This is what we have all been trying to tell you. Give yourself more time. Stop being so scared and desparate and making quick decisions based on emotioal feelings you JUST experienced, and using the past to justify why you are so, "Sick of it".

Now we are in the holidays, another trigger happy season for everyone. You just went into Plan B again, its been reset, one day at a time, no panic, breathe deep.

Exactly. I'm not saying anything new here, Harmony. I just decided to join the choir.

Maybe having a fresh voice helps... that remains to be seen.

Quit punishing yourself by coming out of this Plan B. It's horrible...

Day 2 of darkness. Burned the note he left me.

Hello Harmony,

Have had some time to look in here today, and first thing is I want to send to you my sympathy and support upon the loss of your dad, even tho belated. He is very much in your life at present, even thru his spirit, your pleasant memories of him, and the positive influences he has had on you.

You have posted alot, and I have read thru most of your more recent posts. I would like to send to you a few of my thoughts, but a little later as have to do the dises and fix dinner. Takes me awhile to do the former - have a dishwasher but have only used it once. For some reason I prefer to do them manually!

Later,

Tom

Hold tight, break him!

Are you keeping busy with other healthy activities so you can get some perspective?

Remember to post, rant, complain how you feel, do anything but..contact him.

Sorry you are going thru all this all in a row and in the holiday season.

Hi Ms. Harmony,

I want you to know first of all that there is a kewl Monday night football game on tonight that I am taking time from to post to you. I am joshing you Ms. Harmony...*s* - there is a good game on, but I wanted to post to you and at least try to offer you some support before I get lost in this Christmas week.

I just wanted to focus on a few things in your posts. First is please don't ever think you are a failure, either in life or your M. I know you really don't, but do not even let those feelings dwell. A failure is someone who doesn't care, who abandons his/her values, and doesn't wish to learn from mistakes. A failure is a football offensive lineman (a blocker for the running back or quarterback) who is too tired, too cold in an outdoor stadium, or too self-absorbed to care if his quarterback gets sacked (tackled) and if the team loses the game due to his lack of effort. Doesn't stay true to his values. Most of us make mistakes and poor choices, and that is your case Ms. Harmony - a far cry from a failure. That same offensive lineman may make some pretty critical mistakes and poor decisions in a game - blow some blocks at times - but cares, and learns, and digs down when it counts and gives best efforts.

The second thing is that I fully understand, and this is not MB necessarily, why you let your H back into your life. To that extent I guess I disagree here with a few who urged you to go by the book. You just suffered a grief event, so yea, you are going to want all the support you have, and from your H at this time especially. That isn't necessarily breaking an MB concept or strategy, it is just simply human nature. I understand, and I know I and many people would have probably done the same in your shoes in terms of inviting your H to the funeral and wanting some solace after with him.

In my mind Ms. Harmony, the most important thing is why you are in PLan B. I sort of felt that you were swayed due to your belief that it is, among other things, a tool to influence your H. My understanding is that it simply is not. Believe it or not, many of us use a short-term 'Plan B' at various times in our lives. I feel that it is not such a novel or mysterious concept. Take a simple example. How many of us ceased communication of any kind for a short time with a spouse, relative, or friend because we feel and/or know they have offended us or caused us to lose some respect or trust due to an offense. An argument, a less than major offense albeit, but offended nonetheless. For example, an argument between H and W because H made made a unilateral decision about spending some money, where to go for vacation, or coming home late from work after spending time with his male friends and not informing W that he would be delayed and why, when W has prepared a romantic dinner for the two of them. Well, mini Plan B on part of the W. Hubby gets the cold treatment, or none at all, is made to sleep in the garage, and certainly no cuddling or SF that night! Why? The W needs time to cool down, process the disappointment, recharge, and and to voice her dissatisfaction by telling H "don't you ever ever ever do this again!" It's a self-defense and protective measure we all exhibit. I have exercised this. Char is in a nursing home - we are separated in that way. A few times, when I cannot have her here, or don't satisfy her every desire she gets on me - sometimes really hard. Not vile or vindictive, but harsh, angry, and sometimes accusatory. In some of those times I retreat. I don't give in or curry, but simply break off the conversation as best I can and not call her for a couple of days. It is my way of avoiding what could become an acceleration by venting back to her and also to recharge and rethink. It isn't to 'teach her a lesson', altho I have to confess that is a minor consideration, it is to relive my stress and the stress of the situation and to evaluate if I did wrong. Hell Ms. Harmony, even Christ had to get away from his sometimes weak-kneed apostles or the public and simply go out and pray alone to simply recharge!

My long-winded observation is this: I wish I could influence you to change your approach to your Plan B. Many on here have advised this Ms. Harm. I am not advising you to a Plan B - that is your choice and decision. If you do continue with your renewed Plan B, then do it for the right reason - YOU. Not to impact your H, influence him, or sway anything. Do it because you need the time, and the peace and quiet to recharge, and objectively evaluate. You are not in the process of a simple argument and one of those 'mini' plan B's, pretty much knowing that the two of you will make up after an evening of him sleeping in the garage, or even a day or so of the cold shoulder approach. Those situations do not involve serious matters of trust and respect, and are easily made up due to the trust, respect, and the passion for the marriage still there. Your's is a possible life altering situation. Your decision, as I understand you, is to decide if he is the guy who has the capability of offering you unquestioned trust, respect, and passion for your marriage. That simply takes humility and devotion from any man - once you know you have that from him - then you will be fulfilled. That has to be demonstrated by OUTWARD SIGNS. Not just a few, as I am sure you fully realize, and not just offering to attend your dad's funeral, getting together with you after, and repaying the 5,000 lbs. These seem manipulating and obligatory on his part to me. Therefore, your going dark, if you choose, is to give you an opportunity to clear your mind and heart for this important decision, and not allow the distraction of him 'dipping in and dipping out'. It is obvious you love him still and respect your M still Ms. Harm, but even so, his rants, raves, intensity, hand-wringing, manupulations, etc., etc. during your plan B is for YOUR good as well as for his. When you feel in your gut, not your heart, but your gut, that he is sincere about changing, then and only then with a clear mind will you be able to make this life decision.

Whew, sorry for being so long-winded Ms. Harmony, but I just wanted to express my feeling that you are so close, but again, somewhat away from doing the right thing for you and your H. Not from past offenses and hurt, but from the standpoint of sharing your life with the right partner. Ya know, I am preparing to have Char here, and our son is now staying with me, and dau. is coming in shortly after Christmas. Yea, lots to do and a little stressful, simply by lots to do, but I would not have it any other way. Then in January, we celebrate, Lord willing, our 42nd! Even tho when I look in her face and eyes, I see someone older than the beautiful redhead that I married back in Jan. of 1969. I know she looks at me and sees a gray-haired shrivled-up Clint Eastwood type of character...*s* I am still happy to be responsible for HER physical and spiritual well-being and happiness.

If I don't get to post to you before, then please Ms. Harm, have the happies and most peaceful Christmas you could possible have.

Tom

Just an afterthought Ms. Harmony,

I forgot to mention that I agree with all the others here who are advising you not to make any life decsions for awhile regarding your M, job, etc., apart fomr implementing your Plan B. When I was in treatment for alcohol addition in '92 I and others were advised that. At the time I felt that was an imposition of my right to decide for myself. I learned it was true tho - a person recovering from any major loss or grief is less likely to make a wise decision. Instead Ms. Harm do some simple things like Bubbles suggested - different, and challenging, and even 'crazy' things. Bake a turkey or a pie and take it to a shelter this season, go to a park and lie down and make a snow angel (I am not sure if or how much snow you have there in the UK) even tho bystanders think you are crazy, fall in love with a cute puppy or cat, buy him/her and take her home, or just take a walk on a peacefull night, look at the moon, and just wonder about the mysteries and challenges of life.

Again Ms. Harmony, best of wishes to you, lighten up, and Merry Christmas.

Tom

Such awesome posts Tom. Seriuosly. Merry Xmas to you and Char.

You want to do something that will take up lots of time and keep you busy?

Buy a turducken and make it.

Ok, I'll bite

"whats a turduken?"

or

" How do you make a turduken?"

Tom,


How can someone "feel" that her H's affair is over? In desperate times feelings can and will delude a person, that is why she needs evidence (NC, agreement and plan for recovery, EP's and actions), not just a gut feeling, that her H is serious about himself, her and recovery. Her H has done "right" things many times and Harmony has momentarily been able to notice that and say that it felt good. Good for her that she has also questioned his motives. In my opinion she needs much more than just a gut feeling, otherwise she risks with false recovery.

End of t/j.

A turducken is a chicken inside of a duck inside of a turkey.

It's absolute h@ll to prepare and takes forever. Some say it takes at least a day...

Day 3 Darkness, who its so dark in here I can't see where I am going!

Awesome post Tom.

Thanks for all your support guys. Hope you understand why I broke PLan B, needed hubbie around, pleased you get that.



This really does make alot of sense, I just have to take the focus off him and onto ME. I have to quit being so needy, and start being properly independant. I also think I need to show that not only to myself but to my H, so he knows I have learnt from my A and that he will be amazed at the changes.

I do already start to see a change in H, he actually seems quite depressed in some ways. Over the past few days when H supported me with my Dad, we did have some good talks. H does not understand why I left him to start a new life with a new man. I explain that I didn't communicate my needs to my H and therefore, let someone else meet them through weak boundaries and poor morals. That I dug a hole and kept digging to run away from myself and my poor choices, I wasa coward. H also said, Harmony you fell in love with the OM! I said it was more like an addiction, I felt that he gave me what I needed but I actually needed it from you! We also talked about the M, pre A, this is quite a difficult subject as H is not so great at accepting responsibility for the state of the position pre A. I have to tread carefully here as he is quite defensive. I just said that I wanted him to make more effort with me, thats all, I felt like he didn't put the effort in the relationship he still does not really get that.

H does seem to be quite down. In some ways it seems to me he is trying to show me what I am missing and how he has grown too. He has cut down on his drinking and stopped smoking, I think he has broken out of his self destructive ways and is just trying to find himself a little. I know everyone thinks he has OW, I really don't think he has, I am not saying he is acting like a saint, that I will never know until we are together and we have EP's in place. I just think he needs to work out in his head whether he can forgive me for my A, whether I will forgive him for his A's and whether he can actually make me happy, as in his mind he gave me everything pre A.

H said he is spending this time on his own, doing hobbies appart from golf and working and that I always 'moaned' at him that he was never interested in anything else.

Anyway, at least we TALKED.

I suppose I am most afraid that he won't be able to give me what I need, love support and care. I think he can, I believe in him.

I hope that at some point, you communicated this exactly to him.

Noooooooooo

Harmony,

You said
You are missing the whole point. What you just said is a DJ, you are making assumptions about him and his capability. What you must do is evaluate based on actions and behavior, not potential.

Just as we expect you actually do what you say when you say it. We cannot assume you will do it, want to do it, or even know you should do it. It doesn't matter. What matters is have you done it. Assumptions are what lead to expectations which leads to resentment.

People have already point this out to you, but you must remember that plan B is for you to protect your love so that recovery is possible. It is not about your H doing or not doing something. It is not about influencing your H. It is about protecting your love. If that is gone, then the chances of recovery are slim.

Please focus on the "data" and not on your assumptions and expectations.

God Bless,

JL

@Harmony -

What is the criteria for starting recovery with your WS?

Hi Clark

It would have to be no contact with other women, commitment to the M and actions which demonstrate he has learnt/grown from this whole process.

Do you think that makes sense?

On another note, went out with an English friend of mine that is over here on holiday from Calgary in Canada. My friend married a Canadaian about 8 years ago and then shehad an affair, divorced her H (not to be with OM but because she said she was unahppy).

Theaffair broke up within months, he became very flaky and supportive and it all crumbled. It made me sad as I feel that she still loves her XH, but won't admit it to herself because she feels that she has to justify the divorce. It seems to me that she was doing what seems to be very common in young marriages, an inability to be able to communicate needs and feelings either positive or negative.

It was difficult talking to her because I wanted to say that you can recover this you know, you can have a new better M, I guess it is pride before a fall.

Miss my H tonight, I want to give him a big kiss