Pdc, sorry your here, but you are in good hands.

I think what Mel has been saying, means something, and I wonder if you can see what it is.

It has less to do with the logistics of the affair, or who, and more to do with what is really happening in your wifes mind, and has been for a while.

She has been longing to have something passionate with someone for quite a while. There was in her mind that lover out there, maybe not materialised yet, but in fantasy long before she moved out.

But more importantly probably and more damaging to your recovery, is that she stopped being honest and open with you long before she moved out.

There is allways, allways, somebody when separation happens, and if your truthful, somewhere in your mind you have thought about that also at some time in desparation and when you thought you might be alone. Nobody can live without relationship, and we hold on to even the worse ones.

You already know your relationship deteriorated over time, that you had fallen out of love with each other. Dr H is successful because he knows its not making a perfect marriage that keeps us together, but having the passion and love for each other that makes the perfect marriage.

Many look around and try to qualify our marriage by others standards, but that is not at the heart of it. Its about what you have that nobody can get in between, its about knowing your loved, and wanting to reciprocate that in any way you can.

To a reasonable person, it sometimes doesn't make sense. Just as all this probably doesn't make sense to you right now, but I assure you, if you follow the steps here in the policies and help, it will make more sense than anything.

When we have that, we will search for ways to love one another, the definition of love, and sometimes even lose much of ourselves just to care for our spouses.

Having lost my wife to some of the desparation and escape mechanisims that seem to have effected your wife also, I know as probably you are experiencing now, how painful it is to be rejected, or should I say, to have my efforts of love be rejected.

Keep posting, reading, and see if your wife is available to come here also. She might be too embarassed and I understand that. She sounds like someone who you beleive would never have fell so hard, and probably white knuckled for many years when both of you let the marriage slip. I think it is important that both of you realize that it doesn't have to end because either of you screwed up, but that you accept your mistakes, and learn from them.

Its not over till both of you quit. I'll bet you know this sir, and I can see because you are here, you are not a quitter.

God Bless

A more believable scenario is that she met the boy previously, developed very powerful feelings for him when he was 17. [which gives a motivation for keeping this part quiet] Perhaps the affair started then and that is when she started pulling away from you and moved into the back bedroom.

At the same time she was regaling her "friend" [the single mom] with her complaints about her marriage and said she wanted to move out but had no place to go in the hopes the friend would offer her a place to stay.

I find it interesting that the 18 yr old moved back right after your wife moved in.

Call me a crazy woman,[which is partly true! ] but the above scenario makes more sense to me. The story your wife gives doesn't make sense.

See, a wife who is really done with a marriage will simply file for divorce and be done. Your wife didn't do that. Instead she asked for a separation, to "get space" which tells me she wasn't DONE, but wanted to keep that door open. That points right to an affair.

Can you think back to when she first met this friend and what was happening in your marriage at that time? CAn you correlate this friendship with the onset of any major changes in your marriage?

pdc, I am willing to be wrong! I don't mind that. I am only asking that you carefully examine the narrative you have been given, because it is very unlikely. It takes a powerful motivation, ie: an addiction, to get a woman to abandon her home unless she is truly leaving the marriage.

Your wife has a powerful motive to paint the sequence of events in a deceitful picture. Just consider that she could be in criminal trouble over this, so she would be more motivated to lie than most WS's.

Yes Mel, I think that makes more sense, she probably already was attracted to the kid.

Sorry pdc, I know that conjuors up a lot of resentment because it was happening behind your back, but at this point it probably doesn't surprise you.

Melody - I appreciate your experience and your persitence. I truly do know that this all happened as I have previosly stated.

Constant - I appeciate your insite. I'm sure my wife did have a fantasy lover in her mind. She has told me that I "starved" her for many years.

We both did a huge disservice to our marriage by not being honest. I am first in that regard. I am now committed to complete honesty and to meeting her EN's. I love this wonderful women and plan to live the rest of our lives together.

This really is not the case. I'm not in denial.

After what Constant wrote, it made me think of a plausible scenario (one that I could probably apply to myself in some ways).

It is quite possible that she didn't leave for an OM. It is quite possible she could have, as Constant said, made up a possible scenario in her mind of what another relationship would be like/feel like. Maybe she didn't even put a name or face to her imaginings at all. Then, when this boy showed up needing emotional help, being vulnerable and attractive...volia.

I guess what I am saying is she is probably being honest about the start of things. She may not be being honest about her mindset when she left. To be fair, she may not even know. When my A was first over, there was a lot of focus on the OM, why I picked him, if I loved him etc. After awhile I realized that I think there had been an OM made up in my head for years. Nameless, faceless for the most part...then, the real OM came and seemingly "fit the bill".

A relationship with an 18 year old seems too impossible that she probably didn't even realize that maybe, she had been subconciously having those feelings all along.

As a grown woman, we don't like to think that we NEED a man or relationship to complete us. She may have convinced herself she was leaving because she needed space when somewhere in the back recesses of her mind was a niggling "what if scenario" that only played out in dreams.

I'm not saying she isn't still hiding something, I'm just saying that she may have repressed those feeling so much that even she didn't realize they were there

Sunny I think you really have hit the nail on the head.

My only concern is that you aren't blindsided if you learn there was a previous connection with these two.
I suspect that this A began before your WW moved out.

I've been on this board for while. This thread is following a pattern that I've seen played out many times. The end result is always the same - the BS eventually finds out that the WS moved out was because the WS was involved in an A.

This case really is the exception to the rule. I know that it couldn't be otherwise.

Is WW worried that her refusal of physical affection/sex with you, her husband, is pushing YOU away?
If you are not sure, ASK this question:

"Are you concerned about me leaving you because you refuse to share physical love/affection with me?"

No intercourse until BOTH of you have been completely screened for STDs.

Get that STD testing done this week.

Ditto that. Women don't move out to "get space".

Either which way, right now you believe there is no contact, and it will be wise for you to not just take her word for it but to double check yourself.

Moving forward, the steps to recovery remain the same.

If she's not on board with a specific plan for recovery, this will hinder recovery. So work on your end - meeting her ENs. And to get her on board, I highly recommend consulting with the MB counseling center.

My thoughts exactly.

Why do I think it is important to point this out?

Because I think you haven't fully grasped how manipulative/deceitful a wayward spouse can be....hence you are at risk to be further manipulated/hurt etc.

You need to have your eyes wide open and be very cautious when putting faith in anything she says...for now...

I know there's no contact. We will when she's ready be working with the MB materials. She has already read some of the MB material I have brought home. I have already encouraged her to join the forums and gave her the link to this thread.

Agree 100%. Regardless of the history, the path for recovery is the same. But it would behoove you to question and double check every thing she says. If something doesn't make sense there is usually deceit involved.

I really like Pepperband's suggestion and I hope you ask your wife this question.

I appreciate that, but this affair in some ways is VERY unique. It did not come about until after she was out. I think Sunny really grasped what happened here.

Please tell us HOW, pdc, and then we won't keep on about it. Susie is right about manipulation, and we don't want to see you setting yourself up for a false recovery.

You say the boy was away when your wife moved in to his house. Where was he? For how long was he away?

If this woman was your wife's friend, then surely your wife knew her friend's kids for a few years? Why is it impossible for her to have started a relationship? You wouldn't have known about it. It was an affair - designed to be kept secret!

Why not give us the details? We don't know you. We cannot beach your privacy.

If it's a really simple answer such he was living in Europe for five years and never visited home, we can leave this alone and stop bugging you about it!

PDC, women never, ever leave unless there is someone else. Melody is right. Tell her in order to reconcile she must take a polygraph. See what her reaction is to that.