20 plus years ago my husband had an affair with a co-worker. We separated, he ended it, came back home, asked me to never speak of it. I moved forward with him and we've lived all these yrs. happy. 8 mos. ago my husband starting withdrawing from me emotionally and physically. I'd ask what's wrong, he'd answer "I don't know" or "nothing". That was the beginning of this terrible downward spiral, that's resulted in me feeling that he is acting just like he did when he had his affair all those years ago, but I can't prove it. We have a condo in another state because my husband works for a company there. I made a surprise visit to our condo, arriving before he got off work. When I walked in, things were way off inside the home. He had folded the bed linens down as if he were expecting to get right back in, he had placed a towel over the patio door blinds, there were candles that had been lit, that had never even been opened before, and the biggest thing that I saw later was, he'd shaven his pubic hair. We've not been sexually active at all during these past 8 mos. I've told him over & over again that the way we are living is not right, that I want things to be good between us again, that I love him, and can we just move on. He doesn't really say anything to these statements. He is an IT manager which makes it impossible to snoop on his computer or his phone. Any suggestions or thoughts about my feeling he's having another affair?

Notleaving
I am sorry this is happening but I do think your husband is having an affair, read this site a lot of red flags in your story,
I would hire a private investigator and get your answers.......
Then come back and get some more advice as to how to proceed, don't let your husband know you suspect anything, just try to Plan A the best you can until you know more, dont' lovebust him............
good luck
jessi

notleaving, welcome.

What did your H do when you showed up unexpectedly at the condo? Did you stay there? How did he react? It sounds like he was expecting company. I'm wondering if he hurried you out of there, or made a weird phone call - what happened there? Did he explain the shaved pubic hair, the candles?

That he is having a affair seems pretty obvious based on what you saw at the condo. I would suggest you hire a PI, since you're unable to get into his computer or phone.

I would also suggest that you consider a VAR hidden in his car, as well as a GPS unit on his car to track his location. But in your case I'll bet a PI gets the goods fairly quickly.

One thing I failed to mention from that nite in the condo was, when I showed up before he got off work I notioced that he'd put a picture of me that was taken on our honeymoon, that I'd given to him for our 25th wedding anniversary in the bedside table drawer. I'd checked out the condo, then left and came back as if I were just getting there. My picture was back out on the table. He later addmitted he saw me coming in and quickly pulled it out of the drawer. And yes, he quickly made a cell phone IM. He was meeting a guy from work at Wild Wings for a beer. Apparently, that much was true because I went along with my husband. However, I can't help bu think they were possibly going to meet someone there. I have no funds for a PI, I do have VAR though, but I'm afraid to put it in his car because he's so annal over it, and is constantly cleaning it.

Ok I only trim the hedges when I have company coming over I want to impress. And candles for a man? Nah not any of my friends or me UNLESS Im looking to give my wife a hint. Out of town, certainly not.
So by your choice of name I assume you would wish to try and recover from an Affair again if there is one?
Regardless dont let on you suspect anything right now.
I concur that a PI is the best avenue. If its financially possible. You will need the PI to find out all the particulars of the OW (Other Woman). Name, Address ETC.
Once you have that info you will need to expose the Affair with a plan in one day. Exposure will involve everyone you two know, Family and friends. If the OW is married her Husband would be your first and primary target. If its a work place A you will expose there as well and he will have to quit his Job ASAP if he doesn't get fired by exposing the A to the employer. I would almost bet if there is a OW thats its from his work place.
Affairs usually die quickly once exposed.This is the first step to your recovery and cant be skipped.
Im sorry your here and I hope for the best in your findings. But go with your Gut. It almost never lies.

Notleaving, you have to find a way then. Can you discreetly follow him or a friend of a friend who can?
Anal or not I would tap his PC with keylogger and download flexspy to his cell. Keylogger first as most PC guys that do IT cant find it themselves. The Cell is more risky.

I know you think you can't snoop on him since he is in IT but waywards aren't thinking clearly and make LOTS of mistakes.

Just don't grill him about an affair. Try to act normal so he lets his guard down.

Another poster said her H was in IT and never found her keylogger. There is more information over in "Operation Investigation" on keyloggers. I would go ahead and slap one on his computer.

Do you have access to his cell phone (is it password locked?) What kind of phone is it? Also whose name is the phone in?

Ouch. I see lots of red flags, here. I think your concern has a lot of merit.

When did he start getting anal about cleaning the car? That is also a sign of an affair.

I suspect the IM was to cancel his date with OW. The friend at the bar may have mentioned to your WH earlier in the day that he was going to be there that night in case your WH felt like stopping in for a beer.

Can you get the funds? It shouldn't take much to get the goods. Even if you had to take out another credit card, it would be worth it. It would be much cheaper than a divorce and that is where you are headed.

Another red flag is that you are spending nights apart. I would be thinking of ways to eliminate that if you hope to recover this marriage. Your best chance of saving your marriage is to get the goods and come back here and we will help you with next steps.

The cell phone is in the company name and is password protected. He's always been anal over his car(s). Yeah, my strongest gut feeling that there is an A was the "trimming of the hedge", and that it's probably a younger woman, not many gals my age do that, my daughter and her friends - yes!

I have already asked him if there was someone else and was that the reason for his behaviors, of course he denied it, and became very angry and indignant. When he had the A 20 yrs. ago, I did hire a PI, but I was working at the time, so on financial concern. Even though at the time of the affair I had all the evidence except actual pictures of sex, he only admitted this Jan. that it was sexual.

The 2 VARs that I hid in our condo didn't record but a few minutes of conversation, even though he was there for a few weeks. I'm having difficulty getting what is there to play back on my laptop.

For about $500 I got all the intel I could have ever needed or any judge used.

Borrow if you have to, the $ for the PI. Best money I spent and no more worrying and freaking out. I KNEW instantly who the enemy was (the affair and ws and ow) and KNEW what had to be done at that minute.

Yep, "hedge clippin" isn't something men do that much unless they're either into watching adult films, or dating women younger who do that regularly and don't think a thing about it.

But to me, besides the hedge issue were the candles, as one of the tell tale signs of my xwh bringing the ow TO OUR HOME when I was out of town, was coming back in and taking a bubble bath in MY jacuzzi tub. I noticed the edge of the tub had droplets that were clear-ish on them. When I scraped them off, it was CANDLE wax.

Men do not take bubble baths or use candles. Not if they're straight imho. WHERE to put the var's is important. Read the whole board called "Operation Investigate".

Your job now is to plan A your wayward spouse (and he's cheating), and gain intell 100%. When you have the information, we'll let you know how to blow the lid off of this nasty skanky affair he's having.

The photo on the nightstand is also a sign too imho. My xwh did that also. Turned photos down or moved them into my childs' room when the skank actually came over to MY HOME and did him. Classy ladies, the ow are right? (laughing so hard at that one).

Maybe for a kick (and to see if he responds to it positively or negatively, as negatively could mean affair fog big time) you could do some "hedge clipping"? His reaction might be all that's needed.

In his car, place the VAR under his seat or do the behind the steering column thing. You can also put a gps tracker on his vehicle too. Also, a var can be hidden in a side compartment too.

Btw, what's the rest of your story? Ages, dates of marriage and affair, children and ages. This is also telling of possibly the mindset of the wayward.

Well, the woman he had his affair with 20 yrs ago, was truly a skank! I like your word there. I should add too, that he cheated on me the whole time we dated.

I'm 50 years old,& a former banker, WHO, btw quit my job so that I would be able to travel back/forth with him for his job.
H is 53 and we will be married 30 yrs in Sept. We have 3 wonderful children, son 28, daughter 25 and son 23! Our youngest son is getting married next May, and my H behaviors certainly is putting a cloud over what should be a wonderful time in ALL our lives.

Yes, I guess I could borrow some money for a PI, and I will put one of the VARs in his car.

When I asked him about the burning of candles, his reply was that "he wanted to feel like home". Well, I'm not in the habit of burning candles much at home, or in the bathroom. I knew in my heart when I saw my picture in the drawer - and not just any picture - I knew it was over for him, and that he was having an A.

In our daughters bedroom at our condo, I have the pillows arranged a certain way on her bed. On 2 different occasions I arrived at the condo, when he had previously been there "alone", no one else from our family or friends had visited, those pillows were completely arranged differently than I'd left them. I've not shared that tid bit of info with H or asked about that discrepancy...

If you're not working and he has cheated in the past.....why ARE you living separately?

How did that happen?

It's really a crazy setup. When he first took the job out of state, he would come home on the wkends, or I'd drive there. So, because that got really old, we agreed I'd quit in order to be able to go with him. Also, there were plenty of wks/mons. that he'd work from his office at home, i.e. no problem. However, since his withdrawal, his "need" to be at corp. office has increased. And, with all the tension and arguments, his desire for me to go with him has decreased, always having a reason he'd give for me to stay home. To add another layer of complication I have a critically ill mother, and some obligations with family and church that keep me from traveling with him each time he goes.

If it were me, I would just stake out the condo. You showed up once unannounced, this time, do it again and catch him in the act.

Then, there is no denying it.

Walk in, catch them, leave, and begin exposure. Emotionally this would be very hard to do, but it is the least expensive route you would have, if that is really your first concern.

I don't want to be the weird one, and I don't really know why I'm making this suggestion... Is it possible OW is an OM?

CV

I really don't think so, but I do have to admitt that I've considered that as a possibilty.

You need to ask a close friend to borrow her car. Trade cars for the day.

Follow him in her car.

Do this. You will know who the affair partner is, and then you will be able to make better decisions.


SB

Only, don't borrow the car of the friend with the bright yellow Mustang.

Oh Not, I am so sorry to tell you this, but with everything you've recounted, I would bet $50 there is an affair. There are so many red flags here, the percentage is fairly high that this is what's going on.

I agree, get over there and stake it out yourself if you can't afford a PI. It will be hard, but you HAVE to know what is going on in your marriage before you can deal with it.

Whatever you find, please stay calm. Hard I know. If you feel you won't be able to control your emotions, maybe take a friend with you. You really don't want to do something you might regret later.

TJ/ lol at SchoolBus, yellow mustang. /TJ