BUMP!

bumping this for myself...

(so i'll remember to read it in a couple hours when i have time...)

Obviously, I have to go back to the drawing board (with my EPs). Thanks, TsT for this list (I think).

Pretty thorough, isn't he.

Marital,

Yes indeed.
VERY thorough!
When I can catch my breath, I'll start to create a better list for myself.

Bump...

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BUMP

What is the best way to handle an EP that was not abided by? For example, a WH that texted a female co-worker with stupid info and an EP was no texting OS women unless it was work-related?

Does this mean the EP needs to be tightened up? And how would you do that?

You ask a simple sounding question when your situation is quite opposite of simple.

How many strikes against him does he now have? How many more is he allowed before Plan B? That's what YOU "tighten up". Your boundaries. Think about where you draw that red line and what YOU do if/when he crosses it. Many a chronic wayward will stick a toe over the line to test how much they can get away with.

Your wayward is in charge of "tightening up" HIS EPs. What's HIS plan to do this?
You are in charge of tightening up YOUR boundaries and setting your red line.

How many times does he get to stick his wayward toe over that red line? Hmmmmmm?

Your husband's behavior is incompatible with recovery. His behavior toward women makes another affair inevitable as things stand now.

In the extremely unlikely event that he doesn't end up actually cheating, his behavior makes a recovered and happy marriage impossible.

Are you willing to settle for dregs? Knowing that the specter of another A is lurking? Or does a fantastic M mean enough to you that you're willing to fight for it by accepting nothing less?

Thanks Ladies, my thoughts exactly.

How about in general, what does Dr Harley advise for a broken EP? Or does it depend on what the EP was?

I'm not sure what Dr. H says specifically about that, but my own opinion is that it depends on what was done, and what the overall trend has been.

Hypothetical Scenario 1: I find that AJ was texting a woman and there had been a few exchanges of small talk. He hasn't violated any other EP's that I know about for wow, over 7 years now. I am triggered and upset, so I talk to him, am honest about the hurt that this caused me, and remind him that he agreed not to do this. He apologizes, re-promises not to respond to any more friendly overtures, and gives serious thought to why he allowed that gateway EP to slide. The kind of thought that leads to actions in his life, that will protect our marriage. Though I supervise carefully, I let him take the lead on this, and wait to see what happens.

Hypothetical Scenario 2: AJ has been sloppy about EP's for quite a while, been grudging about R, and done almost nothing of what I asked him to do. Every time I think I might leave, he steps up his efforts just enough so I feel bad about going, but without making an all-out bone-deep change. People have already been urging me to cut off contact with him for some time, when I find that he's been exchanging friendly texts with yet another female co-worker. I go into Plan B, wanting a beautiful, loving, fulfilling marriage, and no longer being willing to settle for anything less.

Hypothetical Scenario 3: After 7+ years of flawless adherence to EP's, I find out that OW generously bribed an employee of the cell phone company to get AJ's number, called him, and they are back in contact. AJ comes home and finds his belongings piled in the front yard, packed if he's lucky, and a succinct little PBL on top.

Hypothetical Scenario 4: AJ has been sloppy about EP's for a long time, grudging about R, and only doing the bare minimum to get by. One day, I find out that OW contacted him through a mutual friend of a mutual friend, and they are back in contact. AJ comes home and finds his belongings piled in the front yard, packed if he's lucky, and a succinct little PBL on top.


Sometimes the violation of an EP may nearly always have the same recommendation, as in the case of resumed C with OP, and in others it may depend on how bad it was and what else had been happening prior. Also whether the F(?)WS is immediately responsive to the respectful request for change.

It's deeper than "a broken EP". He's engaging in the exact same behavior that led to his first affair.

First affair:

Friendly and chatting at work -- leads to friendly and chatty texts. Texting each other about finding their cars and getting home safely? He is not being honest when he tells you this is only a work relationship. The fact that he went into work to talk to her about you being upset about the texts just confirms that they are accustomed to discussing things of a PERSONAL nature -- and that he is not serious about making radical changes with regards to his boundaries with women.

You can't MAKE him get serious. All you can do is make plans to protect yourself and show him that you won't engage in a recovery when he is not serious about making radical changes.

It should be said that a WS who is not serious about implementing EPs after almost wrecking their M with an A is most likely not going to be serious about implementing other parts of this program.

POJA,
POUA,
PORH
becoming an expert in meeting your ENs and eliminating behavior that erodes your LB$

Does any of this resonate with you?

SusieQ,

You are exactly right. I didn't do a good job of POJA. RQ said I did a good job of meeting POUA. I'm not sure what PORH is please let me know. I do realize now what a poor job I did of protecting my EN's. That is what im working on now.

HerPapaBear,

THANKS!! for a great thread

KISS

I don't know if this helps, but our EP for texting was to eliminate the ability and access to text. This meant no cell phone for a period of time (I know, gasp, but you can live without a cell phone). When the cell phone was back, I had all text messaging blocked from his line. He cannot send or receive text messages (we use Verizon.) He agreed to all of this. I wasn't willing to accept that he 'wouldn't do it' - I wanted to ensure he couldn't do it too.

That is the ONLY approach that works! You did good!

Bump