Received notice today from my attorney that I can no longer be in "plan b" and if I refuse to not contact my WH when it comes to the children and such, they will take me to court and FORCE me to. If I don't, I will be in contempt of court. Great.... first I am the one who gets left by my idiotic WH who thinks the grass is greener elsewhere. Now, I can't even HEAL b/c I have to have constant contact with this moron.

anyone else have this problem? Ugh... so sick of the crap!

neverlosefaith, many WS's make these kind of threats to force you to contact them. Your attorney needs to get off his [censored] and defend you from this. There is absolutely no information that needs to be conveyed that can't be conveyed through an IM. I would tell your attorney that you are following the best plan for your mental health and for your marriage that is prescribed by leading psychologist, Dr Bill Harley and he needs to defend you.

Keep in mind that most attorneys only want to facilitate an "amicable divorce" so they will take the lazy, easy way if allowed. If you have any trouble wtih this, I would email Dr Harley and ask him to write a letter for you.

We have had other WS's pull this stunt, and one such BH's attorney presented the information below to the WS's attorney and they dropped the threat. Keep in mind, almost EVERY WS threatens legal action when their BS goes into Plan B, it usually blows over when the BS doesn't run scared at the first shot. The last thing the WS wants is to have you explain in court WHY you don't want to be around him.

This is what another member used to neutralize this threat:

Plaintiffs' adulterous affair has been traumatic to the entire family, most especially the defendant. Reknowned psychologist and leading US expert on adultery and families, Dr. Willard Harley, author and founder of Marriage Builders, likens the trauma of an affair to rape. It is Dr. Harley, among other experts, who recommend ceasing direct communication with the adulterous spouse to lessen the emotional pain of witnessing the affair first hand.

Dr. Willard F. Harley, Jr:

Quote: "The problem with a coninuation of contact is that it usually leads to severe emotional symptoms, including years of post-traumatic stress disorder, even when the [wayward spouse] eventually returns. Many women that I've counseled actually have nervous breakdowns in their effort to draw their wayward spouse back to them."



Dr. Deena Stacer, Ph.D, Founder and Director of the San Diego County High Conflict Intervention Program, recommends ceasing contact for a minimum of two years in order to protect the children:

Quote:In a breakup or divorce, with children, there may be high emotion and tension between the parents. This tension creates anxiety for the children as well as the parents. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, body language and in their parents behavior. To significantly reduce the amount of tension for all the family, the parents should follow two simple rules for the first two years, in order to control the communication and contact between the parents.

Number One: Eliminate all face-to-face communication between the parents, {including telephone contact} for a minimum of two years.

Number Two: all communication should be done in writing, using a memo format.

Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children.

Coparenting often fails, because it assumes that the parents can eventually get along. Our program assumes that with every interaction between the parents more anixety results creating less ability to agree of child sharing issues. If parents couldn't coparent while together, the gap now is wider between them since separatation and their anxiety level is increasing due to the ongoing court conflict.

Our program focuses the parents away from their feelings of failure to communicate and redirects their anger at each other to bonding more closely with their children instead.

High Conflict Resolution Program

He knows. WH says that I am not communicating with him about the kids and is not getting info about the kids like he should. Uh, d-a is NOT asking for it. I am not offering it up to him either. I already told my attorney that my counselor felt it was a great idea since I really am having a hard time moving past of the crap he is doing with OW and ALL of her family (parents, siblings, etc).

Apparently my attorney received an email from his attorney. I have since read some of the insensitive emails that sent to the IM. Misses the kids...not me. I am not his family, nor will I ever be. get the divorce over with and move on. Wow... that just makes me want to drrrrrrrrrrrrrrag it out even more! He still seems to believe that it was ME emailing with him all along. Haha... what an idiot. If I didn't want to see him or talk to him on the phone, why on earth would I want to email him?!

I like the idea of having dr. harley writing a letter. Wonder how much that will cost me?!

I don't think he charges for his services. Email him at the radio show.

I would instruct your attorney that he needs to handle this, because you aren't willing to be in contact with your WH. If the WH wants information, he can either a) get it from the OM or b) end his affair and move home.

There is no court in this land that would force ME to stay in contact with such an abusive person.

Yeah... I may copy some of the emails and post them on here so you can see what my IM has been dealing with. My attorney and his contends that we have to work together for the next 15 years or so on the kids.... I have to learn to deal with his rotten [censored].

No, you don't have to work together. That is ridiculous. There is absolutely no reason in the world you have to contact him EVER. There is nothing that can't be passed on through your IM. You need to sell your attorney on this because is it clear he/she is fogged out about this issue.

And please don't post those emails. It is too bad you even read them.

Dr Harley posted this another board member whose H tried - and failed - to pull this same stunt:

I don't understand why I would need to contact him. If I am the legal and physical guardian, why on earth do I need to talk with him???? HE is the one who had the affair. HE is the one who left. HE is the one who wanted a divorce. Now I am expected to again give in to yet ANOTHER want of his??? WHAT THE FRICK is wrong with our legal system that it expects the BS to continue to endure being hurt like this???

nlf, this is why you shouldn't go along with it. Just because your fogged out wayward makes a threat, doesn't mean you have to go along.

I will talk to my attorney again. He wanted to see some of the emails that WH sent to im to prove to his attorney that this is not in the best interests of my emotional state. I already have stuff from my own counselor.... it is ridiculous.

What could your H possibly need to communicate to you that can't go through an IM? I would point that out to your lawyer. The bottom line is that the attorney works for YOU and it is not in your best interest or that of your children to be in direct contact with your WH. She/he needs to make sure are protected.

There is something referred to as 'parallel parenting' which is an alternative to co-parenting.
It is recognized as a valid way to handle things after a divorce/split.
Google it.

Anyway.

I don't see why you would need to show emails to the attorney. Just tell him you have an intermediary to handle all contact and WH is free to use it. That you are allowing him free access to the children but not to YOU.

Otherwise, get another attorney who knows how to handle this stuff.

Maybe yours is co-parenting with an ex theirself?

edited to say that those hurtful things WH is saying about/to you are examples that what he feels is exactly the opposite.He is trying to rile you up to strike back in hurt to justify the horrible thing he is doing AND he IS missing you .....which is WHY he is being nasty. He would be indifferent and not nasty if he DIDN"T care about you!

Been here, had to deal with this exactly.

First, what I would do is have a stern talk w/your attny and ask whom is working for whom. If they didn't wish to represent you and your ideals, as the MORALLY responsible and legal parent and guardian, then I would hire another attny.

Here's how I handled things post divorce when my xh married the ow.

First of all yes, it was thrown in my face and what they are seeking is for YOU, yes YOU to give THEM legitimacy to their skanky and sleazy relationship. The ow is definitely fueling this btw. My xh and his instant wife he married within 24 hrs of our legal divorce, tried to convince everybody that SHE loved my son as much as I did (inserting barf here), which I now know since the "soulmates" are divorcing now, was a farce.

They both, as a unified team against me (and they'll do this to you) tried to make me out as the bad parent, the one who didn't care for their kids' feelings for if I did, surely I would welcome (their crazy, misguided, and selfish and wayward interpretation) "MORE LOVE" into the life of my son. Yea, they claimed our son was getting even more love and attention, courtesy of ow and her family (who also enabled ow).

So what did I do? I continued on with little to no contact. I lived in another state with no family and didn't have really anybody except a sweet neighbor who served as the IM. I did a very very long plan B to him until I simply didn't care what the waywards did at all.

I limited all times I had to ever be around him, would go to see teachers at preschool separately, and would sit altogether elsewhere at school (then it was preschool and kindergarten) functions.

Sure, people would ask why I wouldn't engage his father on any level and I was always sure to tell them why (exposure yet again). Sometimes I wouldn't even have to explain.

Just stay true to what you know. Get a note if you will, a prescription maybe saying THIS is your plan of self recovery and that as directed by your counselor/psychologist (be carful to not try to give them leeway as my x tried to make it as if when I saw a psychologist/and counselor it was because I had a deficiency, which I did not), that a type of plan B is needed for your personal recovery. Keep the focus on your recover because it is the DIRECT RESULT of the HARMFUL affair which is truthfully, extreme mental cruelty. Put the blame on them always, where it should rightfully be.

I learned how to keep my cool and walk away and never engage whenever there was anything that required both of us to be there. I had separate birthday parties when I could. I didn't talk to the xh on the phone or the ow/wife. If there was communication it was email, which is also a permanent record of their futher cruelty by trying to show what they wanted..to force me to accept them (and the judge also saw through their actions and knew it was that).

Fwiw, after their marriage of 2 years, once my xh got me to basically break the nc by feigning an emergency and getting me to come pick up my son somewhere, which happened to be at an empty lake lot where he would soon build his lake house (I didn't know where, but if it is an emergency, I'm always there for my son). There he told me he wished he hadn't married her, that he regretted everything, and he tried to ask me out. Barf again. I told him that I had lost all feelings for him, and that I did not date married men and I would NOT ever condone his affair marriage to his mistress. I never called her his wife.

My child also never referred to the ow as any sort of pet name. My xh tried to get my son to refer to his ow/wife as "ma" which was something my son never did. He always called her "Miss OW's First name". He never called her even Mrs. Just "Miss C---y", as if he knew she was temporary and treated her as such. Even at a young age, my child knew what was up and what his father was doing was sinful and wrong.

The oddest thing that ever happened once was self-exposure of them to a local minister.

Sometimes you will have their contact FORCED onto you, and remember, when that happens, to keep your cool and know God is watching out for you.

I was at a vacation Bible school graduation ceremony, where they kids were putting on a cute little play. I go in to the church sanctuary, dressed in my scrubs after work. Next thing I know, inside of this crowded church, walks in my xh holding hands with his ow/wife, and she was wearing a low cut tank top, daisy duke super short white shorts, and sky high heels and dripping in jewelry into a church.

You could see the people there staring at her like she was from another planet.

Anyhow, my xh proceeds to walk in and scan the crowd, instantly zero in on ME and walk over and sit on one side of me, with him in the middle and the ow on the other side of him, like he was the dude from the "Big Love" series or something.

I ignored him, scooted down the pew, and he scooted down pulling her with him, to try to sit closer to me, so I ignored it.

Afterward, they walk up to me and say loudly, "You can't keep us from coming to events. We deserve to be here too."

Right at that moment, the minister walks up, and realizes there are a few people he hasn't greeted. Us. At that very moment, the nanny walks in with their child, who was a little over two at the time. (ow was pregnant before we divorced).

The minister said looking at me, "Your son X, is really sweet. You know he became a Christian this week. We're so happy to have you...ya'll..I mean...your family here."

The minister looked confused looking at me standing across maybe 2 feet away from my xh and the xh holding hands with a woman dressed to go clubbing rather than in church, and then there was a teenage nanny type girl holding a toddler. He was clearly confused.

He looked at my xh and ow, and said "I'm brother Steve, glad to meet you..are you Peachy's son's uncle and aunt?" My x wayward replied, "No, I am his father and this is my wife, Ms. Family Values (my nickname for ow/wife)and our daughter (being held by the nanny)."

Minister looked REALLY uncomfortable at this scene. So he asked "oh the baby is so cute..how old is she?" XH replies "Two years old, well make that two years and a month old".

Then the minister says "Wow. It is so wonderful you can come to church and be here standing near your ex wife. God can heal most things I guess. You both must have been divorced for quite some time for this much healing. How long have you been divorced?"

I smile and look directly in the eyes of the minister and reply, "Two years Brother Steve, two years."

My xh and his wistress (wife + mistress = my word, wistress)instantly spun on their heels and stomped angrily out of the church leaving the minister standing there beside me with a gaping mouth.

The minister then looked at me and said, "God deals with unrepentant sin you know, don't you?"

Use this story and know that you are not ever alone in this fight. YOu are fighting for the truth, for your healing, for your children, and exposing them to harmful people (the other men, the other women) the ones who break up marriages, and also the wayward parents out there, hurt your kids too.

No judge can force you to be around anybody you do not wish to be around. You are a free person, living in a country where we supposedly have freedom, seize that. And never ever ever give LEGITIMACY to their affair.

It is why they are hunting you down and forcing this on you. It is the last stand they have, to get you to acknoledge what they did is right. We know it will NEVER be right, so don't do it. Do not cave. You do not have to.

Hell I could be sitting near my xh at a function and still be in plan B b/c we would have no interaction. Especially since I made sure exposure happened all the time.

Tell your xh what I told mine when he accused me of "tainting" him in the eyes of others whenever I'd expose him and the wistress.

I would say one line and one sentence only to him. "X, you gotta pay to play. Get used to it."

There will come a day when God will heal your heart and life. Where you will see the sunshine everyday and smile. When you will embrace where you are now, and realize the real pain, the real hurt is carried by your wayward ex.

They will live with the pain of their betrayal. They live in fear that they will always be exposed. They will fear the day their sins will come to fruition, and that their house of cards will cave in. They secretly wonder when it will happen. They live with shame and regret. But that is THEIR lot, not yours.

Walk in the light of day and feel the warmth of God's love and the sunrays on your back. They will never know this as long as they live in unrepentant sin for destroying a marriage and family.

hardline maybe. Truth? 1000%.

I highly recommend you looking into "Parallel Parenting"

This outlines it a bit of the differences between "co-parenting" and "parallel parenting". It will protect you and the kids because you will not be exposed to what goes on in their household and you will have little to no contact with XH and his tramp of the month.

Parallel Parenting Stops the Bleeding (continued)

Understanding the Differences



COOPERATIVE PARENTING

Child focused.

Parents communicate regularly.

Parents can communicate in person or over the phone.

Major decisions about the child are jointly discussed.

Parents work together as needed to resolve issues related to the child.

Parents work together in the best interests of the child.

Allows smooth transitions from one home to the other.

Allows for schedule change � can be flexible and negotiable.

Parents may be able to discuss issues between other parent and child.

PARALLEL PARENTING

Adult focused.

Parents communicate over emergencies.

Parents use email, third party, or a parenting notebook to communicate.

Major decisions are communicated rather than discussed.

Households are separate. Each makes decisions about the child when s/he is in their household.

Parents work separately for the best interests of the child.

Culture changes for the child may be abrupt.


Written parenting plan or court decree followed exactly. Parents need an external authority.

Each parent is responsible for own relationship with child. �You must talk to your mom/dad about that.�




Ten Tips for Successful Parallel Parenting

1. Maintain an attitude for non-interference with your child�s other parent. Neither parent has influence or say over the actions of the other parent.
2. Carry on a business-like attitude; use common courtesy.
3. Do not plan activities for the children during the other parent�s time. It may be better for child to miss an event than to witness conflict.
4. Stay focused on the present.
5. Stay oriented to the task at hand.
6. Keep your children�s best interests in mind.
7. Remember the goal is to keep conflict to a minimum.
8. Follow up in writing all agreements and discussions regarding the children.
9. When communication and/or negotiation is necessary, use a neutral third party to assist you.
10. Keep an open mind.

Parallel parenting, that's what I am doing right now, being in Plan B.

THIS should be the way that parents should deal with parenting their children while separated or divorced.

THIS makes SENSE.

Thanx.

I wanted to come back to add that I think its important not to defend plan B.
Just tell the attorney that this is the way you choose to do things. You will parallel parent.
I would not talk about my fragility or psychologists or hand over emails to defend myself.
I would tell the attorney that the intermediary will be used or you will seek a legal intermediary (drop off center) to utilize. Guess what? They EXIST for this very thing!
Anyway. No more defending YOUR actions.
Matter of fact legal stuff and no emotional smoke and mirrors.

I just do not understand the attorney going along with this.

You don't have to say anything to educate your WH in plan B either. If you ever happen to have contact with him by accident....you just do not lovebust. You don't need to converse, just do not have angry outbursts, disrespectful judgements (trying to educate), or make demands (you release control of him).

A good response by your attorney would be something like this:

�There is no need for these two parties to communicate unless there is an emergency involving the children. Your client is attempting to use the children to inflict mental cruelty on Mrs. NLF. She is willing to communicate with him if he ends his adulterous affair, assumes his legal responsibilities as a husband and father, and returns home. There is otherwise little need to communicate with my client. You know full well that no court will FORCE my client to talk to yours. He will be contacted if there is an emergency, but is otherwise expected to handle his responsibilities as a father on his own.

Further attempts to use the children as an excuse to inflict mental cruelty on my client will result in charges to the same.�