Hello,

I've been very happily divorced since November 2006. I dated for a few years (had been married for 16+) and then fell in love with a divorced man in February 2009 who I am still with. He has an ex-W who cheated on him several times - she divorced him in 2008 for one OM then married another OM in 2010.

An issue that has come up repeatedly this spring/summer is his XW's disregard of my BF's opinions/authority regarding their older son who is 15.

The son got into trouble at school in June 2011 - both with his grades but also his behavior, which resulted in a 1-day suspension from school. ExW wanted to enroll DS in driver's education classes shortly after this & asked BF to pay for half. BF refused due to DS's behavior. XW went ahead & enrolled DS anyway & paid for it herself. After having one class, DS was pulled over by the police for taking/driving a friend's dad's car without a license and he received a 3-year probation.

In August, my BF also finds out that DS has gone to Hawaii to see his bio-dad, who gave up all rights to DS when BF & XW married & BF adopted DS. Come to find out, XW has had bio-dad back in DS's life for some time now & did not say anything to my BF, who is now very hurt as he adopted the child at 3 yrs old & really felt he was his dad - he pays child support for this boy every month. XW knew how my BF felt about that relationship and she disregarded his feelings completely by bringing bio-dad back into DS's life.

Now, in addition to all that, for the last month XW has been pushing for DS to be given a car! DS's 16th birthday is this week. A few weeks ago, she asked BF to obtain a car loan for DS because her & her husband's credit is messed up & she couldn't do it. BF refused. He also told her that DS did not earn or deserve a car & that he would not contribute to making it happen.

She then started texting him constantly about different cars that she wanted him to look at for DS (BF is a mechanic). She then went out & bought a car with the little savings that DS had in his account. The car failed emissions and also has safety issues and she is now coming to BF for help.

BF wants to help DS, but definitely not XW. He has already had the car in his shop, even though I warned him that he is being manipulated. If he fixes the car now, she will expect help on every little problem & won't pay him. He says he is not going to help her - that he's just getting the car on the road & then going to let her deal with what comes later.

I can't believe that he is helping at all. The child did nothing to earn this car, is on probation on his driver's record, almost failed out of school last year, has been making some really stupid decisions....and she is rewarding that behavior by giving him a car?! This is so backwards from the way I parent my now 19 year old son - who has been working since age 15 and didn't get a car until his senior year of high school when he could pay half the car and for the monthly insurance & gas. He also had to consistently keep his grades up before I'd even have the car discussion.

I am so frustrated with BF right now. He did not stand his ground with her, or even ask her why she keeps disregarding his authority. But he keeps telling me that he has this "under control". I don't believe that for a minute.

Is this one of those things that I should just consider "none of my business"...?? I feel it is my business - if - it affects our relationship - which it has, and it also is affecting BF's stress level.

I've tried to stay out of it, but it's getting ridiculous and it is beginning to affect how I see him as a man & partner.

Any advice?


Thanks,
Shelle

Belle,
Could you tolerate this behavior in the long term? (I think it's independent behavior - insofar as he is not consulting you about decisions he makes about his kid).
I would venture to say there is a lack of Boundaries when it comes to BF with his XW and his child...

Do you think this behavior will stop when you get married?

optimism

Are you living together now?

I agree with Opt that these are independent behaviors that are hurting your relationship with your BF. And your BF isn't helping his son by fixing the car. The last thing this kid needs is MORE opportunities to run around and get in trouble.

As far as re-introducing bio-dad, I would stay out of that one completely. It's normal for him to want to know about his sperm donor.

Since you are not married, I would say that it is in fact "none of your business", meaning that he has the right to interact with his son and XW any which way he wants to. He is a grown man, and you are not his mother, and if you try to control what he does, well then you would be controlling.

OTOH, you have every right to form your opinion of how well you think your relationship would work out given these interactions. If you feel that his actions would cause you grief if you were married, then maybe he is not a good match for you. This is why we date . Parenting styles is definitely one of those things you need to have some agreement or understanding about, especially since you both are parents.

Remember, you cannot control someone else's actions, but you can control your reactions.

AGG

I agree with AGoodGuy, you are not married to this guy. You also don't have the perspective of a guy who is looking at losing touch with his son because his ex-wife is doing everything she can to alienate him.

From what you wrote in your original post it sounds like your BF has been handling the situation as best as he can. Have to wonder why you say it's getting ridiculous?

Thank you everyone, I appreciate your feedback.

My BF is the polar-opposite of my XH, (who was very aggressive and opinionated) - and that was very attractive to me after 16+ years of feeling bulldozed by my X. But, I now see where he may be too passive to be a good long-term match for me. (Yes, we do live together - with my 19yr old son)

I see BF being very passive in many ways, but when it comes to his kids (DS15 & DS9) it pains me to see how his passivity results in him not spending time with them. He is taking the stance of "not rocking the boat" - and while I partially agree, I do not agree with not taking his visitation time with them.

When there is conflict, he pulls back into his shell like a turtle and it may take several days for him to even be open to discussing whatever the problem is.

With his older son & his problems in school & with his driving without a license incident, BF became very angry and did not want to see DS for quite some time. This resulted in him not taking DS15 for visitation except for one weekend this entire summer. He did take younger DS9 a few times, but in the 2-1/2 years I have known him, he has never taken them every other weekend as he is allowed to. His XW rarely has a problem with him taking the boys - in fact, I think she wants him to do it more.

In a way he is reaping what he sows....not taking the boys for visitation, then seeing XW making decisions either without asking for his input or disregarding it when he gives it. I understand that he feels that he has no control due to XW making independent choices that he usually does not agree with.

He & I have very similar backgrounds as far as how we were raised, and I know it pains him greatly that XW is trying harder to be DS15's friend than a parent.

He understands that he is not DS15's bio-dad, but it hurt that DS was interacting with bio-dad and bio-dad is playing the "fun dad" role (trips, money, etc) that he cannot give. I tried to tell him that he is expecting too much from DS15, that of course the kid is curious about his bio-dad and that it is not DS's fault that XW got the two in contact with each other.

I also understand his feelings of not having any control over what happens at XW's home with the boys, but I also see him losing time with them due to his passivity. I have tried to encourage him every way that I can to try to offset XW's poor choices by having the boys visit more so that they have a very strong influence from him as well, but so far he hasn't made much effort in that direction. I feel he has given up.

My comment about it getting ridiculous is that he talks to me about these things and is obviously upset over it, but he continues to not take a stand with XW or to see the boys for consistent visitations.

He has this pattern with me in our relationship as well. If I express an opinion or concern, it usually takes several days of waiting before he will talk about it - if at all. He quickly jumps to "do you want me to leave?"....no matter what the issue is. And he himself never has brought up a relationship issue. Ever. He says he doesn't like to "pick" at things.

I am trying to sit back & let him handle this on his own. Since we are not married it is not really my business to get involved, but his handling of this situation does not bode well with me as another example of how he deals with (avoids) conflict.

I hate to give up on him or our relationship, but I'd like to be able to solve problems & move on, not cover them up. He seems to feel that any problem that is spoken out loud is a signal that the relationship is over. He & XW apparently lived that way & she divorced him after cheating on him several times. I don't understand why he wouldn't then welcome being in a relationship with someone who is an open book, does not keep secrets, and addressed problems head-on?


Thanks,
Shelle

Agree. It sounds like your BF is between a rock and a hard place. His problem is with his ex's disrespect for his input as a father unless it involves money.

My main comment is this: when a kid is acting out in school, getting bad grades and challenging the rules (taking the car without having a license), that child is demonstrating that they are not mature enough to be responsible for something as potentially dangerous as driving a car. I wish his mother could see that!

Maybe you could tell him, "BF, I am not going to tell you how to parent your son. But what I would suggest is that you should figure how YOU want to parent your son. Not how I want to, not how your son wants you to, not how your ex-wife wants to, but what YOU want. You also cannot tell your ex-wife how to parent outside of what is in your custody agreement. So if you feel strongly that it is better for DS16 not to be given a car, don't do anything to enable that. You cannot do anything if your ex-wife wants that for him, but if you feel as a Dad that he is not responsible enough and has no financial stake in this car then don't do anything. If you think he shoudl have a car then give her the money. Also think about what is happening if you don't have visitation. Don't skip it to punish him or your ex-wife...think about why you are not spending as much parenting time with your son as you can. Don't you want to be the good influence on him?

[i]

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My BF is the polar-opposite of my XH, (who was very aggressive and opinionated) - and that was very attractive to me after 16+ years of feeling bulldozed by my X. But, I now see where he may be too passive to be a good long-term match for me. (Yes, we do live together - with my 19yr old son)

I see BF being very passive in many ways, but when it comes to his kids (DS15 & DS9) it pains me to see how his passivity results in him not spending time with them. He is taking the stance of "not rocking the boat" - and while I partially agree, I do not agree with not taking his visitation time with them.

I also understand his feelings of not having any control over what happens at XW's home with the boys, but I also see him losing time with them due to his passivity. I have tried to encourage him every way that I can to try to offset XW's poor choices by having the boys visit more so that they have a very strong influence from him as well, but so far he hasn't made much effort in that direction. I feel he has given up.

It's funny that you say that his being the polar opposite from your XH was attractive, because it seems like you are taking him to task for not being like your ex. You repeatedly say "passive", but is he passive or are you simply upset that he doesn't follow a plan that YOU would take? That you suggest a course of action that would bring a result that you would desire but he doesn't follow your advice and in fact clams up when you want to talk about it.

Almost sounds like you are treating him in a similar manner to what your ex did to you.


You are trying to let him handle it on his own... Do you see the common theme in this thread? You don't seem to have a lot of respect for this man, in fact, it borders on being contemptuous. He handles conflict differently than you do, perhaps takes more time to process feelings and emotions, and maybe sees direct confrontation as an attack. In short he is very different than you, is that wrong?

Perhaps you are right in that this is not the guy for you, but I really think you need to decide exactly what it is you want in a man. Perhaps something more in the middle of the aggressive-passive spectrum instead of people that reside near the poles?

I agree.... I have lost respect for BF in some ways.

Whereas my XH was a loud opinionated bulldozer, you never had to wonder what he was thinking. BF is quiet, reflective and takes an enormous amount of time to "digest" issues. I can respect that....IF.... the wait for his response results in some kind of action or resolution, but more often than not, there is none....often not even a follow-up conversation. Issues are left to flounder... and they frequently resurface later. It feels like just going in circles & avoiding addressing/solving anything.

Yes, I agree that I'd probably be more comfortable with a partner more on a middle-ground regarding conflict resolution. I thought this man was, but as several issues have come to pass I see that he is very much conflict-avoidant. I can understand that. I also understand that in my 16+ year marriage, I picked up more than a little of my XH's aggressive communication habits as a defense mechanism in dealing with XH, which doesn't help in my current relationship.

I've always been around very strong men who get things done decisively and swiftly....with my XH being an extreme version of that. I've never been involved with a man like BF, but took a chance because after being married to an ex-Marine & feeling like I had been in the military myself, BF's relaxed demeanor was a welcome change.

I'd like to make it work with BF and in the almost 3 years that we have been together, I feel that I have made several adjustments to my own communication style in order to make him more comfortable.

Funny thing is, when we've had these conflicts he often later thanks me for "pushing" him to do what he knew all along was the right thing. Such as spending more time with his boys. I have always been in favor of that.

Oh Geez....I just realized....I started this thread asking for help dealing with BF's XW, but in reality I'm asking for help in dealing with BF.....lol


Shelle

LOL - funny how topics seem to segue! There's no sin in that.

Just for fun, I would like you to look at your posts and see the DJ's you committed against your BF. Since his IB was brought up, this could be a good lesson in LBs. Have you ever read the book?

I haven't read everyone's answers yet but I want to give my response while it is fresh in my mind.

I feel it is your BF's place to deal with his son, and not your place to give your input unless he asks your advice. I feel that your seeming stressed and affected by this is because you're taking on an area that doesn't belong to you. Let go of it.

Your assessment of his XW seems accurate. However, neither you nor your BF can change her behavior. He can only control HIS responses and it is up to HIM how he deals with his son. He has refused many of the things she has tried to get him to do so he doesn't seem to be one who is totally manipulated or controlled by his XW. She does, however, to be unceasing in her attempts and I'm sure that is quite wearing on him. It is not always easy to balance a situation like this, it is challenging in fact, for he wants to show concern for his son but doesn't want to be conned into doing something he doesn't feel is the right thing to do. I commend him for that. You need to step back from the situation and let him do what he feels is right. Be there for him but don't let yourself be drawn in so emotionally in a situation that is not yours. I would definitely consider how much you can effectively do this before I'd consider marrying him, because if you can't let him be dad to his own son and it's going to continue to bug you every time he does anything with regards to him, you are in for one stirred up life!

Couple of thoughts on this:

First and foremost, it's none of your business. If I was dating you I'd dump you for giving me grief about how I handle my matters with my kid.

But you're in a situation that is a perfect example of why you shouldn't live together before getting married.

If you had your own place and stood on your own, you could say, "I don't need this drama in my life. He's a nice guy, but I can do better for myself and my son."

You call, you end it, it's over. Little to no drama.

But now you're living together. It's not that easy.

This is how problems get glossed over when living together and they fester, create resentment, and get worse if the step to marriage is ever taken.

When I dated again I made it a mission that I would meet someone without drama. Baby mama drama is a lot of drama.

But you're falling into a common trap that is a deathknell for marriages with mixed families. It isn't your kid. It isn't your place. You have NO say in this matter and even less so as someone who isn't his wife.

My advice would be to back off. His business with his kid and his ex is his business.

So unless you're willing to make a committment where you accept him, his kid, and his ex and all the drama that comes with it, then you need to end this relationship for his sake and the sake of his son and your son.

I know it sounds harsh. I don't intend to be harsh, but it is the truth.