Exactly.


This is the FWS side of you talking. The BS side has a harder time seeing this part, because we didn't screw it up. The WS side? Hates what happened, wishes it would go away.

Only time and care can make it "go away."


And, maybe... just maybe, acknowledge your own small steps a bit?


I can't answer that. Apparently I do something (according to FWW), but I really don't feel like doing ANY "work." All I do is try my best to meet her EN's, allow her to meet mine. Screwin up on UA time, though.


FWS side again. When I slump, it frustrates FWW quite a bit. Both you and your WH/BH are responsible for sloughing heaps of pain on each other - and then it goes back to that "fix it now" mentality. That part of you that cares for your spouse goes nuts when you see them in pain, and even more so when you know it was your decision that did it.

You could always ask your BH/WH. Just don't get clingy/needy/desparate about it. Not daily review... but maybe once a week, or every other week, practice talking about things using "I love it when you/I would love it if you" statements.

So how do I react when I see that he sent his XW an email that said "so how old will you be?" Because if I tell him what I want to it will be an AO and a major lovebuster. I have asked him why does he have to talk to her unless it's about his DD13? He says it is to keep the peace. On a positive note when she was emailing me and telling me she did not want to hear from him unless it was "business" about their DD13. I told her you need to tell him this and she said she has and then he gets all I'm going to "punish" you on her. I told her don't respond to him and/or tell him you need to be asking your wife these things, which she did.

This is the same XW that forwarded me the emails that he sent her when he was deployed.

Sunday I let him push my buttons and I didn't do a very good job by walking away because I was in the truck driving and he kept going. So I said some horrible things. My DD13 told me last night "mom your mouth was really bad yesterday and not that dad didn't deserve it"

I apologized (in the truck on Sunday) to her for doing that in front of her.

Then I see the email it was in his sent folder that I have the email too and so he didn't delete them. He is doing this from the bathroon again from his phone.

We make two steps forward and then a mojor jump backwards.

I'm so frustrated because I don't know if he will ever get out of freeloader mode.

Ughhh!! What should I do?

What is a good way to get my WH to get interested in MB? I have many of the books and have them out and laying around.

I also read the website in front of him and try to talk about some of the stories on here.

He says he has gone on here and looked a bit.

Or should I just continue to make lovebank deposits and not push anything?

This is where I need to come to vent, correct? Get advice so I don't do more damage?

Well yesterday we went to the gym and this gal that has made attempts at my WH in the past came up and was talking to him. There were other guys around but he talked to her anyway.

So I told him that it bothers me that she is so comfortable to come up and talk to him and he doesn't stop it. I know he still has weak boundaries and he has made some strides. He isn't texting his ex unless it pertains to the kids.

So please tell me if I handled this right. I told him I didn't like that he allowed her to talk to him and he said she wasn't talking to him she was talking to the other guys and then said some things to him.

I told him without an AO but I do think it needs to come from him to tell her to stop. He says I'm tripping and making a bigger thing out of this.

What am I missing? What should I be doing differently? How do I ever know if he will stop being wayward?

So I don't expect a response since I haven't had any responses to my last three posts.

I am floundering because I am not sure if Im on the correct path.

Everytime I ask him to talk he doesn't want to. He isn't working right now (again) and it is hard not to have resentment when Im the one always to hold a job.
Also he thinks it is ok to email other women and Im not just talking his exes.

It is really difficult to talk about anything. I told him I want a polygraph for my birthday and he said ok then proceeds to tell me its so easy to trick those and that he has nothing to hide. This is what he always says because he still denies everything.

So when I try and talk he just says its me being crazy. He thinks the stuff I learn on MB is not for everyone.

We have a facebook account together and one of

Brainhurts, it's the weekend, so responses will be light. Hang in there, you WILL get responses (See? I'm responding!).

I took the lazy way out and read the first hundred or so of the posts in this thread and then came back here. So if I'm out of joint, it's my fault and I apologize.

What I read is someone who is on the edge of using Marriage Builders concepts with a spouse who is completely out of loop on them. Without the both of you first facing up to the idea that you WANT this marriage, and then committing to WORKING on it, you're simply just going to be going around in circles.

Would you consider counseling with the Harleys? Is your husband up to the task, or is he coasting on "it is what it is?" You can call and speak to the Harleys separately (which is how they work, anyway) and they can put together an ACTION PLAN that can help you build a stronger, loving marriage.

But it's going to take the both of you to do this.

Do you have any of the books Dr. Harley has written? The articles on this site are a good introduction to the principles he's developed over 35 years of experience in the field, but the books (which are very easy to read -- Dr. Harley has a very clear writing style) spell them all out in depth.

There are worksheets and questionnaires, too. There is an online course and a radio program (you can listen to episodes of the program here.

You CAN get the marriage you want! But it takes work and commitment. Your marriage must take priority over jobs, friends, hobbies, vacations and other interests. When you have the marriage you desire, the rest of these will all come naturally.

I think you are floundering because you lack a certain degree of self control.

If your path is MB, you must exhibit self control.

How can you expect your H to become interested in MB when his experience is that you have not learned much from MB when push comes to shove?

Do I make myself clear?

Imagine this:
You are soft spoken and graceful even when stressed.
You never love bust H with verbal assaults in order to gain the temporary release of your tension.
You are a safe place for your H to expose his tender underbelly.

So, now you have a response.
What do you think about it?

PS

That last post was a challenge, in case you were not aware.

I challenge you to examine your lack of self control, and to manage your tension/anxiety in ways that are not destructive to your marriage.

Are you a heavy drinker?
Do you rely on any chemical romance to manage your anxiety?

Thank you so much for the responses.

First Fred, yes I have the books HN/HN, Lovebusters, SAA and I have Buyers, Renters and Freeloader coming.
I talked with Dr. Harley while my WH was deployed.
I spent alot of time working on myself and I obviously still have a long way to go.

I know how much time it takes to work on the marriage but I don't think he wants to. He says he does but doesn't want to do anything to do it.

Thank you Pepperband for the strong post.

First of all no Im not a drinker but I do have problems with anger and I have been trying very much to work on it.

He is very good at pushing my buttons and he likes to fight and I struggle with not being dragged down to that.

Yes I see your point that Im not making things safe or pleasant to want to do MB.

Unless we are talking about him or his things we don't talk. He doesn't ever ask about my day, which I am again the only one working.

I struggle with all the resentment that we've done in our relationship and then the stress of the finances. I would like to counsel with the Harley's but with him out of work it's not going to happen.

So I need to keep working on my self control.
Does anyone have any hard plans on how to work on this? Am I missing anything else?

There are different sources for anger.

Having said that, in marriage, the source is often resentments due to feeling that you are making a sacrifice that is:

A. unappreciated
B. not reciprocated
C. "not fair"

Then, your TAKER responds in anger.
Because, you did not get the results you had hoped for.

**** interrupted post ****
Just purchased 6 boxes of Girl Scout Cookies.
I need an intervention
*************************

Your marriage is in desperate need of POJA.
*** LINK *** to Buyers/Renters/Freeloaders thread and POJA discussion

Yes I have major resentment that turns into anger.
I have resentment because he has never been completly honest about all his affairs.

I also have major resentment that he is out of work again.
I read that thread again and also ordered Renters, Buyers and Freeloader.

You're correct Pep that my anger is not making a romantic feeling for my WH.
How do you POJA when there is so much unresolved?

I know I need to keep working on my anger. How do you not have resentment when they don't want to work on anything?

Your Giver is in charge of making renter-style marital sacrifices.
When your needs are not being met because of your giver-sacrificing, your TAKER takes charge and then ~~~> look out

The trick is to manage your GIVER.

Stop making sacrifices that leave you feeling dissatisfied.

Stop focusing on this:

"I need to keep working on my anger."

Even if you were not angry, you'd still be in a lousy marriage.

You need to POJA.
You need to be honest.
You need to start small and work POJA up to bigger issues.

So I have been trying not to be such a giver.

I've been trying to say things like "it hurts me when you or I don't like it when you"

I've even asked him can you help around the house or read up on MB since you have the time and he won't.
He says he does but when I ask questions about things like POJA or Open and Honesty he acts like he doesn't know what Im talking about.
I feel like we go in circles.

So I can't shake this feeling that something is up. I'm tired of snooping but I know I have to keep doing this.

I know my taker is coming out and I can't help it but I have so much resentment and anger.

He is home and we aren't working on the marriage. It just keeps going in circles. I know that he is addicted to the romance you get when you are first with someone and he runs from responsiblity and that is why he has affairs.

I just am tired of having a crappy marriage and the only one working and the only one applying for jobs for him. I'm not doing this anymore, even though I know it will hurt us in the pocket book and put more stress on me to work more hours.

I am tired of my DD and I being the only ones who cooks, cleans. I handle all the finances.

He needs a mother not a wife and I'm tired of being a mother.

I've tried POJA. How do POJA with someone who doesn't even want to take the time to listen to what POJA is all about? I have thought about linking some of Dr. Harley's articles to him but he won't read them.

How do you get your spouse to adhere to EP and have Boundaries if they won't do it on their own?

It's really causing me many problems because I see all the problems that occur when he doesn't have boundaries in place. It makes me out to be the bad guy. I worry that instead of putting boundaries in place, he is just going to try and hide things more.
I told him I don't feel safe or protected in our marriage to him.

If I he won't stop being a cake eater do I go into Plan B even if the affairs have stopped?

This was just about right.
Was this a calm statement or a statement made with arms crossed?
Watch your body language.
I suspect you say a heck of a lot more , and voice your resentments & anger, with your body than you do with your words.


What do you want to do?
Are you ready to give up before you have mastered YOUR self control?
Are you ready to abandon your self improvement because H is not in the growth stage you think he ought to be?

Are YOU in the growth/learning stage you want to be?

Really? What do you want to do?