This is something from another thread that I've been thinking about ever since I read it and would like to explore a little more. Markos (or anyone) I'm wondering if you have anymore info on this, because I think this may be the root cause of what has been missing in my M. I think this may be an actual EN that I have that I never recognized before (because I didn't really know it existed), and one that my H is having a great deal of trouble meeting.

Does anyone know where I can read more about this, since it obviously isn't in HNHN.

I think the need to be right is an 11th EN for many many many many many people.....

But I could be wrong

Ambition can also be a LB acted out through IB.

But can't lack of ambition be an LB as well?

Maybe ambition isn't the word I'm looking for. Maybe it's more like Passion. A passion for life in general. A drive to make a difference in the world. A passion for knowledge and learning. I guess I'm more thinking of that fire and drive you see in some people to really live life to its fullest, to accomplish something meaningful and larger than ourselves while we're here, to try to really understand why we're here and what we're meant to do with our time on this earth.

I think a lot of people just float through the days. They get up, they go to work, they come home, they eat and do chores and run errands, then they go to bed and start all over again the next day. And that's it. That's all there is. But I could never be happy with something like that. Not that I don't do the mundane things, but if that's all I did, all I ever thought about, all I really cared about - it just wouldn't be enough.

Sometimes, I think that's the big difference between me and my H. And it's a gap I haven't quite figured out how to bridge yet.

I don't know what I did with my HNHN video...

He says things like watching television, playing golf, cooking... and sums it up pretty much by saying "anything can be an emotional need."

If it is causing a "hole," writer, I would say it wouldn't be an 11th, but something higher up the list that you are unable to distinctly describe.

The Harley top 10 are more like broad categories, rather than specific. Because of this, most things should be able to be categorized under one of them; having that specific need listed under that category is how you determine "how you like the need to be met."

If it's enough to cause this "hole" feeling, when it is met, it should be something that causes a bit of a "rush."

So, what things cause that "rush?" If you could list it under the basic 10, where would you list it?

If you've never been with someone like that, you can't know how frustrating and annoying and cyclical it is. Nobody can be UP all the time without mania.

Quiet contemplation and happiness is a virtue.

You're slipping into wayward thinking, writer.

Maybe it would fall into a couple of different categories:

1) Admiration: Not so much the need to be admired, but the need to admire my H.

2) Conversation: The ability to talk about deeper subjects, something other than the details of his day at work or what we're going to have for dinner or some cute thing the baby did this morning.

Those are the two that most readily come to mind and seem to fit the best.

But I'm not expecting an "UP" all the time. What bothers me is a real lack of "Up" ever. It's more just like a constant, straight, flat line.

And I would love quiet contemplation. What I'm missing is any real contemplation at all. It's difficult to connect with someone on a deeper level if their thoughts never go very deep.

Here's a thought; for some, this "floating through the day" happens because either; a) they have no interest in affecting the world around them, or b) they feel that they are affecting their world the the way they best know how.

For some people, changing the direction of the thinking of others, in a way in which they see as positive is the best way to interact with their world.

For others, simply living in the way that they see as a good life is how they interact with the world, or stop the world from influencing them.


"Mundane" is a rather subjective term. For some, watching a football game on TV is very mundane, for another it's exciting.

What you see as mundane may be very satisfying to your H, while utterly boring to you.


Then the first thing to do is identify what this need of yours is, and how it is best met. Then you need to rank it appropriately - if it is in your top 5 then it is something you need to go over with your H so you can figure how he can best meet it.


Random thought; activism is a difficult call to answer if you ever expect to be in a relationship, as "the cause" will consume all of you, and you likely won't see the change within your own lifetime. This is why it is usually best left to young, unmarried people - or people who wish to never marry or have children.

Ok.

1) Sounds like you have a need for him to do things which you see as admirable - you are putting an expectation on him based on your belief. Kind of a pitfall here.

Belaying that, what exactly do you find admirable?

2) When you say "deeper," are you talking about in-depth conversations about anything or about specific things that interest you? Again, it's slippery territory. It's that compatibility farce.

So, you are an author - so what else is in your educational background? What were your educational interests?

What is his educational background, what were his educational interests?

Is there common ground anywhere there? Could either of you brush up on the other's interests to drive conversation?


And educational gap can create incompatibility, but remember MB principals are built to overcome that.

I know that for FWW, she admires how I can get long winded and detailed about nearly any subject - our educational gap is only a problem if I impose my view in conversation (DJ).

Writer
I think I know what you are saying. One thing that came to mind when you said passion is that it can be a good but at the same time a bad thing. Passionate people normally need something to be passionate about, and sometimes it can be things that are not good/positive for the marriage; therefore, it could be classified as a LB. (personal opinion). If this statement even makes sense.

My hubby is an exceptionally passionate individual, but let me tell you that passion can wear a very ugly hat.

As for the people who �float through the day�, I know what you mean but in a general way. I am a very driven individual and I could see how being with someone who is not could potentially cause problems in the relationship. There are some people who are happy accepting �status quo�, I don�t think that there is much that one can do about that. There could be so many reasons for such approach to life; I think you would have to understand the reasons in order to help them realize that there are other ways of living life.

Could these be ENs I think so, but in my opinion these would fall within the existing categories of ENs

Does 'forward' count with you?

My H is not deep, at any level, he's like a shallow pool that you can barely skip rocks on. (DJ! lol...) He's just not like me, he cares about the 'what' and I care about the 'why and how'. You need all of that, so it can be a good combo. If you have a bunch of why's together, you never get to a what. KWIM?

I don't think I'm looking for "activism" so much, but more just a general passion for life, a desire to live life to the fullest, to have varied experiences, to think about/ponder/talk about the deeper things in life. I think for me, the problem is that many of our conversations seem superficial and uninteresting, and therefore don't really fulfill the need of Conversation satisfactorily (and Conversation is one of my top 5 EN's).

Maybe it's a problem with RC as well, now that I think about it. My H and I spend quite a bit of time together, but a lot of it isn't very satisfying. We kind of just do the same sort of things over and over again. RC is up there on my list of EN's as well. But I find myself backing away from it, because I'm not really very interested in WHAT we're doing when we spend time together. This may be a problem, especially if we don't actually enjoy doing many of the same things. Just like Conversation may be a problem if we don't enjoy talking about the same things, which seems to be the case.

So, the question is, how do you solve the problem of meeting these EN's if the individuals involved don't have the same interests and enjoy doing and talking about entirely different things?

This has been an issue in my M for a long time. It almost ended it at one point. I certainly don't want to get to that place again. But I don't feel connected to my H right now, and I want to find a way to change that.

I know what you are saying, writer. As "hyper" as I can sometimes be and as right brained as I am, people who really are "up" all the time drive me crazy....it's like being with a yippy dog 24/7 But drive and assertiveness (not obnoxiousness) makes sense. For example.....let's say we need to get a tire fixed and it's Sunday. I would call all the tire places in the phone book to see if one might be open. DH wouldn't bother calling because "it's Sunday." I am the one who will ask if a restaurant can make so and so without onions because hey, the worst they can do is say no. When I look for a job, I will look on the internet....repeatedly, call, talk to people, look at the paper, send in an app, see if they got the app, see if there's anything else I can do, and while I am waiting see how many other things I can apply for. When DH started applying for jobs last year...he would hear about one, wait to send in anything until he had everything, if he heard about something else he was hesitant to apply for something else because what if the first people call...part of that came from the way the ministry in our denomination works, and he used to be in the ministry.

But I got very frustrated because there just seemed to be no motivation....no umph to take some leadership. He doesn't really like show choir or touring around recruiting. But that's part of the job. So he can be miserable, or he can really fun the heck out of it. I'd rather fun the heck out of it.

You're right about IB CWMI. It has to be balanced. I want my DH to do the best job he can.....but if he starts booking extra concerts and being gone every night of the week....yeah, I wouldn't like it.

These are such intangible type things....it's hard to express. I want my DH to have good work ethic, assertiveness, FS is a top EN of mine......but that doesn't mean I want him to be a workaholic I never see. And I know that balance is possible because there are people out there who do it. My dad did it. He was ambitious and successful, and he romanced my mom and never missed a band concert. It CAN be done.

I hope it doesn't sound like I think my DH is a weinie or something. He is who he is...and his more gentle and passive nature has its benefits too. At least he's not some Bill Gothard/Ralph Cramden hybrid.

You're bored, writer.

That's dangerous.

You had an affair with someone who shares your passion. You have a LONG marriage worth saving. You're a writer. Write your marriage; at the very least write some essays about your ordeal. Sell them.

I have a B.A. in English and an MFA in Creative Writing. My interests are: literature, writing, nature, animals, conservation, spirituality, etc.

My H has a B.A in Communications and is considering an MBA at the moment. His interests are: business, self improvement, philanthropy, time management, finances, etc.

I don't think we have an educational gap, but we definitely have educational differences.

Spirituality and self improvement mesh.

Conservation and philanthropy mesh.

Communications and English mesh.

Writing and business mesh.

Work it out, smarties.

And I think it's very true that my H's generally passive nature does have advantages, and it creates some qualities that I love in him very much, but it also creates some that frustrate the bejeepers out of me, and those are the one's I'm trying to figure out how to deal with right now.

I absolutely agree with your last comment, but they key is that you got to want it, you got to want it bad in order to make it happen. Sounds like your dad made a choice and he wanted to be happy and make the people around him happy.

It�s a choice, a decision one has to make, you can�t force that onto someone, I don�t think!