To All<BR>There has been some talk of contact vs no contact. What about when the OP insists on attending the same church of the healing couple (us). Just thought I might get some new input.<BR>

What do you do when you are the OM that your Ws best friend gets attached to? Apparently W filled best friend in on all sorts of information and told her our relationship was week and she just didn't feel about me like "that" anymore. Best friend took advantage to become super supportive to me in my "trials and tribulations" (I didn't realize how bad I had it). But I liked the attention so I allowed it to get closer and closer. Never got physical, but I imagine with time it could have. Anyway, now I am seen as the betrayer for having gotten into this emotional involvement (I don't even know if it qualifies as an "affair") and I'm trying to put things back together. My W apparently missed a great deal from me in our many years together (30+) so I am trying to make up for it now. But as she says all the time, it is just too little, too late. I believe I have lost her and I don't see her coming back to the marriage any time soon. We live together and most days are OK. Not great but not bad. She still can't get over what her friend and "I" did. So we still have some bad days too. Sometimes I get so frustrated that I think it might be better to quit, but then I realize that my W is still the most important person in my life so I keep going. <P>Maybe best friends shouldn't be sharing too much information about their personal life. Especially with OW who appear to be "needy".<P>Fortunately I don't have the church situation to contend with. Since the OW doesn't attend our church, I have been able to find refuge in it and a great counselor in my pastor.<P>Good luck and God Bless<P>Flip

Flipper<BR>I think you are very much on target about sharing too much. The sad thing is you really need someone to share with (besides your spouse of course). Intimate things are just the ammunition someone needs to hit you right where you are weakest. Don't have any great advice, just keep trying. I can relate to how hard it is to take the friend thing though. The sistership of two women is a very strong bond and once broken is devistating.<BR>

D&W:<P>What do you do when the W is the one that gets you to help the OW with just about everything. It was almost like pushing me on the OW. In fact, that was one of the OWs theories. She figured that my W was so blatant in her disclosures and combined that with always trying to get us together, even when I preferred not to or had other things to do. So after awhile we started talking and soon we were feeling sorry for each other. I really didn't know how bad I had it until I started to listen to the OW and her interpretation of what my W had told her. My W told her we didn't even have sex anymore and I probably couldn't even if I tried. So the OW figured she might be able to help me overcome my"problem" (I didn't know I had one). So now I pay and I didn't even get to play. Now I can understand how a lot of folks think that emotional affairs are worse than physical ones. My W says it would have been a lot better for all of us if I had just had sex with the OW. It wouldn't have hurt as much. Is that really true?<P>Flip

Wow, do you really believe she was pushing you together? I know in my situation he was always helping her but she has the helpless routine down pretty good. So do you think your wife wanted something to happen or test you or do you think she was really looking for a way out herself? <P>About the sex thing, I don't know, I seem to go back and forth on that. Some days I wish they had (in my case it was an EA only)because maybe that would have been the end as long as that's always out there then that seems to the reasonable end to the emotional road they were on BUT... most days I am soooooo glad they didn't because that really is a special bond I don't want anyone else to share. But the emotional thing is a very special bond also and very hard to get past. What was her point in saying that? <BR>I don't know does hurt have degrees? Isn't it like black and white there really isn't a gray is there? You only know how much something hurts when you have something more painful to compare it to. I guess maybe this is getting close to the worst kind of hurt.I do feel for her though I know I struggle daily and my H and I are actually doing very well, considering. I feel for you too, I feel very lucky or blessed to be coming out of this as well as we have. I hope she can find a way to move on to better things with you. Does she want to try? I used to feel my H had caused me to waste 2 yrs or so of my life with lies and cheating but now I have to look at it like now I have been given the chance to have a great rest of my life and thankfully it was only 2 yrs for me, lots of people have it worse. Does she write to the forum? If you can sift through the bitterness there is a lot of good stuff here. I'm going to bed now early BBall games in the morning.<P>Have a restful night.

D&W<P>I didn't think my W was pushing us together but when the OW started talking about it I guess I started to think. The fact is that I was in a rather "needy" state myself so I was weak and ready to be had. <P>I don't think I could have handle a sexual affair and still want to come back to my W. I'm very serious about sex and love and I don't think I could just have a casual sex "thing" without some sort of committment. <P>My W has seemed a bit lost for a number of years. She involves herself in her volunteer work and church and that seems to help her deal with what she now tells me is loneliness.<P>Fortunately, there wasn't any outright lying in my situation. It was more of what was not said. I never told her what was going on and she never asked. It was the OW who inadvertently spilled the beans. <P>I cut off all contact with the OW 18 months ago and have concentrated on working on my marriage. but it still heeds a lot of work. Sometimes I don't think I have the strength to continue, but God is good so I I just keep plugging along.<P>goodnight all<P>Flip<P>

D/W, Flip, Keystone:<P>I've been lurking the forum for quite a while now and finally got the nerve to say something. I guess everyones in bed now and that's probably where I should be, but I couldn't get over how similar we all are. Especially Flipper. <P>I have always been the helpful type and I kind of got caught in a situation with my Ws best friend because I wanted to be helpful. I guess I just got too helpful and the OW just got a lot closer than she should have. Especially since she had her marriage broken up many years before by an OW. She always said she would never do what her best friend did to her, but I guess she had a short lapse. I guess I'm not without guilt. I let her do her thing and I guess I was enjoying it. I somehow felt that after 25 years my W just wasn't loving me anymore. In fact she told me that she loved me but wasnt "in" love with me. Boy I've seen those words all over this forum.<P>To add to the mess, she began spending a lot of time out of town visiting one of our sons, family,friends, and taking care of a very sick cousin who later passed away. Meanwhile she was taking care of our Uncle who was quite ill and needed a lot of attention,unfortunately, he also passed away.<BR>I guess those two deaths really took it out of her.<P>While taking care of her gravely ill cousin she admits to developing a "Special Bond" with her cousin's husband (now widower). We realized that we were having a pretty rough time in our marriage. Nothing was getting resolved. In fact, we even discussed divorce. Things were getting so bad that I suggested she take a couple of weeks to go visit her family and decide what she wanted to do. However, before she left, she discovered her best friend's betrayal and she packed up her things and went to "visit" her new best friend (Cousin's widower). She claims nothing happened between her and the OM and I believe her except that I'm convinced that they did have an emotional affair. She refuses to believe or acknowledge that, but I overheard telephone conversations that definitely demostrated a strong mutual feeling. The minute I ask about her and the OM she gets angry and changes the subject and then lays it all on me and my involvement with the OW.<P>Anyway, after three weeks away, I called her and told her that I would cut all ties with OW if she would just come home. She did, in body but not in spirit. <P>It's been one long year. We have tried talking and it works sometimes but often it just makes things worse. She still has her stuff at the OM house and I don't know when she will bring it back. Sometimes we seem happy but most of the time it's just a delicate balancing act. Do these things ever get resolved, or do we just go on thinking about what happened in the past.<P>I've read a lot of Steve Harley's material and I have been trying hard to identify and take care of my Ws most important needs, but she isn't really interested in discussing my needs at this time because it just doesn't seem to suit her. So I have take the role of the betrayer even though I truly believe we can share that role. But for now I am willing to be the betrayer, if it means we can get closer to some resolution. The biggest problem is that I just don't expect my W to love me anymore and that saddens and fustrates me to no end. It is very difficult to try to meet her needs when I am left to believe that she just doesn't, can't, or won't love me the way I need to be loved. In fact, she won't even discuss the issue if it concerns her.<P>I guess that is why I picked my user name, because I'm still sitting here.<P>Patiently Waiting.<P> <p>[This message has been edited by Patiently Waiting (edited November 13, 1999).]

Just moving this back to the top. Fast Forward--We have been visiting other churches and have not seen much of ow for the past 3-4 weeks. The no contact is really helping in the healing process<BR>D and W

D&W,<P>I have sort of been following you posts, but just caught up today. I would like to offer you somethings to think about with regard to joining a new church.<P>I spent most of my youth moving with my family. Since we had always moved I, as a child, always assumed that it was supposed to be that way. Even as a adult I moved frequently, until I reached my 40's. I have now lived in one place for 17 years. Many people have asked me, how as a children my sisters and I could move so much). The short answer was that we like most kids of military families did not know any different. But as I have gotten older and watched my children grow up in one place, I can see how much we had to overcome.<P>After this rambling, here is my thought. You will being doing your children a great favor by changing churches. They will learn how to meet new people. They and you will learn how to learn about and accept new points of view. They will learn that no matter where you live on this planet people are the same when it gets down to basics. (They want their children to be healthy, prosper, and live happy lives and that all children love to play). Finally, they will learn that the people and friends they had at the current church will not go away, they are simply incresing the number of people they know and understand. When they are adults, they will run into people from your old church, and be happy and connnected to them for their shared past.<P>And finally, all of this applies to you and your H as well. This is not a penance but an opportunity to do something you would not have done because you and H were too comfortable. Actually, from the sounds of your posts, this affair could be viewed in that way as well. Through all of the pain, you and H now realize that you have choices in a marriage and they do not go away at the day of the wedding. You both now know that you would chose each other again.<P>I understand the pain you two had to go through, but you are now reaping the benefits. Look at them as such and enjoy all of the new adventures, your new knowledge of each other is providing.<P>God Bless You and Your Family

JL-<BR>Thanks for the encouragement. We have visited several churches over the past few weeks and although we have not yet found one to call "home" we have met some very nice people and had a chance to experience some denominations which are similar yet different. It is so nice to be able to attend church without feeling like I should be watching over my shoulder and wondering what she is doing.<P>I would have to agree that overall this situation is turning out to be more of a positive than a negative. I feel very fortunate to be having a second chance to get my marriage to the point it should have been all along. I read others posts here and almost feel guilty. On the other hand, it hasn't been easy for us either and I feel like we have both worked really hard to turn this around. That really is a key, BOTH people wanting to make it work and be willing to move beyond the past.<P>Thanks again for your input.<BR>D and W

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