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The question that remains is unanswerable as far as she is concerned and that is the big WHY?
Im trying my best to use this as my "move forward" moment. The question every BS wants to know. You know what? I think the truth is, the wayward simply has lost their senses, and entered into ding-dong mode. My FWW looks back and goes "what the *(&*^% was I thinking?!?! That wasn't the me before the A and I cannot comprehend the sheer idiocy of my actions"... I think that is at least partly the truth. The rest of the truth? They were selfish, inconsiderate and self-serving... Sometimes its as simple as that. Complicated answers make us feel better, but they aren't always the truth. Kinda like marriage builders... So easy a caveman could do it, but DUH! Why didn't we do it before!!!
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Thanks All. Great stuff tonight. CV-My FWW has had the same realization several times "what the (*^%*((^^ was I thinking?" and the other things you added were so true. Loss of senses is a great way to look at it, too. JL-Thank you for the stuff on fears, I fear none of that stuff, so why do I have fears? Dunno. Im making my way folks.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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NP! I was going to post the lyrics to Avril lavigne's making my way, but that'd surely get me moderated!
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Get a recover notebook. just a 1 subject notebook. Don't use it for anything else but what i'm suggesting... I did something similar. However, instead I used a USB key holding a Word document that contained all the questions and all the details of the A. When any new details of the A emerged, or whenever I had another question about the A, I'd update the document with the information. Then I'd put it away. It's been years since I last looked at it. And one day, when I think our M is fully recovered, I'm going to throw it away.
ManInMotion
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(see "MiM's Story" for more details)
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Nice letter. Read it to my wife this morning. She got it. Didnt have much to add to what was already said over the passed 5 weeks. Im beginning to think and I she said it today, what they have in hindsight wasnt a relationship, it was something else. If it were a relationship, I have to believe there would be memories and things she'd be able to tell me more about emotions she felt. This was odd situation in my opinion. Doesnt make it easier for me to understand and I still have my questions but she has nothing more to say about.
She again apologized and continued to regret putting both me and her thru this.
At a certain point I may have to live with what I know as being all Ill ever know. Hey Mike, Just wanted to let you know that you're doing great and you are handling this in the right way by coming here with your questions and to vent... One thing about your post reminded me of my own situation quite a bit... I didn't understand the "arrangement" between the affair partners either because it didn't really fit with the idea of a "relationship" where they thought there was "love"... That, of course, is because there was not even in the twisted, perverted sense that most affair partners think they are in "love". Mrs.Flint was finally able to tell me what it was one day long after the affair between my ex-brother and her had ended... and I think it is the case with your FWW and her affair partner also. Mrs.Flint said they simply USED each other. There was no deep feelings of attachement... There was no "I've got to see you today or I'll just die." There was no deep insight into each other's lives. No soulmates. No you brought out feelings I've never had... They USED each other... And DISCARDED each other... Whenever one of them felt a need for an ego boost... The other volunteered to meet it. Like a soiled band-aid that they had used to cover up a wound in their souls that really needed surgery... Not a band-aid. I couldn't believe that that was all there was to answer my question as to why? It couldn't be that simple. But there is no deep, dark secret to it. It's just selfishness and they used each other just like they used us... It's just harder for us because we CHOOSE to stay and pick up the pieces... When the affair partner bailed. Because WE actually love them. God bless. Jim Ack. I know these sentiments all too well...
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Mike, You said JL-Thank you for the stuff on fears, I fear none of that stuff, so why do I have fears? And that is the point isn't it? As you address it, you will find the list of things you don't fear will grow. Just thoughts, JL
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Yes, JL, your post was amazing addressing individual fears cruising in and out of my head. And each one was dead on. Its one of the many posts Ive printed and carry with me when I start going down a bad path.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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The question that remains is unanswerable as far as she is concerned and that is the big WHY? And I have gotten as close to this answer as Im going to get. And an earlier post by Jim Flint really put my head in the right direction because it fits this relationship quite well. I let her read it and she only added that the OM developed an obsession of my wife and she was too weak and/or whatever psychobabble description for it to fight him off or simply say no. The both had an itch and they scratched it.
Im trying my best to use this as my "move forward" moment. I love the new name! Mike, it took me coming here to MB years after my A (and during my FWH's 2nd A) to work through the "why's". It could be much too soon for your WW to be honest enough with herself for that thorough of an inventory. Something I learned from my FWH, self examination is a process and the further out from the A you are the more horrified (and detached) you are from the person you were during the A. If it gives you any hope, my FWH is disgusted when he reads/hears about A's now. In his mind (thank God!), there is no justification good enough for doing this to your spouse and children. I think you will get there with her, Mike. Give her time, she will get to the why's as she works through her shame, horror and self loathing. In the meantime, work on EP's with her instead to prevent this from happening again.There is a thread out there about EP's (extraordinary precautions) that I think was started by herpapabear.
Faith
me: FWW/BS 52 H: FWH/BS 49
DS 30
DD 21
DS 15
OCDS 8
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FWIW -
I asked my FWW "why OM, why him?"
Her answer: "Becasue he was there. It could've been anyone..."
She went on to say - "I realized very early on he had big shoes to fill, and would never be able to fill them."
And this one recently: "I know a part of you might hate me for what I did, but know you could triple that and that's how much I hate myself for what I did. I shamed myself...to you, my family, the OM, to another's family, etc. And I will be judged one day for it..."
There's not much i think i needed to say after that...excpt ' Love You'.
thanks.
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I do spend a lot of time lately thinking about how degraded and low she must feel in general about herself. I get upset thinking about that. But she is trying her best to renew her life since dday and that degraded and low woman is not someone I see very much of. She has said and I believe it is she sometimes pulls over the car when shes alone and cries so our kids dont see it.
She cannot believe what she did and how stupid and selfish she was. Her words.
I just tell her I dont remember that woman and the one Im with now is a lot different. And I love this new woman a lot.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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My suggestion is to focus on the future, being happy that you have this oportunity to celibrate this recovery today, and in the future.
She sounds like she is repentant, and broken, count yourself blessed.
Now you will be there for her, to fill whatever needs she has, and in doing so will protect her and comfort her allways.
Its a new day, second, moment of your lives together, celibrate that as much as you can.
God bless
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CP-
The future is what she and I have. And we are happy about the future. We are spending less and less time on the past. Which is good. I work on filling her Love Bank and protecting her which is what I did a poor job of doing throughout.
I do cherish every minute with her. I like to comfort her and I need her to comfort me as still have my moments. She is a new person and I like this new person.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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Yes, the meds may have kicked in.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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Yes, the meds may have kicked in. They do take several weeks to reach levels that show improvement. Remember to NOT abruptly stop any medications, as it will send you into a bad spiral.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Yes, the meds may have kicked in. They do take several weeks to reach levels that show improvement. Remember to NOT abruptly stop any medications, as it will send you into a bad spiral. Please listen to this advice he gave. If you feel like at some point you dont feel them anymore, or decide you dont wnat to take them, please continue to and talk to a therapist about possibly weaning you off them. I have seen people become violent and out of control when they just stopped taking them and it can be a real hazard to you. Its just how they work, please be careful God Bless you Mike
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Im not stopping the meds. Lord knows my depression is still full on.
After a few good days, I hit a rough patch yesterday and last night. No AO. Just the eternal, internal battle in my head. Took a walk, tried to cool down but didnt work. Having my difficulties with certain things that Ive discussed before. Cant seem to do a thing about it at this point.
I told her the issue, she knows it, I didnt belabor the point, just told my head is not right and Im working on it. I have one of the more repentent, remorseful, hurt, and willing to do whatever to make things right FWW and I still just cant passed the intimacy part of her A.
And, THAT is my biggest fear. Not being able to move on from this one thing.
And you all have given me the whatfors on what I need to already, just cant seem to do it.
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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Not "what fors" from here, MSS, at least not for you. Now stop reading! Hit "Print" and hand the output to your spouse. ![[Linked Image from blogs.law.harvard.edu]](http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/files/2008/01/newyear_sunrise.jpg)
Mrs MSS,
Your husband is going to go through patches like his recent one for an extended time. You have THE important role in helping him get through them.
1) DO NOT make it about your feelings - with crying, self-recriminations and depression on your part. That will cut him off from getting what he truly needs, if he can't come to you without creating a lot of drama when these episodes occur.
2) DO hold him and tell him that you're sorry you made the choices you did, that you love him very much, that nothing like what happened will ever happen again, and that you will do anything to help him heal.
We peer-counsellors at MB are counting on your assistance.
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Thanks NG-
You are gifted in your directness.
Printed and will give it her at first chance.
MSS
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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1) DO NOT make it about your feelings - with crying, self-recriminations and depression on your part. That will cut him off from getting what he truly needs, if he can't come to you without creating a lot of drama when these episodes occur.
You know, NG, I read this a couple of times and it occurred to me that she does none of the crying, self-recriminations and shows little depression. In fact, when I tell her Im battling things in my head, she never asks what types of things? I understand it may be more of our lack of conversation that was part of our issues, but what Im getting from her is her is she doing all to bury this A and I congratulate her for being able to do so. She is not the biggest talker about her feelings which she is working on with a psychologist, but I think its her defense mechanism against my depression by not responding to me. Its a no-win situation for her. I know it. And she really does follow your prescription that I sent her. Its my head spinning into every direction that is screwing with me. I tell her ALL the time, its not her, its me. (Co-opted from George Costanza.)
Life keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the fuuuu-ture.
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In fact, when I tell her Im battling things in my head, she never asks what types of things?
Actually, she should ask.
Given, "Doctor, I am suffering pains" which would be the more effective response?
a) "I'm sorry."
b) "Where does it hurt, and what activities bring the pains on?"
she doing all to bury this A
Again, "burying" the A, without effecting restoration of your psyche, is not the optimum path. AD's or not, you must be the one to decide on the recovery timetable, not her. The problem I have with pharmaceutical enhancements is that roses viewed under the influence of drugs display themselves as weeds as the drugs are weaned away. Your partner will be blindsided by things that affect and upset you in the future without the chemical aids, which today you and she considered addressed and closed, under the influence of the "happy pills."
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