Telly, listen, hon...I have never gone to anyone else without speaking with H first. No, he didn't agree to me telling other people how I felt. I'm not going to sit here and allow my H to not care how I feel and say NOTHING to others involved. He has his chance to handle it.

Honestly, what you are saying to me sounds an awful lot like telling a BW that unless her H agrees to exposure, she shouldn't do it. As far as I have been able to determine, I'm not a BW--the inappropriate emails were not personal from that girl, they were forwarded jokes. But again, I've been blocked access to a lot of contact that I could have been given access to. Inappropriate emails + future blocked access through deception of possibility = suspicious.

"False Perceptions"---I also mean to say that I need to know if he is portraying himself *truthfully* outside of our home as someone who is NOT devoted to his wife.

Well, 'not devoted' is pretty apparent in the fact that he drove down to a lawyer's office yesterday, even though he did not follow through, eh?

I think that pretty well falls into 'mental and emotional abuse', unlike telling someone you are highly ticked off that they lied to you. Mmm?

Hi CWMI, I'm still catching up on your thread, but this post stopped me in my tracks- how true it is that often we aren't as much mad at the other person as we are mad at our self, feeling like we've disrespected ourselves, for putting up with it.

I told him this last night...I've told him this before. I have no delusions about how STUPID I feel for believing him, how ANGRY I am about my choices, and how helpless I feel to change the situation short of blowing up my family. I am angry at me for thinking that I could even try to trust him--he knows this. I am mad at me for being gullible.

I am MADDER at him for putting me and our children in this situation. I don't think it is wrong for a wife to try to trust her H when he's given his word to be honest, even when that means a major change. I believe in giving a person the benefit of the doubt and I believe a person can choose different behaviors. So while I am mad at me for my own choices here--to stick around, to trust, to believe--I don't think the attempt was wrong on my part.

I DO think his follow-through was poor, and I am mad that he misled me and wasted my efforts.

Locked at OP's request.

Unlocked at OP's request.

Unlocked by same request. Thanks!

So, just a quickie update from 'where we left off'.

Nothing terrible found in H's email, most horrible thing was a forwarded email by his BOSS with a link to a music video titled "Hard to kiss the lips at night that chew your a** out all day long", sent as a mass email to all the married guys with a note that he was sure they could all relate to it. Nice. WTH is wrong with people? I, of course, chewed my H's a** out about it.

Kidding.

I did ask him what his thoughts on that were. Still non-committal, 'didn't pay attention to it', he ended up mass-emailing his co-workers to not send any non-work-related emails to him.

Boss sent another video with a subject line of "Work Related Video, must watch!" and it was something banal about men's underwear. Where are the adults? Anyone? I am in school with 18-21yo's all day and THEY are more mature than this.

Oh, too, I found out after-the fact that H contacted a teenage boy over the internet and our family paid (gifts, actually) this kid to make a video for H's work. Long story, but ends with me saying that I felt that being above reproach was the important thing here and perhaps the best way to do that would be to not buy gifts in exchange for services from teenagers one meets on the internet.

And H finally admitted to reading this thread saying, "I didn't think it would bother me, but it did. It really bothers me what they said about me." Well...he also said that I didn't represent it 'right' and he thought about posting rebuttals and I told him, "Please do. I think that's a fantastic idea." And...nothing.

Circling back around to the last topic on this thread...when the teenage boy stuff came out, H said he was angry at me for 'never giving him the benefit of the doubt.' I told him, "I gave you the benefit of the doubt when you told me that you could not get email access from home." He looked like I'd smacked him. He certainly couldn't argue that I hadn't. (given him the benefit of the doubt--not smacked him. )

He's been super the last several weeks except for one short AO one morning when I asked for clarity about something I was unclear about (where my car was going to be taken...my car ended up not going at all because he screamed at me that I never listen and he was NOT going to tell me again--he'd told me two different places prior, and I honestly didn't know!). He called and apologized; I told him to just knock that crap out. So far, so good, but man, I'm getting worn. I think I should be sensitive to his LBs, but sometimes it just feels like police work--is he IBing? Is he lying? Is he going to jump down my throat if I ask him a question? UGH...

Just venting/updating. All is not fantastic in CWMI-land, but it's not yet hopeless, either. I feel pretty good about my side of the street. Maybe H will post and straighten that out, though. He did say that everything is perfect for him at home and he doesn't know what the heck his problem is.

I have a theory, but that would be a DJ. lol.

More talking to myself:

lol

I just rang my H; he's out to lunch with some guy, I knew he was going but thought he'd be back well before now. So he says, "I'm still finishing up my lunch with [guy], can I call you back in a little bit?" I said "Sure!" and then...the line stayed open and I heard him telling the guy that he had to learn to answer my calls so I'd leave him alone and he loves it cause it works.

So...do I give him an a-hole of the year award, or never call him again?

I'm voting...BOTH. What a jackhole.

Eh. Disrespectful chest pounding.

Just tell him you don't appreciate
A)being disrespected to others
B)leaving the phone on long enough so you can hear him be disrespectful about you to others.

That should be enough to embarass and get your point across.

That sucks!!! I'd be really upset, too.

I agree with Kilted. I would probably just let him know via text that he left his phone on and I heard what he said and then let him sit on it all day feeling stupid.

If you go on offense he will automatically go on defense.

Let him come home with his tail between his legs rather than giving him a reason to turn it around and be mad at you by calling him an a-hole.

It's just not cool, or manly!

No EH about it. NOT COOL, not by a longshot.

Penni, your H reminds me a lot of mine. Thing is, we've done 6mos of coaching with Steve Harley, and my H still thinks of appeasement than any action of love. I think he's hopeless. I've remained hopeful for far too long. He does not love me, he wants me to leave him alone.

He's a curmudgeon! Our 9yo asked him the other day, "Why don't you ever laugh?" H said, "I laugh!" Our 6yo said, "No you don't, you sit there like this," and made a stony face [blank stare]. I keep on hoping sometime, someway, something is going to get through to him...

We went out Friday night, and I encouraged H to call a friend who is going through a tough divorce to meet up with us because the band was a new incarnation of a band we used to all go see together, way back when H and I were dating. It was Dude (kt knows who this is)...H and I were reminiscing and Dude was brought up, and even though I haven't physically seen him in a couple years and had issues with him, I don't hate the guy at all and feel bad for him, because his wife cheated, and I've known him longer than H anyway and we got a lot of our issues out and agreed that we just wouldn't interfere...and since H still talks to him, I said yeah, why the heck not?

So Dude shows up and is surprised that I am there, which is reasonable since we'd agreed to stay the heck away from each other, but then he says he can't believe I look so good (AWESOME, is actually what he said). I said, "Why? Did you think I'd devolved into some old hag or something?" and he said YES, and gave my H a wtf? look.

I blew it off at the time because we were having fun, but now I'm mad. He's telling people I'm an old hag that won't leave him alone. I'm his WIFE. And I'm freakin' SMOKIN HOT and I deserve a man who WANTS to hear from me.

I agree, there is definitely similarity in our H's. I haven't read your whole thread but from what I have read, I can relate. It's hard to persist when you feel like the other person doesn't care. And, it makes you wonder if they would care if you left. They probably would, but they don't realize that right now.

My H's top needs are SF and RC. He gets all of the SF he desires from me and he makes it a point to spend his most enjoyable RC time with his friends. Sometimes I wonder if I should just cut him off from SF, if that would wake him up. I doubt it, it would probably just lead to an affair.

Anyway, I can relate to your frustration - if you find a solution, let me know!

My H would care a LOT if I dumped the household chores and the kids on him. My H told me that he didn't have a need for RC because "That's something you get from friends, not your wife!"

I told him I heard it all. He said I took it out of context. lol. Okay, put it in some context, then. He said he wouldn't 'get into that with me', then texted that he hates fighting and ILU, I texted back Try Again.

Sorry, guys, you don't get to diss your wife, tell her she took it wrong, then get forgiveness over and over and over again. Listen up!

Does your husband have a high need for RC?

I think every husband and wife should get some time alone with the kiddos. I remember my wife thinking how awesome it'd be that I got to spend the summer with 'em and show me how hard it can be (which is weird because I had previous children and took care of them and I have a patience level near that of Job). She never quite got the "see how I feel!" (she's never been a fulltime SAHM save for that six weeks off for maternity leave). However after a couple weeks and realizing that I was singing Noggin TV station songs, not changing my clothes, or really doing anything adult related she told me to go get cleaned up and go find an adult friend to go have a beer with.

I remember the conversation when she came home one day. Teh house had been immaculate and the kids well-cared for. Well one day she came home and the house was a wreck and I was in 3 day old clothes of not changing.
Her: "Hi Honey. Ummm..when's the last time you had a shower?"
Me: "Ummmm...what day is it?"
Her: "Thursday. And based on that, you need to go take a shower, shave, and go out and have a beer and get some adult conversation."
Me: "Why?"
Her: "Because you've been around kids too long and need to get away from the house."

I learned I don't do well without a schedule and don't keep myself busy.

I don't think you can ever put into an appropriate conversation dissin' on your spouse...ever. It's just something you shouldn't do. It's bad form and disrespectful.

Soooo...ummm...how is Dude doing?

Dude is hurting.

What do you think you are teaching your kids by holding onto a man who doesn't value or respect you?

I hate it when divorced people start encouraging everyone else to get divorced, too.

Well, I am divorced and happily remarried...I lean toward encouraging people to keep families intact--especially if there is no abuse or infidelity.

Your dh does remind me of my XH. He too just wanted me to leave him alone. And he too distorted our relationship to others. So I don't know how you get that changed. I never could.