cares, and maybe he really does, but the fact is that until he stops all contact with OW I will not be able to entertain working to fix this marriage. Thanks for the support, sometimes it's nice just knowing that my head really is screwed on straight! And I appreciate the words of encouragement, they really help me to stay foccused on the big picture, I guess I just need that "smack in the face" to keep me on target, so thanks. I will keep you all informed.

Good News to all, This weekend was a true test of my ability to take control. I did it !!!!! My husband finally saw the light, not that he is happy, but is taking steps to woek with me to save this marriage. There are still points that he does not understand, but he listened and asked alot of questions, and NO I did not back down. I told him what I had to have from him starting with a no contact for life agreement. He actually wrote the letter tonight while I was at work, I approve of it and will be mailing it in the morning. I fully expect the OW to try and contact him, however she is blocked from his fb and his phone, so the next few days should be interesting. I will keep checking my sources to make sure I am on top of anything, but he did promise to tell me if she tries, and since I will already know it will be nice to know that he is not hiding things from me. Will let you all know how we are doing as things progress. Thank YOU

Nice job, Sally. But awfully easy. Watch him like a hawk. Snoop like a bloodhound. The first few days of withdrawal from the A are critical - many waywards can't tough it out and will attempt contact. Plan A & meet his needs. Make sure you're spending plenty of UA time with him.

You were right, too easy ! He admitted to just enough to try to satisfy me. The OW finally came clean and he was in a total state of shock, a little more of the picture, none of it good. I think that we, me and the OW, have finally come to terms, she felt that she was led blindly into the affair, believing that my marriage was over, can't blame her since that is what my H told her, but having the truth out seems to make it better for her and I know I needed it. Now however, my H seems to be withdrawling, it's like he still doesn't want me to know what he really did, embarrasment or guilt, or just wanting to have it all I don't know. I am treading lightly. He thinks counceling would be good for me, so that I can "forgive myself", but he doesn't seem to think he has anything to get over. he said that he was sorry, that it was a mistake, and that he is "here", so that should be the end of it. ??????????????????????? I think it's going to be a long hard road....... Sometimes I think I would have been better to have held my ground and declared it over a long time ago ! Anyone have any tips on how to get a discussion going between us that doesn't point fingers or cause hurt but lets us discuss what and why, somehow I need to know from him everything, I know he can't really explain the why, and I get that, he got "caught up" in it, but how do you find out the root cause if no-one is talking?! Any why is it so damned important to me to know what he told her? Just thinking out loud, sorry, but it seems to get more confusing all the time.

You spoke to the OW? What happened?

Remember one thing: this is a marathon, not a sprint. Your WH is still deep in the fog. He is not accepting responsibility for his actions. He thinks YOU should forgive yourself??? Typical wayward words. I suspect you'll be hearing more asinine comments from him before this is over.

Okay, let me explain. I never believed that my H was in a non-sexual affair, but he always insisted. The OW would never fess up, she backed him 100%. I finally had enough and sent her a message declaring what she and my H did as a sin, ( she is very religious), I cut her to the core, which I enjoyed , and finally "pissed" her off so bad that she spilled. So now I have the truth. So I confronted my H who , and don't laugh admitted that they had sex once but he could not perform and that was it. What am I an idiot?! I had the written word in my hand and he still tried to play it off! Anyway she told me that she didn't want to tell me the truth because she felt she would be betraying him, I get that, but he still won't admit to the truth, the whole truth. I was so mad I told him that if I found out he was lying still that I would remove myself from the situation and that he would have to leave, period. I can't do this anymore, the lies just keep coming, and when he sits right there and says that he loves me and that is all that happened it makes me physically sick ! I started counceling, and yes I do need to forgive myself for mistakes I made by not fulfilling his needs, but this is a two way street and I did not cross over to another person to get attention from, or have sex with.When we talk it always seems that I am the one explaining what I need, and of course he agrees, and I know that he feels bad, but shouldn't he be able to tell me what he needs? Shouldn;t he be able to admit the truth if he wants to save this marriage? I know the truth now, so open up and lets get thru this, but nope, more lies, half thruths,and support for "my" problems. I swear I can't keep this up. I never know the next move until it happens, and by the way I blocked his phone so no phone calls between them and told the OW that the declaration was for life, she asked me to let him know that she was sorry but she had to let it all go herself, I of course wont pass that on but instead will make sure that he knows he is responsible for destroying two lives not just one.Anyone want a used H with issues, I might just be giving mine away?!

Sally, go look up polygraph testers and make an appointment for him.

Then tell your H that you are going to give him an opportunity to clear his good name by passing a polygraph.

If he passes it you will go forward with the marriage, but that is the only way you will consider a future with him because recovery is impossible unless he is truthful.

Tell him he has up until the polygraph to get the truth out there but if he fails it, the marriage can't go forward.

p.s. I would make up a list of questions you plan on giving to the polygrapher and give that list to your H beforehand. Have him answer the questions beforehand. Then you can see if his answers are truthful in the polygraph test.

What will likely happen is he spills his guts before the test. If he does that, I would still insist he take the polygraph.

Welcome to MB Sally.

You sound like somebody I'd get along with and I have a bit of truth to tell you about how these ws are.

First of all STICK to a plan. Either plan A or plan B. Do you know the carrot and stick of plan A/B? Search it here on this site and it's an easy one to find. You need to implement a plan, don't fly blind, and don't keep doing what you're doing because it is not going to get you where you need to be.

I have an ex H who had an ema with a woman from my hometown, and even after we moved and a false recovery of a whole year, she resurfaced and it went further.

You will first of all never get the truth from an ow. I know that 100 percent. What does a wayward do..answer? LIE. Your H is not and will not ever as long as he is a WS (he is one now ok) ever tell the truth so quit making him try. No need for any lie detector, as GOOD liars can pass em'. My ex could I can tell you.

Three words for you. Keylogger. Private Eye. If you want to see what they're really saying online get a stealth keylogger installed ok? And if there could be possible physical contact in any form at all, hire a p.i. I found out all I ever needed to know in 5 hours of work from a good private eye. Everything.

While mine wasn't saved, I owe MB for me being able to save my future and that of my child. We are a success, and I remarried in july and we're beyond thrilled.

Here's what I'd like to tell you also. After a year or two being divorced I found my old college bf. We dated a while and it got complicated. Similar situation as your WH is in, except my then boyfriend was of course, single. But he had a past with me, as your H has a past with this horrible ow. That is something that can never be allowed to happen. I know how easy it was for me to date my old college (of course single) boyfriend, and how it might have been easy for your WH to rekindle feelings for her. This being said, he must have NO CONTACT FOR LIFE with her for your marriage to ever recover.

Just like I'd never have contact with an ex boyfriend see? The past is a powerful feeling..all that nostalgia or good feelings. But it's the past and it's the past for a reason and your WH hasn't remembered that part.

He has to have motivation to END this ema. And by you not pulling the full plan A/B trigger with everything you have, you're enabling this stupid affair of his to limp on. While there may have been some discovery and a few phone calls exchanged, it's not dead yet by far. In fact many here will attest (me too) that sometimes an affair can go further underground in some cases. He HAS to want to end everything and want to live a totally transparent life and HE has to realize HE IS THE PROBLEM here, not you. Has to want to get help.

Btw, I was a cheer coach in college and did for many years...and I live in GA so if you want me to smackdown that crazy ow, lemme know! lol! I can call her and give her a "cheer" she'd never forget! lol!

Never underestimate the ow. And know she will lie and most likely DID lie to you. The marriage will only heal when the WS commits to the recovery and goes along with each and every piece of the recovery puzzle, which includes 100 percent transparency.

Let your WH know that if he doesn't change, he has a predictable future with the ow. My ex? He's getting a divorce now from the ex ow (his wife). In the process, he cheated more and more on the affair wife and lost almost everything he has in the process. Needless to say I have 100 percent custody and even supervised visitation as a parent. The long term for waywards who never see the light is bleak. Very very sad and bleak. In fact rather hopeless.

However, I have a few friends here who can attest to the way a marriage CAN be healed and recovered if the MB plan is correctly implemented and followed. It's such a blessing to see that!

But the bottom line is this. No matter what happens in the end, I became a better person and mom having gone thru this and followed marriage builders and its theories. You'll end up a winner no matter the outcome.

Wish you well, get on having a REAL PLAN, and know that if you need ow smackdown in GA lemme know! lol!

Oh..my ex H had a polygraph test regarding a legal situation he found himself in last year. He PASSED it.

Imho, a good and accomplished liar can pass those like a kindergarten admissions test.

Focus on what works. Having a plan A or plan B. Knowing which plan you need to be in. And finally EXECUTING A FLAWLESS plan A or B.

You need to change your attitude. Look at the parts of your post that I italicized. First, you don't need to 'forgive yourself' of anything. Okay, maybe you need to look again at how you approached your M. But forgive yourself? No.

Second, don't let him blameshift by indicating that YOU have problems that led him to jump in bed with another woman. There ARE no 'problems' that you would have that would cause that. Screwing a woman is a choice a man makes, exclusive of what else is going on in his life.

People make a choice every day which road to travel. Will it be cheerios or corn flakes in the morning? Caf or decaf? You have a choice each day.

Your WH chose WRONG. There is no excuse to cheat. If life were soooo bad at home, he would have said (real man that is) "honey, we need to talk. I feel like x (fill it in) and we need to do something b/c I am unhappy now in our M."

But most WS do NOT do that do they? Not the ones they see here. Neer is there a warning shot fired.

It usually is a weakness or a chink in some armor that makes them weak on one level or another morally and then if it's pleasureable for them, or a diversion from the reality of day to day living, and there is any payoff on any level from the initial contact with the other person to be, then it continues.

It's not your fault. He had a choice and he chose wrong. YOU do not pay for HIS problem. Were it your fault, odds are he might have spoken up and asked to get help.

My life with my ex was fine. Normal and fine. We were even trying for another baby and had built a dream home over a half million bucks. Perfect? No but nobody has a perfect life. He had every reason to stay married but felt ENTITLED for his ons which led to a pa and ultimately a D. He felt ENTITLED to his affair happiness because in his foggy mind he sacrificed each day for us working soooo hard.

See? I could have been a perfect stepford wife and he would have found fault. Remember...even gorgeous gravity-defying supermodels get cheated on for no reason (Christy Brinkley). You're in good company. Now him? Your WH? NOT

Just to let you know that a couple of months ago I would have sent you to her house for a "smackdown", but since I last posted things became even stranger than I thought they could. I called the OW and we had a three hour talk about my H, she just moved to a new town leaving her son the home she shared with her deceased husband, and she had some not to pleasant things to say about my H. Yes he lied to her also, imagine that ! I told her that I had blocked her from his phone and offered to re-enstate the conection as I was at the I don't give a crap stage, but she said that she never wanted to hear from him again ?! She deleted him from facebook and, well it was interesting. Do I believe I got the whole truth? You bet, I even know the intimate details ! Not really sure I wanted them but I had to know. And then I went after my H, everytime he tried to lie I was able to "nail" him to the wall !!!!!! Today he is still in our home, and walking on eggshells as they say. He has gone to counceling with me and actually paid attention and said that he wants our marriage to work, so we are going to try. He still hasn't given a reason for all the lies, he says he "can't explain it, but he does understand my feelings of mistrust and anger. I guess we will see what happens, I havn't let my guard down, I still check phone records and e-mail daily, and my spy at his job is doing the same. Wish me luck as I travel down this road, I know that things will never be the same but I want to invite him back into our bed and believe that he is there because he only wants to be with me, I can't tell you when that might happen, but I hope we finally get to that place. Thanks for all the advise and encouragment, it was everything I needed at a terrible point in my life that I didn't think anyone undertood. I will keep in touch - Sally