Also, on the work thing - since they can't uninstall a core program from our machines (i.e.) I have requested approval for a software that can block all sites but specifically approved ones that I use for work. The password to approve sites would lie in the hands of someone Amy designates here at work like my boss. That would leave me without the internet but still able to keep my job.

...oh and despite the fact that you're piling on me because my motivations seem suspect to you, I know this is my doing and I want you all to know that I appreciate your taking the time and caring enough about Amy and me to post in our threads.

How disrespectful to your wife. You apologized to your partner in crime, the skank who assaulted your wife and children? HOW DARE YOU? This woman HELPED YOU assault your wife and you apologized TO HER?

That is some serious wayward fog. And what is even more terrible is that you committed this disgrace in front of your VICTIM. This skank was not the victim. She committed a crime against your wife and your kids!! Your wife and your children ARE HER VICTIMS.

You did not sin against her, you sinned WITH HER. BIG DIFFERENCE. She was your partner in adultery who helped you sin against your wife, her husband and your children.

All I can say is you better pass a polygraph tomorrow with flying colors.... I don't think amy can handle another failure.

You got 1 day to come clean you better make use of it.

My pastor told me that this was a sin against both her and her husband since they (were) one flesh in marriage. Amy wasn't a fan of me asking her forgiveness but understood that going into the phone call. She agreed to that aspect before we called. If she didn't agree I would not have done it. This is POJA as I understand it. If I'm not understanding it correctly, please tell me.

You and me both, LuvsDavid. Nobody wants this question to be settled more than I do.

This was a sin WITH the OW and AGAINST THE OWH. You did not sin AGAINST her, you sinned WITH HER. There is nothing to be forgiven FOR.


Which is a violation of the POJA. You coerced her into agreeing to something disgraceful and disrespectful to her. Agreeing to something you ARE NOT a fan of is NOT the POJA. It is a violation of the POJA.

You can't undo what you did, but you can get your thinking straight and apologize to your wife for disrespecting her by asking her RAPIST for forgiveness. This woman, the OW, committed a crime against your wife and your children WITH YOU.

Schlag - do your four kids play a role in your decision to make the marriage work?

What ultimately brought you to your "Come to Jesus moment" was it your life after divorce or was it because the OW dumped you?

Follow - me here ...

1) Your last PA with this particular HS woman was in September 2009, is that correct?

2) Your last contact with this same HS woman (who you just called last night/and also told her xH) was in July 2011? Is this correct?

How did you keep this HS woman in your brain? What did you do to keep romanticizing about this woman? What was it about this woman that you couldn't let go of?

You stated earlier you did not love this woman (which you failed on the polygraph) correct?

Why all of a sudden does this woman not matter? What has changed?

This woman divorced her husband in 2009, correct? What did this woman do after her divorce? Did this woman divorce her husband because you promised her you were leaving your wife?

What specifically did you tell this woman all these years about the state of your marriage?

Please be specific about your timeline.

Interesting that when you brought up this whole idea of talking to OWH you didn't mention apologizing once, and Amy had to be the one to push the issue of exposing to him but you were compelled to apologize to the OW, your partner in crime, right in front of her victim's face?

Very very foggy.

When was the last time you had contact with this OW before today?

blah blah blah- the excuses, the covers, the lack of honesty with yourself is amazing. work on getting you wife to forgive.

you have less than a day have your final come to jesus moment.

you hit her with a bus 7x (you lied on the radio yesterday) already, i think she is strong enough to hear the truth and make an informed decision about her life and possibly your future together.

sorry, you are really pissing me off, so i will just stick to Amys side at this point. listen to me i was her 5 months ago!

I think your husband might ne able to shed some light to him dee.

Okay I'm confused. The person you spoke to in 2011 is not the same person from 2009 correct? So which 1 did you call?

In regards to sinning against his AP... I have to agree that he sinned with and against her. He stole from her what she should have given to her husband. Likewise, the OW sinned against him. Time affection their body... That said, I agree this is a violation of POJA. It doesn't seem to be ENTHUSIASTIC agreement.

If Amy wasn't ready, if Amy didn't want it, it should not have been done. I think because of the nature of affairs, asking for forgiveness is one option not left open between former AP's and should be avoided at all costs.

CV

But he didn't steal anything FROM HER, he stole from the OWH. The sin was, therefore, committed against her husband. The sin was not committed against each other, but WITH each other, AGAINST God and their spouses. Asking her for "forgiveness" was inappropriate. Not only was there nothing TO forgive, but the purpose of forgiveness is reconcilation. There should be no reconciliation here.

Schlag,

You are betraying not only your wife,

but yourself.


Here is the deal.

You cannot sit here and lie about this conversation with the OW. The first thing you say to her is "my wife is listening".


That is a heads-up to the OW. You gave that to her in order to tell her that everything you were about to say was being monitored, and that furthermore, was being SCRIPTED by your wife.

You essentially told the OW not to listen to a word you said. And that's what message your wife got, too, Schlag.

The entire conversation with OW was fake. Oh, except the one part...

Your apology to the OW. Oh, she read that part loud and clear, Schlag. What the OW understood from that conversation was that you were embarrassed to be calling her, and that you were sorry for embarrassing her, too.

Your wife got the message loud and clear, too.


You did NOT stand up for your marriage, or for your wife, Schlag.

What you did was tell the OW, "My wife is making me call you. She is making me say that I was a bad person and that I can't talk to you anymore. I don't want to do this. I mailed you a letter, and my wife wants to make sure you know the I mailed the letter, because she thinks you will believe she wrote it and sent it. I'm sorry I have to call, and I told you that my marriage was in trouble before. See what I mean? I told you that I have to deal with stuff, and here's some proof. Sorry. Please forgive me. Please feel sorry for me."


Essentially, that's what was said.


I wasn't even there, Schlag, but pretty much, OW is telling her friends that's what happened.

She is saying that your wife is a shrew, and "made you call".


Because THAT IS HOW YOU SET IT UP.



Now, do you see why you are not yet broken? Why we are telling you that YOU ARE FOGGY?


Your first idea is how to "fix" the OW....what you "owe" her.


You owe OW nothing. Not one thing.




Your bottom has not yet fallen out. It will. I would hate to see it happen at the expense of your marriage.


When you face the polygraph - make sure that your memory is as open as possible. Because your marriage absolutely cannot withstand one more lie.

Not one more.

Do not for a second believe that withholding the truth "to protect your wife" is a good strategy.


SB

How did poly go?

Well, I'm devastated and horrified at the polygraph results.

The questions were:

1. Did you tell Michelle that you would leave Amy for her?

(I had her change it from "Did you talk about leaving Amy for her" so that I would be sure to pass it.)

2. Are you being honest about your intentions in telling Michelle that Amy was in the room for the phone call?

(I was sure I would pass this one)

3. Are you witholding information about any sexual or emotional affair from Amy?

4. Are you witholding any information about sexual internet activities from Amy?

I thought that I would pass with flying colors on at least the first two.

I thought I might have a problem with the last two because there's so much I don't remember and I really feared those questions.

But I failed all of them.

So I apparently am lying even to myself.

Amy and I have talked about this for the last hour and a half and the only explanation for what everybody else is seeing is that Michelle meant/means more to me that I will even admit to myself. Enough that I could lie to myself two days ago in that phone call and believe my reason for saying Amy was listening.

I also must be lying to myself about telling Michelle I wanted to leave Amy for her. I know that I never said those words, but I must know underneath that the words I did say, and comments like the Brady Bunch comment, really did say to her that I wanted to leave Amy for her. I am absolutely certain that the conscious thought I had about leaving Amy for her was dismissed because I never really wanted to leave Amy for her.

There are no other sexual contacts besides the list I've posted. (The "experimental" thing I didn't list in public was seeking a homosexual affair that was never followed through on. Amy knows fully about that.)

So The deception all around just has to be me lying to myself about the entire Michelle relationship. I don't want to believe that I loved her. I know that I believe that I don't love her today. But the phone call two days ago says that on some level I was sabotaging what I was trying to say to her.

If I am witholding truth, it is from myself. Which is really scary for me and for Amy right now.

The evidence says that I can't let go of this drug. I am looking at the evidence and I just can't believe it. But there it sits.

Let me get this straight. So you flunked it, not because you were deceptive and are in the long habit of being deceptive, but because you are basically insane and are "withholding the truth" from yourself?

I think Amy should take you at your word on this and accept that you don't KNOW true from false.

Since that is the case, she will NEVER be safe with you. NEVER.