ABC what's new?

hi,
her family is no longer in any contact with me
my wife and me were texting and had a couple phone conversations but now she refuses to contact me again...she is in NC with me...she became angry when i tried to teach her about the "fog" etc...didn't help

back to square one at this point

No maybe not. Don't educate her - is she still with OM? Do you know that or not?

You won't get remorse or be able to explain anything to her for a long long time.

When did you make her mad? Wait a week and call again. No lectures, no pressure. Ask her for coffee if you can.

she's still with him
i was trying to use "education" to get through to her..didn't work
it's been a couple weeks...i'll try in a week to see if she'd be willing to get coffee..our anniversary is actually in a week however i don't want to contact her on that day...

Did you read section on plan A?

Make as many deposits as you can. And then go black when the time is right.

Glad you didn't send the texts. Good job.

Education never works with a WS.

Yep, figured that out the hard way

I figure I'll give her space for two to three weeks and then try to see if she wants to meet up...I'm only in the same town for 2 more months so not much time left...if it doesn't work in that time period, i guess that's that

Or you could tell her to pound sand and walk away from a woman that doesn't deserve your attention or love.

You have no kids with this woman. What's there to save other than your pride?

Seriously, she's not worth it. She cheated, you have no kids. Divorce and let her go.

Too many good women out there to waste your tears on this one.

abc,
I just got caught up on your thread and, while its true that your wife is rewriting history to justify the affair, I have seen little discussion regarding your own behavior in the marriage. It seems a lot of her claims have been written off as foggy, but you have admitted to yelling and screaming at her when she cries. Those are not the actions of a "man", meaning a man of character.

What are YOU doing to get yourself to a point where you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that you won't emotionally abuse the next woman you are with? I think you should start outlining your own personal development. I would start with an actual heartfelt apology for your treatment of her and what you are doing about it to grow as a person. And do NOT even imply that such growth is related in any way to her coming back. You are doing it for you.

I have done lot of soul searching and recognize my mistakes mostly angry outbursts. Either way that's something I'm working on along with the other lovebusters.

Today is our 2 year anniversary...do I even bother emailing her or anything about it...she continues to be angry and doesn't reply to anything anyway....

Why not? Just don't educate or over do it.

Remember needy is unattractive.

I was on the radio show on 4/4/2011. I asked my brother in law to listen...he sent me an email response today, it obviously hurts...a lot:

I have taken a few days to think about what I was going to say to you aftertaking some time to ponder the radio show that you were recently on. I have of course as an older brother in law tried to be objective. I will be civil,although honest. This is of course my sister that we are talking about.

You will undoubtedly read things that will upset you and I will be bluntly honest but it is imperative you read the email in its entirety.

I want to start by saying that in the very beginning when I first heard of the separation, I, like my entire family would come to be, was shocked, not just because of the fact that it happened, but because I was worried about my sisters happiness and well-being- how this could happen to someone like her was beyond me, because if anything she had a knack for building and keeping relationships with people - and she has a real affinity to people all of whom are immediately and forever impressed by her.

I cannot say the same for you. I never liked you. [goes on to state reasons he never liked me]. Even at that time if someone were to ask me if WW deserved better, I would have answered a resounding 'yes!'

Still with me I hope?

Now - as for this 'affair'.- it exists only in your mind. It amazes me that you actually believe you are being a hero and trying to 'salvage' this marriage and are fighting against this [racial slur] as you like to insultingly refer to him in
an effort to get your estranged wife back from him because he has totally brainwashed her, and made her forgotten who she is - no - you did that - you pushed her away. But, she isn't brainwashed, and she hasn't forgotten who she is, if anything, her courage had shown her that she needed to get out and
away from you.

I was so stunned and hurt to know that wife, who has incredible inner strength, actually was driven to having feelings of dying and possibly even suicidal ideation because of your behavior and anger outbursts. READ THAT LINE AGAIN! You drove her to feelings of death. You drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.You
drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.You drove her to feelings of death.
HOW MANY TIMES do you need to read that until it sinks into your stubborn mind?

You go to these 'experts' and shows begging for answers and are complimented and commended for your 'courage' and told to 'hang in there' like you are almost a martyr. However, did you tell any of these people the full story? NO YOU DID NOT
- as far as the radio show goes I did not hear:

-How you 'dutifully' informed work and her colleagues
about this 'affair' that she is having and embarrassed her and attempted to tarnish her hard earned and flourishing young career
-How you either had wife followed or hired a private investigator as you told her once
-How you took $10,000 from wife that you felt you were owed immediately - this really does not suggest you are interested in saving anything except 'your' money
-How you continued to harass her into trying to have coffee with you
-How wife earlier on in the year before the separation tried on at least 2 separate occasions to get you to go seek marriage counseling to which you refused in a rude manner

You get advice based on only 1/4 information - and not all truth. Trust me, if you had told the radio show any of the above, they would have asked you to seek serious help and that wife did the right thing in leaving you - they almost
turned off on you the moment they heard of the suicidal ideation - your 'martyrdom' was only hanging on by a thread at that point... at which point you divert people's attention with this 'affair' once again minimizing your abusive behavior...

It seems easy enough to do - but I ask you to put yourself in her shoes - How would you like it if someone informed your futurework placeof your abusive nature and threatened a career that you have only begun? You didn't call her program to 'save your marriage' - you did it to embarrass, humiliate, control and punish her.

I tried to be a great brother-in-law to you for my sister. I even gave you some true and heartfelt advice to save your marriage in the beginning - because I love my sister. Your antics have shown me nothing more than your continued manipulative and abusive behavior - you my friend SERIOUSLY need the counselling.

As far as I'm concerned, as far as my entire family is concerned - the marriage is over. We are behind wife 150%. As far as the 'camp' that supports you - there isn't one. In the end your own family and friends will see how you mentally abused wife and drove her away - your 'excuse' of an affair is the
only thing you can all pathetically cling to in order to somehow justify your behavior and pat yourself on the back for 'salvaging' a marriage that was already over purely thanks to you. Ask yourself - if she were to come back to you today after your continued destructive and manipulative behavior, how could you possibly move forward?

I will state this only one time - any further communication by you or your family to anyone in our family, friends, relatives, colleagues that is not purely related to the divorce will be viewed as harassment and will be taken and dealt with as such. Do not contact any of us again by any means.

dear abc,

I have just followed your thread through in one sitting. Believe me, it strikes a lot of chords.

But as for your BIL's email, I would say you needn't be hurt about at all: I'll let the veterans respond to how/what you approach this with. I can only say that I have heard it not only here but on many other similar sites that people who think "affairs arent such a big deal" - dont know it till it happens to them. Many seem to think of it as an ill of the times/societies they live in. In no way do they realise (until it were to happen to them), that it is worse than the loss of a house or even a child, or being raped. (I lost my closest friend, father figure and mentor last summer and it was nothing compared to the torrent of pain I was already going through). His belittling you about the exposure is so out of whack that it is not even worth a response. If his family and his sister were so sensitive about her career and reputation, she should have given a second thought to skanking around and f'ing another man (figuratively or otherwise) while being married.

The affair is and can never be justified by the bad marriage, no matter how bad. Your BIL is not thinking of this but, if she were so distressed, she should've left the marriage well before she started the affair.

If you had been abusive (and I've seen this many times on the forums) the abuse of the affair far overshadows it. No doubt, this is no excuse for your abuse, but it takes 2 to make a bad marriage and she is 50% responsible for the state of your marriage before the affair. Man up, take responsibility for your weaknesses and failings, but in no way, shape or form - should your BIL's words or her friends acceptance of her adultery - allow you to think that her affair is justified because of your behaviour.

Lastly, I would like to say, please take the advise of the many vets here, you cannot put any value on this advise. I'd have paid my entire lifes wages to have had this advise when I needed it most. Please, please, please do as they say and follow it up with learning from thee MB site, the Harleys books and the forums.

BR

bxhubby

(My nasty reply thought to your BIL would be) "So she was thinking of killing herself and she ends up in bed with her boss-how does that figure?"

what i've learned (besides the right way to be a husband) through this is the fine line between love and hate...a year ago she probably loved me more than anyone on the planet and now she probably hates me more than anyone....still trying to come to terms with that...i know i am biased but he states he's trying to be objective and then does no such thing....i wish i had never married her

I exposed my STBXWH affair with the military. He and OW are being investigated for adultery. I had lots of evidence, and so far it is still on going. My STBXWH was mortified by my filing the investigation. He used to tell me daily that I am the most revengeful person he met, and the investigation was nothing but me trying to hurt him. I tried to let him know I did it for our four kids so they know this behavior is never exceptable, but he doesn't want to hear that.

My MIL told him I am a horrible wife, and how could I be with someone so disrespectful to invade his privacy. OW is good friends with MIL and life is just peachy. MIL, OW, and WH cannot even begin to comprehend the devastation to my four babies (7, 5, 3, &1). MIL told WH, "You cannot help who you fall in love with." and "You deserve to be happy WH, and if that is with OW, then horrible wife will just have to accept that." "I cannot believe horrible wife will not be friends with you today. For the sake of the kids she should just get over herself. You are better off without horrible wife because she is just down right mean to you, and you deserve better."

I am so happy MIL is another country because my babies never have to see or be part of her ever again.

I do not reget exposing this to his entire unit not only in the states but also at his deployed site. He and OW will have a hard time getting their military careers in order now that all this is under their belts. Today WH and OW are in fantasy land. I am just sitting back with my babies having a great life for us.

People keep telling me there is a fine line between love and hate. The stronger the hate for someone the deeper the love is also.

My WH hates me today. I know deep down I fill many of his EN's and once he gets home from deployment away from mommy (who fills many of the same EN's that I fill) he will be hard pressed to get all his EN's from OW. OW is a horrible narcissistic woman, and all she cares about is herself. Unfortunately my WH fell into her trap. I don't see it lasting that long.

abc089, of course she hates you. But not for something you are but for interfering her affair!

Why did you ask BIL to listen the show - what was the outcome you hoped? He said he has never liked you - didn't you know that?

I think you should go to plan B. The more you communicate with WW and her relatives the more you stay in the picture for demonizing. As long as you do that, they can fuel the affair by scapegoating you. Do not allow that, remove yourself entirely from the situation. Then the affair is forced to face reality 100%.

So I asked my lawyer to start discovery so i can eventually depose my wife. I have also asked another lawyer to begin alienation of affection lawsuit. My lawyer received a letter from her lawyer to immediately end all contact (i've been emailing and texting her) or risk a restraining order or criminal charges of harassment. Guess plan A is over -- forced to do plan B.

anyone have suggestions for healing...i'm really having a hard time coming to terms with the fact that MY wife is cheating...the fact that her very traditional asian parents aren't doing anything to stop it...

it's not so much the impending divorce but the fact that she's cheating and that we never did what a "normal" divorcing couple would usually do aka try to work things out etc

thanks