So present your detailed plan, and let's critique it. How are you planning on protecting your wife?

Because your wife is injured every time you engage in demands, disrespect, and anger. When you have a victim, a cheery attitude is not appropriate.

Hilltopper,

I'm not sure about Markos, but at least from my perspective, a feeling of cheeriness is not the feeling of resolute determination. I associate cheeriness with flightiness and distraction. What your wife needs is focus, concious thought at every moment, every interaction. You truly need to "THINK before you speak", meaning you are literally pausing and considering the words you've heard PRIOR to opening your mouth. This giddiness is a distraction. Buckle down and do the work.

I requested before some help in formulating the plan with you. I know in my head what I need to do to avoid LBing my wife and protecting her. That to me is making sure I do two things:

1. Asking rather than assuming at all times.
2. Avoiding fights at all costs.

I honestly don't know how to write out a detailed plan but I'm sure you can provide some examples or suggestions for me? I WANT help and I desperately need help.

I didn't know that Markos. I read LoveBusters and I don't recall that part. Did Dr Harley specifically address making sure you don't give yourself a pep talk to make sure you avoid DJ's and AO's? You are throwing so much at me and I'm not sure why you are doing it. I like to be cheery, my wife likes me to be cheery, and I think it best to remain positive, cheery, and focused to protect my wife.

You need to identify what triggers you. From the outside looking in, it looks like you fly off the handle with DJs when your wife doesn't meet your demands. And yes, demanding that she meet your EN and refusing to allow her to say "no" is STILL a demand and abusive.
Yes this is correct. I also assume things which causes me to feel wronged and make demands when I have no reason to do so.

Why do you Demand that she meet your EN when she doesn't feel like it? Is it your right to have your needs met? Do you deserve to have your EN met at her expense?I make demands instinctively because I think I might get my needs met when in reality I am causing the opposite to happen. I have no right to have my needs met, haven't earned that yet. I want to agree when the time comes on everything with my wife, including but not limited to how and when my needs are met. Again, I'm not worried about this at the present time.

You are also big on making assumptions, which you have already identified.

Not too long ago, I was the DJ Queen. I believe I have successfully eliminated them, and I can tell you what I did. Dr. Harley has forms for this, as well, and I suggest you fill them out. Your plan needs to be tailored to you, and it needs to be approved by your wife. Your plan also has a deadline, a time frame that your wife agrees on. If you do not successfully eliminate the DJs by the deadline, you need to both agree what you will do to get outside help -- I suggest you contact the Harleys at that point.
May I ask what a deadline range might look like? I don't want to make it unrealistic, but I also don't want to make it too long.

Here's what I did:
1. Shut up
2. Eliminate anything that causes me to dwell on Markos' mistakes and that would reinforce DJs in my mind (journaling, venting)
3. Empathize with Markos

The first step is SHUT UP. When you find yourself irritated with your wife, when you start thinking that she SHOULD do this or SHOULD do that, when she's not doing what you want, when she's expressing an opinion you don't agree with and never would, then SHUT UP. Don't say anything. Just listen.
Haven't had a chance to test this yet as I haven't been irritated about anything. A lot of this has to do with how I view things differently.

You also need to eliminate ANYTHING that causes you to dwell on your wife's mistakes. Do you journal? Cut it out. Do you vent? Cut it out. Do you keep score? Cut it out. Anything that lets you focus on her mistakes rather than on the progress she is making. No journaling, venting, or score keeping. She can do whatever she wants, I'm really trying to eliminate doing the same things that got me in to trouble before.

Then, empathize with your wife. Does she have a right to feel the way she feels? Is the way she feels valid (the answer is always YES, btw). Is the way she sees things equal to your view? (YES). Why is she feeling the way she feels? You need to work on seeing things from her point of view, and accepting that her point of view is just as valid as yours. Do not make assumptions. Do not demand that she just do what you want. UNDERSTAND her.

Did that this morning actually. She said she felt overwhelmed about the house. I didn't try to "fix the problem" like I usually do to eliminate her feeling overwhelmed. She doesn't like that. I merely told her that "I get it."

You are looking at it wrong.

You see what Markos said?

"Your wife is injured... your cheery attitude is not appropriate."


You took a knife, placed it in her gut, twisted... and now you want to smile?

Are you a serial killer?

Cheerful is not the appropriate response when we injure our spouse, concern and care is. Yes, we should be pleasant, but I too would be worried if my wife were cheerful after injuring me.

I want to agree when the time comes on everything with my wife, including but not limited to how and when my needs are met. Again, I'm not worried about this at the present time.

Haven't had a chance to test this yet as I haven't been irritated about anything. A lot of this has to do with how I view things differently.

No journaling, venting, or score keeping. She can do whatever she wants, I'm really trying to eliminate doing the same things that got me in to trouble before.

I didn't try to "fix the problem" like I usually do to eliminate her feeling overwhelmed. She doesn't like that. I merely told her that "I get it."

May I ask what a deadline range might look like? I don't want to make it unrealistic, but I also don't want to make it too long.

Here's what I did:
1. Shut up
2. Eliminate anything that causes me to dwell on Markos' mistakes and that would reinforce DJs in my mind (journaling, venting)
3. Empathize with Markos


Haven't had a chance to test this yet as I haven't been irritated about anything. A lot of this has to do with how I view things differently.

No journaling, venting, or score keeping. She can do whatever she wants, I'm really trying to eliminate doing the same things that got me in to trouble before.

Did that this morning actually. She said she felt overwhelmed about the house. I didn't try to "fix the problem" like I usually do to eliminate her feeling overwhelmed. She doesn't like that. I merely told her that "I get it."

Dr. Harley says that when you have gone 4 weeks without a DJ, you have eliminated them. I would put 4 weeks from today down as my deadline.

You don't need to test it. You are making your plan right now. Write it down on your plan and DECIDE that you are going to follow it.



You've kept score in the recent past, Hill. Your plan needs to acknowledge that.

And I don't believe that she can do whatever she wants. You have been demanding, and demands do not allow your spouse to say "no."


Are you going to put it on your plan?

This plan needs to be written down. It needs to have detailed steps, such as I suggested. And it needs to be presented to your wife for approval.

So what does your plan look like at the moment?

Hey, that is looking better! It's a good start!

Look through the forms for these plans in Dr. Harley's workbook. He has some questions you will need to consider and answer.

Disrespectful Judgements: Starting today I am eliminating DJ's from my life. Specifically eliminating the following below, feel free to add as you see fit:

1. Sarcastic comments
2. Lecturing
3. Preaching
4. Assuming
5. Not keeping score

Dishonesty: Starting today I am eliminating dishonesty from my life. Specifically eliminating the following below, also add as you see fit:

1. Not expressing my feelings to you

Selfish Demands: Starting today I am eliminating selfish demands from my life. Specifically eliminating the following below, add as you see fit:

1. Not asking for anything that you are not enthusiastic about.
2. Not asking for things that cause me to gain at your expense.

At the office but I can do it tonight. Unless of course these questions are somewhere on the site?

I don't think they are. There is a questionnaires section, and they aren't listed:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi4500_resource.html

"I will do this by shutting up and listening. I will also learn to empathize with your point of view and feelings, which are just as valid as mine."

"I am committed to Radical Honesty, and will start expressing my feelings to you in a respectful way."


3. I will be patient.
I will accept "no" as an answer. I will use the "friends of good conversation" to negotiate a solution that will make both of us happy.

Also be sure to mention the deadline to your wife, and make sure she agrees. Be sure to agree to exactly what you will do if by the deadline you haven't successfully eliminated these LB. I suggest you tell your wife "If I haven't succeeded in eliminating these lovebusters by June 7, I will set up an appointment for myself with Steve Harley."

And all of this needs to be in writing.