I'm hoping some insight can be shed on my horrific situation and maybe shed an ounce of light and hope for my family. My therapists turned me on to the site and I'm grateful to be here and touched by all that I have read. I have since ordered Surviving the Affair for both myself and as a Secret Santa gift for my wife.

D-Day1 was the 3rd Tues in July '10. I had become physical with a young lady who did a ride-a-long with our department at the end of June. I felt like she did all the things my wife didn't, ie, showed me attention, interested in what i did...essentially met my emotional needs. After a while the flirting turned to a more physical nature, but absent of sex. I had confronted my wife and told her that i thought we should divorce as i loved her but wasn't "in love" with her. Boy I was blinded by lust. Divorce was not a new phrase as in the past 5 years it had come up several time. Before D-Day1 I was with the OW when it dawned on me that all I wanted was for my wife to show these things and if so then we could again be happy. I ran home to my wife and told her I wanted to work things out. She was still unaware of this affair that weekend as we took a long drive to Ohio and discussed problems and solutions with our marriage. Things seem to be moving forward though. D-Day came and while I was at training and the OW sent a nonsexual message via Facebook to my account which was open and in front of my wife. When I came home I confessed to my actions, but deliberately tried to hide some details as I felt it only made the situation worse. She found it to be more hurtful the more I was hiding things.

2 years previous to this I had been involved in an EA via texting with a young lady for 2 months. The conversations were not sexual and mostly about my problems with my marriage. We never met up and I broke it off just before Christmas. During that time my wife was suffering from PPD after having our 3rd girl and I was sleeping on the couch. Things became better with us and it wasn't till the summer that she discovered some texts I had not erased. The incident was not punished or with very much consequences and we moved on.

With the current state, I was asked to leave our home. I moved in with a friend, all the while begging for forgiveness, another chance, making promises of change, and badgering her for some kind of sign as to if we were going to remain together or divorce. Her support group was her co-workers who are all divorced and happily remarried and it wasn't long before she too decided divorce was for her. At the news of this I went off the deep end. Almost like throwing my hands up and giving in. I went back to the OW and had sex with her and then moved on. Soon after I began drinking and smoking thinking it would help cope with the pain I felt and the void in my heart. One night I ended up having sex with another woman. Still married, I was committing adultery all because I was still being selfish. This all within a month's time frame.

Issues with the divorce were sometimes cordial and sometimes bitter. I was use to seeing my kids all the time and now she was only granting me the minimum court approved visitation. I began to resent her over that. Then D-Day2 came on November 2, 2010. My wife came over to my rental and let on that she knew there was stuff I was hiding from her. I ended up confessing everything. Including the fact I had gotten into an off-duty incident involving alcohol which resulted with me being placed on administrative leave. This incident happening the day after I was served the divorce papers. Once I confessed to her I confessed to my clergy and my father. My wife showed a lot of compassion and told me that this was day one of me beginning to change.

I thought things would be better that week, but they weren't. I was so hurt and full of guilt, like all those sins were made known unto me and I couldn't look in the mirror, listen to the radio, or watch tv without blaming myself for all I was losing. I made a decision to not see another weekend and was pretty determined to go through with it when i had an unlikely visitor from church. A friend who could see the anguish and shame I felt helped me get through those feelings and turned me back on to my priority of changing my life for me. He showed me my self worth and that Heavenly Father no matter what loves me. I was encouraged to immerse myself in selfless giving and study of the scriptures, something that is very important with my wife and I, but we both neglected for a long time. Immediately I began to see little blessings in my life. With nothing more to hide, I had no reason to be dishonest. I was able to see me kids more and I steered clear of temptation. Unfortunately I did lose my job and at church I am disfellowshipped for 12 months pending a time of repentance. Again though, my goal is to build myself up, change my ways, and be worthy again.

Yet the pain is still largely there. The blame hits daily and I swear i never knew I could cry so much. I think of my wife as the most beautiful woman there is and it kills me to know that I'm losing her. She tells me she feels only indifference towards me. obviously trust is not there and as i've read, trust is love. I reach out for some glimmer of hope, like her telling someone she still loves me, but i don't get that. We are very nice to each other, even sitting together at church for the kids. I was invited over to her family's place for Thanksgiving and only my shame made it awkward. I've realized how little I served her in our 10 years of marriage and most of the time I was selfish and impulsive. I know now how I would treat her and what i would do for her, if only to have her as my wife again.

With all that said, I had a break down yesterday after an out of state friend called and told me about a conversation he had had with my wife over the weekend when she was in town. Basically she told him that she was planning on getting back together with me until the two incidents of infidelity occurred. My heart sank thinking of all the times I asked for her to give me some hope and then when she didn't I gave up and did those things. If only I had just focused on fixing myself at that point rather than trying to fix myself to win her back. All may not be completely lost as she's told me she might date me in 3 years. I wouldn't care if it was 7 years, I'd wait. I just don't know what to do from here. The divorce will be final at the new year, I'm in a a pretty depressive state, and all i want is my wife back. I know there are no magic answers and time heals alot, but I feel pretty desperate for some hope. i believe in miracles and i know our family can be whole again. I'm looking for someone to provide some little insight on what i can do as i continue on this path of change to win my wife back.

TexasBob, what stands out to me is the fact that you have yet to take responsibility for your abusive behavior towards your wife. IMO, she is right to pursue divorce because you are not safe until you GET that you are 100% responsible for your crimes against your family and your wife. Every instance of described adultery is coupled with some perceived failing of your wife, when the problem is YOUR POOR BOUNDARIES AROUND WOMEN. As long as you don't understand that you should not have opposite sex friends and should never allow another woman to meet your need, YOU ARE DANGEROUS.

In other words, your wife's fault.

Another example: Again, your wife's fault.

See how it is always somehow HER fault and not yours? The truth is that you have affairs because you don't know how to behave around women. You allow them to meet your needs and have discussions about your personal life with them. And THEN you blame your wife for your own poor boundaries.

You are not SAFE until you get that. And she is right to pursue divorce.


Another red flag is the self pity and bizarre focus on "your pain." HUH? You have callously abused your wife in the worst way and are crying about the "pain" you incurred in the commission of your crimes? HELLO? You signed on for this, Sir. Your wife and children, your victims, DID NOT.

Your wife has endured about the worst truama that can be committed against a person; it is as traumatic as rape, the death of a child and physical assault. You did that, not once, but numerous times to your wife. And you are concerned about YOUR PAIN? Do you have any understanding of what you have done to your wife and why you are not safe?

Tell her you don't want the divorce. Ask her to put off the divorce. Tell her you have no expectations of her. Tell her you are working on yourself and in time you hope she might want to take you back, but that you don't expect it. Then I would proceed like you were trying to befriend her and then possibly date her again. Keep it light. Engage in conversation. Plan activities to hang out with and without the kids. She's confused right now. Part of her wants to take you back. Part of her is afraid you'll hurt her again. Prove by your actions, through time, that you have changed. Don't put pressure on her to take you back. Just slowly and surely keep chipping away at the wall. Figure out what her emotional needs are and meet the needs she'll let you meet. Figure out what her love busters are and avoid them. I would treat this the same way as working plan A on a WS (except only the carrot of plan A, not the stick). Slowly and surely try and win her back. This may take 6 months to several years, but if this is what you want you need to show determination and patience and not be deterred if things aren't fixed quickly.

Another example where you link your bad behavior to something SHE did. But that is not my main question.

Are you an alcoholic?

And what was the "off duty incident?"

TB, you've demonstrated over and over to your wife that you are not a person she can feel safe with. Why do you suppose that would change now?

You've cheated on her with three - THREE women! You've taken no responsibility for your actions. Actually, you've blamed your WIFE for your actions!

After everything you've done, your BW decides that she wants to divorce, which is absolutely her right. And you're mad at her for forcing you to respect the child visitation schedule for a divorce that YOU have caused? Do you see where this is flawed, self-serving thinking? Why should you resent her because your behavior destroyed your marriage?? There are wayward spouses who have to fight for time with their kids at all.

You may - MAY - be able to recover a relationship with your BW, but I doubt that it result from crying over yourself or getting religion. You, sir, need to do some serious work on bettering yourself and your boundaries. And that's going to take some time.

How often do you drink?

although i believe it's important to advise TexasBob that what he's doing is blaming his wife for his infidelity and not his lack of boundaries...

...BUT on the other hand, I feel it's equally important that TexasBob tells the class his story...what he was feeling and what the OW did for him...as an eye opener to others that surf across this site...

when one spouse starts to neglect the other in meeting emotional needs, this is what happens...the relationship becomes ripe for an affair...

The real lesson here is NOT unmet emotional needs, but a lack of boundaries. I have no doubt that his wife's needs were unmet too, however she did not have an affair. And there is a reason for that. She had appropriate boundaries, he did not. When one is not getting their needs met at home, they should be even more diligent about this, not less.

For a BS to believe that her WS' affair happened because of unmet needs is to put a gun to her head to meet those needs eternally or live in fear of a repeat.

So, no I don't agree that is the lesson here. This poster is already blameshifting, lets not give him MORE ammunition. The lesson here is poor boundaries, period. Giving a blameshifting poster more ammunition to blameshift is counterproductive and not helpful to him or his wife.

Let me put this another way. They are BOTH responsible for the poor state of the marriage; the cheater is 100% responsible for the affair. Dr Harley explained this in a post to me over on the weekend forum:

here

Of course it's important the Bob tell his story, in all of its unvarnished truth. We need absolute truth as a starting point or we're all just spinning our wheels, including Bob.

I don't believe anyone is chastising Bob for telling the truth. It is the wayward content in his story that we are pointing out. That's exactly why we're doing exactly what you're advising in your first paragraph.

Somebody (Mulan, I think) explained this in a way I'll never forget: the marriage was bad, but the betrayed spouse wasn't consulted on what to do about it. They could have chosen together to divorce, they could have chosen together to work on the marriage, they could have chosen together to get help, they could have made lots of choices together. But the decision to have an affair was made alone, by the wayward spouse, without any input on the subject from the betrayed spouse. Thus the decision belongs 100% to the wayward spouse.

So, in Bob's case, there are a lot of ways he could have worked with his wife to address the problem. Instead he chose to address it alone, his way, and now he is suffering some terrible consequences. If he takes responsibility for the actions that led to these consequences, he can become the kind of person who can steer and guide his life to happiness rather than accepting unhappiness forever and blaming it on other people.

1) Awesome info.

2) You are introducing master's-degree level MB to a in incoming freshman, whom the school may not yet have accepted.


Let's hold of on surgical school, and start with some anatomy, shall we?


So, Bob, let's start with the basics.

NC for life, with all 3 women, period. You should draft a NC letter to at least the last woman, and run it by your W for approval.

Opposite sex avoidance plan; do a forum search, and develop one for yourself.

Change of venue; if your work is constantly putting you into temptation's path, change jobs. Change cities, change states.

Total transparency; give your wife total access to telephones, computers, email, etc etc.

Accountability; let her know the schedule of each and every day, and check in several times a day.

Responsibility; in short, own your poop.

While these things are requirements of recovery, Bob has indicated that his D is rolling to completion. So much of this is irrelevant at this time. (Correct me if I'm wrong, Bob.)

I agree that Bob needs to own his own stuff. I also believe that Bob needs to understand how critical it is to establish boundaries as a way of respecting himself and the people around him.

once again, i'm not saying it's not important to bring to TexasBob's attention that his boundaries were weak...BUT Dr. Harley's point in HNHN's book is that a marriage works only when each spouse takes the time to consider the other's needs and strives to meet them...

in TexasBob's case, we don't know the whole story...but he lets the class know what he was feeling...how the OW made him feel, how the OW meet what needs his wife wasn't meeting...this isn't blaming his wife for the affair, it's a fact, a fact Dr. Harley speaks of in his book...the lack of meeting needs leads to extramarital affairs...

spouses can surf across this thread and read it's all TexasBob's fault b/c he has weak boundaries...and what's taken away from that is that regardless if one spouse is neglecting the others needs, that one spouse not having needs meet should have superman morals with boundaries of steel...

the point i'm making is that for others surfing across this thread is to start taking the time to meet each other's needs if you're not already, recognize that each spouse has specific emotional needs that need to be met and when those needs go unmet, the relationship becomes primed for an affair...

and i would agree with Harley Jr. here...there are times and circumstances were EN's may go unmet...could be the result of sickness or the other spouse has to be away from the other spouse...there's many reasons...and in cheating cases as these, there's no excuse to cheat...

Yes, I can see where I look like a blame shifter, but believe me when I saw that at this time that is not the case. I blame myself for everything. I see how selfish I was all through our marriage. From being impulsive to becoming negative about her priority for work as it took time away from ME and the kids. For the record I am not an alcoholic, and this was the first time I had drank. I knew other officers did it as a coping mechanism and I thought it would work for me. I agree that I do need to work on my boundaries with women. The women were all college students and met when I was on the job. I should have known to never discuss my marital issues with any woman other than my wife. I don't blame her for my actions, my point was to illustrate my horrible decisions after certain points along this road. I know that she has cried more and the kids are without a father in the home. Yet to say that I'm not hurting as well is wrong. The guilt, shame, and pain is to me at least some since in accepting responsibility for my actions. I've got a ways to go in changing who I was, but the incidents have humbled me to some degree and I want to change. Before and had I not been caught I think I would just revert to those old actions. Case in point the EA that was swept to the side. So in summary, I and only I committed these grevious sins be my own free will. I was caught and am extremely remorseful over the pain and hurt I've brought to my family. I too am hurting because I know it was my decisions that have brought me to this point. I'm in the process changing my life and hope there is healing and forgiveness for all of us.

We can't control what anonymous surfers picking and choosing random posts are going to think. It's a moot point.

Eee, no. Your logic is oversimplified to the point of being dangerous. (Don't take this poster's comment as gospel, anonymous surfers! )

The lack of meeting needs leads to possible frustration or resentment, maybe. That's as far as you can go. It's what the spouses do at that point that ices the cake.

Some days I get cranky. (Yeah, I know - ME?? ) I may not be the best at meeting my H's need for...whatever. Pick the need. That does NOT give him the right to have an affair. That gives him the right to discuss with me how he's feeling. That ability to honestly talk about what's going on will help to short-circuit any resentment or frustration while we solve the problem.

Now, because I'm a good wife who wants to please her H because that pleases both of us, I will even extend myself to him. "Mr. Bliss, I am in a world of crank right now."

Now I've respected him enough to let him know, honestly, how I'm feeling. And we have an opportunity to solve this together.

Can you see where approaching the lack of EN's in this way would short-circuit an A? Instead of honestly talking with his BW to discuss their needs, Bob chose to lower his protective boundaries have his needs met elsewhere, and finds himself in a predicament today.

So, you can see it's not a problem with needs not being met. It's what Bob decided to do to get his needs met. And that required him to lower his boundaries.

\
I am sure you are hurting. As you should. But you are the rapist who cries he got kicked in the commission of a crime. You volunteered for it, your victim didn't. Focusing on your pain tells me you don't put this in proper perspective. Your victims are bleeding on the floor and yet you cry about your pain. Knock it off. Self pity is counterproductive and distracts you from what is really important: making amends to your victim. It is inappropriate.


And those certain "points" were mentioned as excuses for your actions or they wouldn't have been mentioned. You didn't mention them for no reason. You also probably ate at a fast food on one of those days but you don't say "I ate at McDonalds on.........." as an arbitrary point.

If we can pick up on the blameshifting and self pity, I am sure your victims can too. That is why I am pointing this out. And I really don't think you GET IT. You are in fact even denying that you do it.

That does not give me hope.

allow me to requalify...the lack of meeting needs HABITUAILY, MAY lead to extramarital affairs...

still the point behind Dr. Harley's HNHN's book proves the case here with TexasBob by his own admission in his opening post...

the OW did all the things his wife wasn't doing...showing attention and being interested in what he did...

again, Dr. Harley's theory is that couples need to strive to meet the needs of their spouses to in essence affair proof their marriages...the jist is not about setting "boundaries" to affair proof a marriage...although boundaries are certainly essential in any relationship.

Mr Anderson, could you explain to me then the couples that DrH counsels where the BS actually MEETS ALL of the WS's ENs and the WS has affairs even in THOSE marriages? The commonality is the lack of BOUNDARIES.

Again, my marriage was NOT perfect. My ENs were not being met either and I DID NOT have an affair. Not because no one wanted to hook up with me, but because I didn't have boundaries as weak as my WH. That really IS the reason.

Have you read SAA?

Please don;t distract this poster, or any other poster by saying that it is the BSs fault for the affair because they didn't meet needs. The BS and WS had choices and the WS chose the worst thing that could have done for their marriage.