I hope I'm not being too rough, here, but it is a rant thread. I'm ranting.

The Harleys believe in a very consistent application of the Policy of Joint Agreement. More than once I've heard Dr. Harley talk about politicians or high profile performers needing to build a life that accommodates the desires of their spouse, including giving up the career if necessary.

Rant away!


But if someone offered you a way to make a great living doing those things, you'd want to take that opportunity, right? Especially if it had been your lifelong dream?

This is a much broader topic than it started as. Obviously Facebook doesn't have to be a part of any career, music or not! There are other options.

But, speaking from my own place as a musician by hobby, I do know I'd be pretty resentful if I had an opportunity to make my living through music, but was forced to give it up for my wife. It'd be...tough. We're all human, with human needs and desires and dreams. I won't ever make my wife give up music, though I'll find ways to put up boundaries that protect our M.

Though OM is a fellow musician, he's not a bandmember that tours with them or ever has to see/work with her. That situation would be unnegotiable.

You're 27.

Would you ever imagine you would say the following?


I do know I'd be pretty resentful if I had an opportunity to make my living through music, but was forced to give it up for my child.

Not if it came at the expense of my wife. Seriously.

Have you read about Type A and Type B resentment? It's a Marriage Builders concept, but not in the "Basic Concepts."

I was quite talented on my original chosen instrument and was encouraged to pursue a career in music. One reason I did not was because I wanted to be able to reliably support a family some day. So I did give up a possible music career for my wife. I don't resent it at all.

Music can make a satisfying recreational activity.
One that does not destroy the ones you love.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3350_attn.html


A person could have a non-music-related career and a good marriage and still have 35 hours left over for music. Not having a music related career is not a death sentence for anybody. It's not the amputation of a limb.

If she would choose her career over her marriage, then you are never going to have a great marriage. The higher the priority is placed on the marriage, the better it is. If your marriage is forced to take a back seat to her career, you will never have much of a marriage. If you were my 27 year old son, I would tell you to get a divorce because you won't ever be happy with someone who places you so low on her priority list.

If her career is a threat to your marriage or makes you unhappy then she should be willing to do what it takes to change that. And you can't "force" her to leave her career in a free country, so that is not even a consideration.

I have not, but would love to. Is there a link somewhere? I haven't been able to find it.


I do understand this. FWW is already quite successful and makes more than she did when she worked a full-time desk job several years ago. There'd be more resentment than if it were just a possible career...it's in full swing already, which makes it harder to give up.


Luckily, at this point I'm not GOING to ask her one way or the other--and her career is not a threat to our marriage. Right now. I thought it was for a while, but after the band cut OM out of the picture (thanks, exposure!) it's safer.

I guess I should change this a bit, because I really do agree with you guys. Marriage obviously DOES need to be the top priority. But if I asked my FWW to give up her music career for our marriage in the state it is currently in, she'd say no... because, hell, our M was in poor shape before the A and is in poor shape now, and why would she want to give up her dream for an crippled marriage? Hopefully I can say her answer would be different 6 months from now, after we've really started rebuilding our M and have re-learned how to be happy and have a healthy, loving M.

Stuck Waiting, what YOU need to understand is that there will NEVER be a good marriage if the marriage ISN'T number one on BOTH of your lists. It isn't about the fact that your wife would need to give up anything, she should be putting HER marriage FIRST.

So, you also let her keep her band even though that's where she met OM? What EPs DID your WW put in place?

Yes I "let" her, in that I didn't make a "the band or me!" demand immediately after the A. This would have been stupid because 1) we would not be able to afford our mortgage if she quit the band, and 2) she would've chosen the band and I would have lost my marriage.

In plan A I could focus on meeting her ENs until the marriage DID take top priority again. It's not at that point yet.

EPs: Blocked OM's phone number, deleted from FB, informed the band they could never work with him again. I'm working on building up a LB$, though I know other EPs need to happen, every relationship conversation at this point is withdrawing LB$ so I need to be careful.

He was one of the band's collaborators, so yes, she met POSOM through the band. They will not be working together and there is no risk of an accidental run-in.

Have you ever considered that if everything comes before you that you have nothing to lose? Just keeping a marriage at all costs is not a definition of success. You are young and have very little invested in this person. I would strongly suggest you consider cutting your losses before you have children with this woman.

Unfortunately there's not a lot about it online; it's mentioned in a couple of Dr. Harley's books.

This post has an excerpt about it:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2389170#Post2389170

I agree that makes a difference to some of the concerns which I have mentioned.

However, as far as your marriage ... if it's a problem for your marriage, then none of this makes any difference.

And starting from a foundation that this music career means as much to her as a limb and means more than her to you ... that's an issue for your marriage.

What EPs were put in place to prevent the beginning of another affair with a new person?


I am very confused. Has your wife committed to following a plan of recovery for your marriage, or not?

...none yet. Which is why I'm somewhere between Plan A and recovery. Her going NC with OM was an accomplishment, but chafes against "being controlled" so I'm trying to build up LB$ so we can actually have those kinds of conversations.


Not really, no. We've talked about transparency and EPs but have not created a plan we both agree with that meet all Dr. Harley's criteria.

Do I want to? Yes. But I'm hoping I can broach that subject further soon.

And yes, I've considered divorce. I have enough transparency to know she's still NC, and I hope she'll be open to full MB-style M soon enough. She is still foggy.

What is your time limit on Plan A? And what is your goal? Does your wife know what your requirements for a recovered marriage are?

I'm afraid you are going to tear yourself up like this, my friend, if you stay in some gradual vague place between Plan A and recovery.


This gradualism is gonna kill you (emotionally). Once recovery starts results certainly take time to achieve. But if you take forever to start recovery, you're going to still be here ten years from now in an unrecovered marriage, miserable. Far more miserable than you are now.

Does your wife know that you want a full MB-style marriage?


I'm confused ... are you thinking of picking and choosing which parts of Dr. Harley's plan to follow?


I wasn't suggesting divorce, or even wondering if you've considered it. Maybe someone else was.

rant.....I feel like crying and once again don't really have a place to go......No, I don't expect anybody to do anything about it. I was just so excited about the chance to do something....meaningful. Having God maybe use some of my life experiences to help someone else. But it always gets twisted and lost in the same old crap.

Oh well, I'll stop whining now.