Isn't that what we are saying.

If you say BH's have an easier time winning their spouse back than a BW, what is that saying to those BH's who don't win their wives back? Are you saying they did the program right?

If someone says they don't listen to the radio show, and someone says that explains why you don't understand the program, that one is pretty clear.

If someone says that the reason a wife doesn't want to have sex with her husband is because of something he's doing wrong, then aren't they blaming him for her behavior?

After all, if a man doesn't want to have sex with his wife, we blame him. Is he having an affair, is he watching porn, etc?

A guy shows up complaining about no sex, we blame him. We don't ask if his wife is addicted to anything else, it's his behavior that has to change.

I'm just fed up with all the ills being placed on the shoulders of husbands who may or may not be the issue.

Saved by the pager, LOL. Apparently someone has a computer emergency, so adieu for today.

Here's Dr. Harley covering a situation that might be an aversion in a man, to going to some social occasion with his wife:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/play_segment.cfm?sid=515

Whoa Nellie !


Nope. If anyone dared blame Mr Pep for any of MY choices .... I'd think they were nutz. Not to mention stupid.


It's entirely possible for a BH to do everything according to Harley .... and his WW can be eternally unrepentant and remain an unfaithful ingrate.
A BH can indeed do "the program wrong" and lose ground. But, the demise of the marriage would require an independent autopsy.





I don't listen to the radio often. I LOVE IT when one of the radio shows is linked .... that way I can expand my MB knowledge.


Whether it is typical, or not, it is offensive to me when a wayward of either gender avoids personal responsibility for their choices.


Not at first ....
Dr Harley's goal is to get the marriage back on track.
If a BH waits for that apology before he'll work the MB program .... there will be a long wait. This speaks poorly of female waywards, not the BH.

ALL THE ILLS ??????
Every one of the "ills"?

I would not want to put up with that kind of abuse, EE. I would get into Plan B FAST to protect myself from it.

Ok, I agree that some women do put their children before their marriages and understand the damage it creates. But I don't understand how you get that this is an "addiction?" How are you defining addiction? I am an addict with an addictive personality and I don't see the addition connection here.

You know that's a disrespectful judgment, right?

You may not care, and it may not matter at this point, but are you aware of it? I'm REALLY bad about saying things that are DJs without realizing it, which keeps me from knowing how much potential I have to change.

That is *YOUR* assumption, not mine. I made no such statement or even implied such a thing.

Had to fix that.

Look at the first half, now look at the second half.

All that was done was this; Dr. Harley noticed dogs with foaming mouths tend to bit people, so he told people if they approach a dog with a foaming mouth, expect to get bit!


That's not a "Harleyism." It's just a solid observation. I'm willing to bet that other marriage counselors out there encounter it in the exact same way, and many of them will peg down the "unmet emotional needs" idea when it is a woman having an affair. It can't be "her" fault, he didn't "meet her needs." (Not to mention, EE, you should know that women are incapable of being wrong!)

For me, it's saying I have an atypical wife. (Or abnormal...)

Nope.

It is a fact that a husband has a easier time winning his spouse back.
It is also a fact that she still has a choice.
To say that a husband has an easier time winning her back DOES NOT MEAN that he will always be successful.

It is also true that some husbands DON'T follow the program, then whine that it's not working and their marriage is failing. Ask Markos.
But it is also true that a husband may follow it perfectly, and the wife doesn't respond. In those cases, the wife is usually in an affair. No one has disagreed with that at all on this thread.

I did not say that you don't understand the program as it is written on this site and in his books. I said your education is lacking because Dr. Harley talks about a lot of this stuff you're wondering about on the radio show, and nowhere else. Yet you say he doesn't talk about it, and you argue with those WHO DO listen to what Dr. Harley has said on these subjects.

It's a simple fact. Dr. Harley DOES talk about this in his books, so I'm confused as to why you are having a problem with it. If a man lovebusts his wife, she will not want to have sex with him. What can he do? STOP LOVEBUSTING HER. If he neglects her, she will not want to have sex with him. What can he do? STOP NEGLECTING HER.

Sounds like you're arguing that a wife SHOULD WANT to have sex with her husband regardless of how he treats her?

If someone stabs you in the back, would you want to turn around and have a pleasant cup of tea with them? Come on, it's human nature not to want to do anything with someone who is hurting you.

Because it's usually true. Men don't feel about sex the same way a woman does. A man can usually be slapped around quite a bit more than a woman before he looses desire for sex -- although I think I did some pretty nasty things to Markos enough that he didn't want to have sex with me for awhile. THAT was the exception for most men rather than the rule, though.

Because it typically is. Dr. Harley says so.


Dr. Harley himself is harder on husbands than he is on wives. Did you know that?

How about OCD?



How about a mom who takes her children and; home-schools, has dance, singing, and instrument lessons, ballet lessons, gymnastics, karate, theater, etc, etc, etc.


My nephew and his wife had their daughter in private school, private tutoring, piano lessons, ballet, theater, and gymnastics.

She's 9, and running until 10 o'clock each night.

It's quite easy to over-parent.

I am not getting the leap to "addiction" being implied here, though. Addiction is a physical or psychological DEPENDENCE. OCD is defined as "Obsessive�compulsive disorder (OCD) is an anxiety disorder characterized by intrusive thoughts that produce uneasiness, apprehension, fear, or worry, by repetitive behaviors aimed at reducing the associated anxiety, or by a combination of such obsessions and compulsions."

We all can agree that it is bad to ignore your spouse in favor of your children, why use far reaching definitions to make that point?

Hyperbole ....

I know Harley explains that a husband has an easier time winning his wife back, but I was not aware he had said that men were primarily to blame for sexual problems? I listen to the show every day, too. Can you expand on what you mean, Prisca?

Less hyperbole, more poorly applied sarcasm.

The point is more applied to focusing far too much attention on the children.

Now, EE is going to love this - BUT, a good deal of men allow their wives to hyper-focus on the children. They either participate, or... develop a parallel lifestyle.

I did it. I thought it was "the right thing to do." Even though I watched my brother attempt to do this, and saw it blow up in his face.

I simply thought that I had to try harder to keep my wife happy than he had.

What I didn't know (simply explained; Love Bank) is the eventual damage and drain I would be placing upon myself.

It's a lack of knowledge coupled with a lack of honesty, a 50/50 split, when a wife becomes child-focused and the husband shoulders it silently.

I will add that I have had sexual aversion in my marriages and it was ALWAYS due to the fact that I ignored my husband. I wouldn't spend time with him. REFUSED.

And I hear this same thing over and over again from women who come on this forum. They absolutely REFUSE to spend 15 hours a week with their husbands and insist to me it can't be done because they are too busy. Everything else comes first. I have had untold arguments with WOMEN on this board over the years who could not even be bothered to go out with their husbands. The result is that these women are emotionally DETACHED from their husbands.

Actually, we suggest positive changes he can make that are extremely likely to make a difference.

Some people get mired down in the issue of "blame."

Others get into "do what it takes to have a good marriage" because they want a GOOD MARRIAGE!

AGREE.

I don't know that he used the word "blame," but I did recently hear him comment that he puts more credit/responsibility for the success of the sexual experience in marriage on the husband. I wish I had written this one down, but I did not.