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And just storing it somewhere you can't see it deprives you of the pleasure of getting another car together with your husband to be the date car. I believe thats a ridiculous suggestion.


Me: 32
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Married 9 years, together 12.
Two little girls, 7 and 3.
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Originally Posted By: stupidcar
This was the main topic of conversation in our counseling session last night. He hopes that with some time I will feel less strongly about it and we can keep the car. He and the counselor suggested storing it somewhere so I don't have to see it everyday. I was reminded by the counselor that the car didn't hurt me, my husband did and that he didn't have an affair, just a lapse in judgement.

I'm pretty upset. I wish that he cared enough about my feelings that he couldn't wait to get rid of the stupid thing.

He has been researching other vehicles but he has a strong attachment to this particular car. We bought it brand new, it's always been garage kept, under a cover AND they stopped making them a couple of years ago so we can't get another new one.


A LAPSE IN JUDGEMENT?
Wow, youre husband must LOVE this counselor.
I would ask this counselor how he defines affair.
You might want to know because evidently your husband will be allowed to go just about that far before he has committed an infraction.


SC,
A lapse in judgment is when you ask the waitress where shes from because you think shes cute.

Challenge this counselor. Ask him to really think about a lapse in judgment. Ask him to think about the number of chances your husband had to turn back from the decisionS that lead to having Another Woman in his vehicle. Ask him to think about the number of encounters with this woman it must have taken to set the whole thing up hint: clearly he spoke with her enough times to find out she was a car enthusiast. Ask him to think about how many times your husband played out this scenario in his head before it even happened.

I was wayward once and, in one incident, wound up making out with a girl at the end of a party. Perhaps your counselor would call that a lapse in judgement. However, these things dont just happen. They take planning and premeditation.

Im going to be very generous now and say that most counselors are complete idiots. I dont believe yours is the exception to the rule. I believe he is dangerous to your marriage.

I suggest counseling with Dr. Steve Harley.

~Optimism


Me: 43 y.o. BFWH, D-day 11/11/09 (NC since 9/01)
Divorce from WW final 9/16/10.
Current Status: MB-based Marriage to Nature Girl 12/8/12 (first date on 12/11/10)
Mine: S(16), D(11)
NatureGirls: S(23), D(21)
Another EA Story
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I agree with everything all of you have said.

I figured out early on that this counselor was an idiot in regard to his characterization of the woman in the car incident, although meeting with him has been helpful in some areas. Fortunately, thanks to some earlier pastoral counseling, my husband and I are on the same page about that behavior. We have done a lot of work exploring the pattern that led up to it and how to prevent anything like it in the future. There are EPs in place, we practice radical honesty and he has an accountability partner that I respect, along with other MB principles.

I agree that storing the car is a ridiculous idea, especially when you factor in the cost involved. Parking is at a premium where we live so it's not a simple matter.

If I was vindictive, we would sell the car and I would use the money for something purely selfish - something just for me. That would be rough justice and my taker would win.

I feel that selling it and picking something new together is a very gracious offer. When I'm feeling witchy that almost feels like my husband's bad behavior is being rewarded but I can work through that.

He loved being the original owner of a very low mileage, garage kept sports car but his carelessness damaged it just as if he'd been driving recklessly and hit a tree. I'll bet he's more careful with the next one. We just need to find something we both will be happy with. Unfortunately, they no longer produce the model we have and there isn't anything else new that he really loves. We may go for something classic.

We've done so well working through this unpleasant chapter in our long history. I never thought a CAR would be such a sensitive issue!

Interesting side note - The idiot counselor used to own the same model car and got rid of it because he didn't really like it. His wife bought it for him just like I bought ours for my husband.

Bottom line - the car needs to go. I haven't had anyone tell me that was unreasonable - even the counselor.

Thanks again for the input. The people on these boards don't pull any punches. smile

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Just curious stupidcar - does your husband agree with you that this was an affair? Is it important to you that he does?

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Yes and yes.

The sticking point has been the car. His contention was that he is responsible for what he did, not the car, so why should the car go away? He has clearly stated that if that's what I want, that's what will happen although I know he's hoping he'll get to keep it. I was doubting myself and came here to get some opinions as to whether I was being unreasonable. I feel completely affirmed in my belief that we need to get rid of the stupid car.

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The reason the car should go; human memory is not recorded like tape or video, it is reconstructed on the spot with information we currently have access to. The car allows you to construct a visual of your husband in the car with another woman.

This will remain true of other cars of the same model, year, or body type. So long as you have accessible information to construct the memory with, both the memory and the associated feelings will remain strong.

Not only should you sell the car, it should be replaced with a totally different type in brand, shape, and color.

He chose to taint it. The car, and the marriage.


"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr

"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer

"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Perfectly said, HoldHerHand. Thank you for that. I had the same thoughts about getting the same make and model.

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Originally Posted By: HoldHerHand
The reason the car should go; human memory is not recorded like tape or video, it is reconstructed on the spot with information we currently have access to. The car allows you to construct a visual of your husband in the car with another woman.

This will remain true of other cars of the same model, year, or body type. So long as you have accessible information to construct the memory with, both the memory and the associated feelings will remain strong.

Not only should you sell the car, it should be replaced with a totally different type in brand, shape, and color.

He chose to taint it. The car, and the marriage.


I have a different view on the reason the car should be eliminated.
The car is a hunk of metal. But it is a hunk of metal that was purchased to evoke certain feelings. One could spend the same money on a rare painting (acrylic on canvas), or a sculpture (marble), or a piece of land (dirt and trees); again with the same feelings of contentment if the owner had love for those objects.
At this point the car evokes feeling which are negative to one spouse. If there is true love and respect and admiration and sharing, then the car can no longer give the same sense of satisfaction, to either party. There's no more POJA in that car. It's anti-POJA.

SC, you seem to have studied these concepts and it appears your husband has a good approach to your marriage. You are very important to him.
You seem to be becoming steadfast and convinced in your stance on this car thing. Perhaps he is digging in his heels as well (bolstered by the opinion of the counselor). I am concerned that the thing that once pulled you together and evoked such positive feelings is now creating distance between you two.

To think a hunk of metal could have such an impact on a very real thing like a human bond....


opt


Me: 43 y.o. BFWH, D-day 11/11/09 (NC since 9/01)
Divorce from WW final 9/16/10.
Current Status: MB-based Marriage to Nature Girl 12/8/12 (first date on 12/11/10)
Mine: S(16), D(11)
NatureGirls: S(23), D(21)
Another EA Story
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I sent my question into the Harleys and they answered on the radio show today. Dr. Harley agrees the car should be sold and replaced with something we both agree on. He was concerned about the lying behavior and classified my husband as the type that lies "to stay out of trouble." I completely agree and we have been addressing this behavior in counseling.

Looks like we'll be getting a new car! I'm actually kind of excited to begin the process and move forward. I'll keep you posted on how it turns out. Anybody want to buy a gently used two seat convertible sports car? smile You'd probably have to hop on a plane to come see it because we don't live on the mainland.

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Nice! I heard part of the call today and heard where he suggested you sell the car and get something you both agree. We sold our little sports car last year and it went really fast! I was surprised at how fast it sold.

Are you going to play the clip for your husband? I just checked and todays show has not been added to the archives but it is there under the rebroadcast.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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New guy here, so disclaimers of probably annoying people with a post that doesn't comport with local culture...

Husbands have many temptations over the years. I suspect wives do, too. Presuming nothing more happened than what has been reported, this was a test that your husband passed with flying colors. He started messing up by walking out to the car with this woman. He admits to being attracted to her. Surely he was trying to impress her with his car.

And then his inner voice told him not to continue down this path. He realized that this woman was not worth losing you over. He realized that he was making a mistake. He has felt guilt over the years for getting oh so close to destroying everything of value to him. And he probably feels lower than slime for tainting something so special to you.

He realized that YOU are what is important to him. I bet he scared himself so badly that he self-inoculated against ever tempting fate like that again.

So I don't think you should beat up your husband any further if you find that he honestly regrets what he did. He had the strength to turn back when it would have been far easier to give in to temptation.

But yeah get rid of the frickin' car! It is tainted for both of you. In the end, stuff is just stuff. You'll both feel better to be rid of it.

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The counselor suggested we not talk about the car with each other until our next appointment which is tomorrow. I've called his office to ask specifically if I should share that information and the very similar advice I got from our pastor. I'm waiting for a return call.

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I'm not trying to punish him and I do commend him for not going any further than he did. It definitely scared the heck out of him. If I wanted to punish him I would have keyed the stupid thing or sold it and used the proceeds for something entirely selfish. I think replacing it with something that is not tainted is the best solution for all concerned.

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Get rid of the car.

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I just heard the radio show. I hope you get to pick out a nice replacement car that you both enjoy.

AM


BW - 65
WH - 60
M - 35 years
D-day - 17 Apr 08
DD - 44, DS - 30, DS - 23
H broke contact 11/1/09
Back in love after the worst thing that every happened to us.
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Here is her radio clip: here


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Keep the damn car!

Stop projecting your ongoing anger (justified or not!) at your husband at an inanimate object, as a form of passive-aggressive revenge against him.

Look, if he were walking your dog when he had had an inappropriate converstaion with some floozie, we wouldn't be discussing putting YOUR DOG to sleep. My FWW conducted her EA from the family room, on the family computer. Crushing the computer and bull-dozing the family room would NOT have changed her actions, nor erased the hurt they caused. Deal with the person (WH), not the ancillary props.

Getting rid of the car will leave the same unaddressed resentment, with the added irritant of his resenting your high-handed demands, and your own reminder (from the empty garage space) that you can't get past his betrayal, in spite of taking away his toys.

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Dr Harley: "He blew it...the lie is why he should get rid of the car."

NG, you can't say whether or not getting rid of a dog is appropriate, nor a car. It's up to the offended person what is 'just compensation'.

High-handed demands was very inappropriate to say.


Marriage is the triumph of imagination over intelligence. Second marriage is the triumph of hope over experience.
(Oscar Wilde)
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Wow, NG, that was harsh! If you read my earlier post, you would know that I am NOT trying to punish him. It's not only about the car ride, it's primarily about the lie and the fact that the car has been something we enjoyed together, which is forever tainted. I think getting something new is a reasonable solution. He screwed up and he still gets a new toy!

With that said, I have decided not to force him to sell it, although that's what I hope the conclusion is. I don't believe I'll ever want to ride in it again but if he wants to keep it sitting in the garage under a cover hoping someday we'll be able to enjoy it again, that's his choice. No high handed demands here!

We'll be discussing it with our counselor this evening.

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NG, you don't get to pick your triggers. You don't get to just decide not to be triggered.

And I think the suggestion was to sell the car, not bulldoze it.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

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