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edit: changed thread title, since it took on a life of its own ...and there's no negotiating with NC!! While talking tonight with my wife, she mentioned to me Her: "OM tried to friend me on Facebook today." I maintained my cool. Me: "I thought you had him blocked?" Her: "Well, I did." Me: "So...why did you unblock him?" (said with agitation, I am sure) Her: "I was curious to see what he would do. He can't message me or see anything I do, you know." Me: "Don't you think he got the hint not to contact you when you told him not to contact you? Why give him the chance to contact you again?" Her: "Well, he'll get the hint that I don't want contact when I don't respond to his request." I verified later that she did indeed ignore his request. I've also verified that she hasn't corresponded with him in any other way. I feel safe with that knowledge, but I don't feel good about her "playing with fire" so to speak. We actually went on to have some really fun UA by playing "Angry Birds" on her Android phone for like 2.5 hrs  * * * * * * I had just read the Dishonesty LB today...and KNEW all about the Policy of Radical Honesty. But I chickened out and only half-assed used it...my bad, totally. But, I think I can at least make up for that...tomorrow, I am hoping. I didn't commit 100% to telling her (tonight) how I felt about finding out that she unblocked this jackwagon (thank you Gunny!). I am gathering my thoughts about how to present it to her, and how to negotiate (just in case). Maybe I won't need to negotiate anything, and she'll realize that she doesn't need to be putting herself in that situation to "fail" again...even though he can't say anything to her on FB or be her friend. But just in case I do... Any advice on using the 4 concepts for negotiating in this particular kind of situation? I am sure others have been through it ***** Here is what I've sketched out what to say to her (if you are interested).
Ok, this was something I read about today.
I will be honest, I half-assed tried to use it tonight when you told me about Corey asking you to be a friend on FB.
I asked why you unblocked him. You explained your reasoning as you wanted to see what he would do.
I thought that you would be able to sense how uncomfortable I was knowing you had un-blocked him...either you didn't because you were distracted by your phone, I was good enough at hiding it, or you simply didn't care. I don't think that #3 was what happened, at least I hope not.
I am going to be straight with you, using the Policy of Radical Honesty:
1. EMOTIONAL HONESTY: Reveal your emotional reactions, both positive and negative, to the events of your life, particularly to your spouse's behavior.
I am feeling hurt and insecure about you unblocking him on Facebook.
One of the things Dr. Harley discusses frequently is: removing things/people/situations from life that you have control over which present opportunities for you to be challenged or to 'fail' (so to speak).
Permanently. No going back. No exceptions.
I am not sure why you would want to put yourself back in that position by unblocking him?
I am not saying you still have any emotional feelings for him. I believe you when you said that at first you did, but realized you shouldn't and so stopped..for the most part...crossing boundaries.
But that is not to say he doesn't still have feelings for you.
By unblocking him, I am not saying you intended to give him any hope of talking to you again....but from the several "just checking how things are" emails and attempts at contact that he has made to you when you expressly made it clear not to contact you, I believe that he does feel some hope that you'll talk to him again.
I wouldn't say he's been stalking you, but if you'd blocked him for a long period of time---he must have kept entering "wife's name" in the friend search box periodically to see if you were available to try and talk to again...and then *poof* you appear and he thinks its OK to try and friend you again.
Please, block him again from FB and don't take it off.
Last edited by Rush_2112; 01/13/11 02:55 PM.
FWH 36 EA/PA NC & D-day 12/21/10
FWW 36 EA / NC & D-day 12/8/10
Married: 12+ years
Together: 17+
Kids: x3
Working together to be better than ever!
There's only the sound of the rain
All the hope and glory
All of the sacrifice in vain
And if love remains
Though everything is lost
We will pay the price
But we will not count the cost
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Her action of unblocking OM is a form of contact. She wanted to see if he would contact her.
No NEGOTIATION. Tell her you will not stand for any openings that will allow OM to contact her.
Your wife is still foggy, if not still wayward.
And, BTW, if she unblocked him, YES, he CAN send her private messages, even if she doesn't friend him.
"Your actions are so loud that I can't hear a word you're saying!"
BW M 44 yrs to still-foggy but now-faithful WH. What/how I post=my biz. Report any perceived violations to the Mods.
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She was being a Jackwagon.
You don't negotiate or POJA No Contact. It isn't like negotiating for her to be more into daytime sex, or for you trying to get home from work earlier, or for you to do the dishes on nights when she has classes, or whatever. No Contact For Life is a bedrock precept to killing affairs. It's the difference between an affair staying dead or being un-dead (with all the ghoulish implications of that term).
She F'd up by unblocking him. You need to convey this to her firmly, although without resorting to an Angry Outburst.
Re: OM, have you considered calling this half-brain-with-no-boundaries to let him know that if he doesn't permanently stay out of your wife's life, you'll devote yours to making his such a living hell that he'll only WISH he were dead? (That way, you're not threatening any specific harm, but you're still giving him something to worry about. It won't hurt to make him think you might even be a little crazy. Unless he's a total crackpot who gets off on that kind of drama (and just by the percentages, most folks aren't), chances are he'll decide she's not worth the hassle anymore. This won't fix your wife, but it might sideline him.
Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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WW is a jackwagon.
She broke NC. She saw OM tried to contact her. She got her OM fix. Remember WW is an Attention Hoe, and got an Attention fix from breaking NC with the OM
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3 "Take no prisoners" responses.
I will be taking the path of no negotiating tonight when we talk.
I was wondering if someone would mention contacting him myself.
I've thought about it....and I think I will.
Although I don't think I can make his life miserable...he already leads a sad existence.
-- Attempted suicide about 5-6 month ago
-- Will be getting a divorce this year after 15y M. Well, this is what he claims anyway.
-- Wife is "psycho crazy" according to him, my wife, and some people I know that know them...so this is confirmed.
-- Doesn't love his wife, nor respect her anymore...so getting her involved doesn't seem to be a big deal (or could it be?)
The only thing he values is his kids, and is going to try and get custody of them (14 & 8).
I do wonder what kind of "fireworks" would be cause if I messaged (or even friended) his wife on FB....
"Your hubby says he's going to divorce you this year, did you know that? I know that because he and my wife were having severe boundary issues during their chats online via Facebook, and thats what he kept telling her. I hear that (insert name) is a good divorce lawyer in your area! Happy hunting!"
Lol
FWH 36 EA/PA NC & D-day 12/21/10
FWW 36 EA / NC & D-day 12/8/10
Married: 12+ years
Together: 17+
Kids: x3
Working together to be better than ever!
There's only the sound of the rain
All the hope and glory
All of the sacrifice in vain
And if love remains
Though everything is lost
We will pay the price
But we will not count the cost
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Posts: 126
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Guess what... HONESTY IS AWESOME!!! While she was in the shower this am, I said to her "Hey, could we set some time aside tonight to talk a little." "About what?" "About (OM) and blocking him on FB." "Oh, you want me to block him again? Sure, no problem." "Yes, please. I should have been honest with you about my feelings about it yesterday, but I am being honest today. It was hurt and insecure about it when you told me. Thought you would pick up on that." "Honey, you don't hint well. Just tell me." "Ok, I love you, and thank you for blocking him again." "I'll message him and tell him again not to contact me if you want me to. Unless you think that is contact." "I'd be just fine with that kind of contact. Thank you for doing that." "No problem, I love you honey." "Love you too. This honesty thing is a learning process for me, but I'm going to work at it." * * * * * W O O O O O ! ! ! !
FWH 36 EA/PA NC & D-day 12/21/10
FWW 36 EA / NC & D-day 12/8/10
Married: 12+ years
Together: 17+
Kids: x3
Working together to be better than ever!
There's only the sound of the rain
All the hope and glory
All of the sacrifice in vain
And if love remains
Though everything is lost
We will pay the price
But we will not count the cost
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Rush,
Further questions should be kept in your original thread so that people can continually keep up to speed with your situation. That is why things go with the "1 thread rule."
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Since facebook is a known connection to the OM, she should ......DELETE FACEBOOK!! Real simple. She has already tried to contact him that way, so it should go. Blocking him can be undone in 2 seconds and she already knows he will seek her out there. She has already been triggered by the FB so it is a known trigger. It needs to be removed.
So many affairs start on facebook that it makes no sense to keep a fb account when it has already affected your life.
My philosophy in life is if you hit by the car playing chicken, get out of the road rather than trying to learn to be a better chicken player. GET OUT OF THE ROAD!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I'll message him and tell him again not to contact me if you want me to. Unless you think that is contact."
"I'd be just fine with that kind of contact. Thank you for doing that." Yes, messaging him on fb *IS* contact. She unblocked him in the hopes he would contact her, and she can unblock him again. She is responsible for cutting off contact with him- NOT HIM. She is the one who opened up the door for contact, and she will do it again unless she removes the temptation. She had him blocked before and was triggered and she will be again. She should simply delete her facebook account and avoid all this. Rush, this is not a negotiable issue if you want to affair proof your marriage. She was triggered via facebook and will be triggered again. The solution is to REMOVE THE TEMPTATIONS. Facebook is not worth it. Just delete it.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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The problem with Facebook is it does not completely delete. She can close it down but if she logs on it activates again. Rush - do you have her passwords?
Gg
D-Day #1 Aug/2007.
D-Day #2 1/27/12
Legally Separated
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You can look at some of these how-to-guides on permanently shutting it down - http://www.wikihow.com/Permanently-Delete-a-Facebook-Accounthttp://www.techbuzz.in/how-can-i-permanently-delete-my-facebook-account.phpBut there is no guarantee that she won't fire up a new account at some point. This is where continued monitoring and rebuilding trust and honesty come into play. You could also put www.facebook.com into the computers hosts file. Google that one because I don't feel comfortable instructing on it. This will block the entire site.
Last edited by Powerbane; 01/12/11 10:30 AM.
Me - 46
Wife - 43
2 x DD
Married 18 yrs - known each other for 22 yrs
Woke up 12/2009 and realized I was an idiot for neglecting my WIFE!
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Although I don't think I can make his life miserable...he already leads a sad existence.
-- Attempted suicide about 5-6 month ago
-- Will be getting a divorce this year after 15y M. Well, this is what he claims anyway.
-- Wife is "psycho crazy" according to him, my wife, and some people I know that know them...so this is confirmed.
-- Doesn't love his wife, nor respect her anymore...so getting her involved doesn't seem to be a big deal (or could it be?)
The only thing he values is his kids, and is going to try and get custody of them (14 & 8). None of this is your problem. I do wonder what kind of "fireworks" would be cause if I messaged (or even friended) his wife on FB....
"Your hubby says he's going to divorce you this year, did you know that? I know that because he and my wife were having severe boundary issues during their chats online via Facebook, and thats what he kept telling her. I hear that (insert name) is a good divorce lawyer in your area! Happy hunting!" Actually, if you have not exposed to OMW, you should do so immediately. She has a right to know what kind of jackwagon she is married to, and to make informed decisions concerning her life and relationship with her WH. I'd drop the bit about a divorce lawyer though.
Me - 44
DW - 39
Married 16 years
DS10
DS6
DD4
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Actually, if you have not exposed to OMW, you should do so immediately. Rush, did I miss something? OM is married and you haven't exposed this to his BW yet??
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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I'll message him and tell him again not to contact me if you want me to. Unless you think that is contact." More freakin' contact. You need to message OM. Not WS. Delete FB. No Contact means No Contact. By WS having Contact WS is continuing the A. You are resetting your Recovery Back to Day 1.
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Nope, I haven't exposed anything to his wife, bliss. I haven't ever felt that it is my responsibility to do so. However... I am teetering on the fence now more than I ever have toward doing so. Do I really think its going to make a difference whether or not he tries to contact my wife again? I don't really think it will. Something he said to her during one of their chats..discussing him needing to possibly move back in with his wife, because the place he was living in was being sold. My wife: So you're going to sit there staring at "T" (his wife) while chatting with me? That'll go over REALLY well.
Him: Wouldn't be the first time I got that look from her.Could be all smoke and mirrors...but I really don't think he values anything his wife has to say anymore. And I don't think she would be contacting him to carry on anything, honestly...maybe I'm just naive, I don't know. She's been honest with me about any time he has tried to contact her. Now granted, why she didn't tell me she unblocked him to begin with....I don't know. That does hurt a bit, but we have talked about it. EDIT: Question...Do I tell her that I am going to email him (and his wife), on OUR marriage's behalf...or just do it and see what he does (or doesn't do)...? * * * * * Here's the start of my email to him, if interested:
Corey,
As my wife had previously told you: Please just give us the time we need to work through this.
But apparently you couldn't, or wouldn't, do that.
So its MY turn to tell you in plain English: stop trying to contact my wife.
You emailed her and messaged her through FB a number of times since she made this request of you on December 9th.
It was all of four days that you gave her before attempting contact.
She showed me that you emailed her on the 13th, messaged her on the 15th, emailed again the 17th....and so on and so forth.
She had blocked you for a reason.
She didn't respond to your emails for a reason.
She thought you would "get the hint" and stop trying to contact her.
I believe you don't care what your wife feels or thinks, but she should (and will) know that you've been looking up old girlfriends and injecting yourself and your "experience" into their marriages.
Whatever "help" you thought you had offered my wife is no longer necessary or needed.
We are rebuilding our marriage the RIGHT way.
The two of us, together.
You always said you'd "walk away for another 10 years".
Do it.
Leave her alone.
No emails.
No contact.
Nothing.
Not just for 10 years.
Forever.
Last edited by Rush_2112; 01/12/11 03:55 PM.
FWH 36 EA/PA NC & D-day 12/21/10
FWW 36 EA / NC & D-day 12/8/10
Married: 12+ years
Together: 17+
Kids: x3
Working together to be better than ever!
There's only the sound of the rain
All the hope and glory
All of the sacrifice in vain
And if love remains
Though everything is lost
We will pay the price
But we will not count the cost
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Do you think OM tells your wife the truth?
Do you think your WW wife tells you the truth?
Let me guess OM says their marriage is in trouble...yadda yadda yadda...she doesn't care.... blah blah blah.
Yes we have heard this more than once here. most likely the OMW has no idea what is going on. Maybe an inkling, but you can't decide for her what she does and doesn't know. you can give her information, and she can do with it as she pleases, but you have no idea what is going on through her head.
Ultimatley it really does have an affect over the affair. It starts straining it from the other end. might as well pull this thing apart from two sides rather than one.
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Nope, I haven't exposed anything to his wife, bliss.
I haven't ever felt that it is my responsibility to do so.
However...
I am teetering on the fence now more than I ever have toward doing so.
Do I really think its going to make a difference whether or not he tries to contact my wife again?
I don't really think it will.
Something he said to her during one of their chats..discussing him needing to possibly move back in with his wife, because the place he was living in was being sold. Oh...yeah...I remember now!  Well, I don't want to get a flaming thread started back up about exposure, but: if YOU don't take the initiative to expose this, who do you suppose WILL? Your WW?? No. She's not going to be a good Girl Scout, here. I'll tell you what's probably going on, here, Rush. OM has been in pow-wows with his BW, he's feeling a Plan B or D coming from her, and he doesn't want to stop cake-eating. So he's figuring that he can have them both. His BW has probably ordered him home as a requirement for their 'reconciliation.' It would be a simple matter to find another place to rent. I would think your fastest horse for ending this A would absolutely be to call OM's wife and give her the goods. Then ask her to help you ensure that they aren't in contact. Up to you, though. I guess you can wait for your WW to out herself, if you think there's a chance in hell of that happening. I don't think there is, but hey. What do I know? 
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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OM,
F*** OFF! Leave my wife alone!
Can you not get a hint?
She has told you to not contact her. If you persist in contacting her we will use all legal means to rectify this.
Since you seem to be a little slow I will reiterate, F*** OFF!
BS
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Direct and too the point, Clark So... Do I "blind side" my wife by telling him myself and not telling her that I am going to do it.... Or do I tell her "Honey, just so you know, I'm going to send Jackwagon and email and tell him to eff-off and leave you alone."
FWH 36 EA/PA NC & D-day 12/21/10
FWW 36 EA / NC & D-day 12/8/10
Married: 12+ years
Together: 17+
Kids: x3
Working together to be better than ever!
There's only the sound of the rain
All the hope and glory
All of the sacrifice in vain
And if love remains
Though everything is lost
We will pay the price
But we will not count the cost
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