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I had an affair working on 2 years ago. Although deep down my wife knew this when I told her I didn't want to be married anymore I haven't come cleann about it until recently. I have been trying to shove my cruelty's and lies down for so long. It is something I will never forgive myself for, so I haven't asked for her's. It lasted aprox. 3 months. There are no minmizing my actions even if some may think there are reasons other than selfishness that people stray. I accept that I made a conscious decision to turn my back on our marriage, children ,family and friends by NOT communicating my needs to begin with. I took the route of a crook and a quitter. I didn't say easy b/c the energy it took to carry on the affair, to hide it, and lie about it was merely a fraction of what it takes to express my needs and trust my wife with that as she up to this point had trusted me.. My wife is a member also and has encouraged me to at least read some posts (besides hers)and possibly start posting myself. Honestly I am taken back by some of the suggestions I have read on here. At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature. I apologize if I sound disagreeable or argumentative but I need help realizing some of these points. I suppose I don't have a question but maybe this is the way I am introducing myself to the other members here. Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated.
Honestly I am taken back by some of the suggestions I have read on here. At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature.
I bet the suggestions here just scare the crap out of you!! If I were a wayward they would scare me too, so I fully understand. Welcome to Marriage Builders!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt
I asked my SO if she wanted to call me out in public per what we read on here.
Are you married? What is a "SO?"
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt
As far as the boundaries go, the fact that there were little or none prior to your affair is ultimately why you are here.
For example, one of the main boundaries in a successful and thriving marriage is neither party having opposite sex friendships. I don't know how your affair started, but most start innocently with casual conversations. While on the surface, they may seem innocent, they allow for connections to be made.
Many wayward spouses see boundaries as punishment or attempts by their spouse to control them. They want the freedom to do as they please, failing to recognize the reason they are where they are is because there were no boundaries and they were allowed to do as they pleased. It isn't an attempt to control. Its an attempt to create an atmosphere void of secrecy, independent behaviors, lack of trust, and the list goes on. It is an attempt to create an atmosphere where a marriage can thrive.
BS - Me 36 WS - wife 34 Married 10 yrs DDay - Early November 2010 WS filed Divorce 11/9/10 Divorce final 12/22/11
1 Corinthians 13:7: (LOVE) Beareth all things, believeth all things, HOPETH all things, endureth all things.
Painfullesson, why don't you start your own thread with your own questions so jack can get the help he needs without disruption.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt
I had an affair working on 2 years ago. Although deep down my wife knew this when I told her I didn't want to be married anymore I haven't come cleann about it until recently. I have been trying to shove my cruelty's and lies down for so long. It is something I will never forgive myself for, so I haven't asked for her's. It lasted aprox. 3 months. There are no minmizing my actions even if some may think there are reasons other than selfishness that people stray. I accept that I made a conscious decision to turn my back on our marriage, children ,family and friends by NOT communicating my needs to begin with. I took the route of a crook and a quitter. I didn't say easy b/c the energy it took to carry on the affair, to hide it, and lie about it was merely a fraction of what it takes to express my needs and trust my wife with that as she up to this point had trusted me.. My wife is a member also and has encouraged me to at least read some posts (besides hers)and possibly start posting myself. Honestly I am taken back by some of the suggestions I have read on here. At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature. I apologize if I sound disagreeable or argumentative but I need help realizing some of these points. I suppose I don't have a question but maybe this is the way I am introducing myself to the other members here. Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated.
Welcome to MB Jack, I'm glad you're posting. It's okay if you are "taken aback" by some of what you've read on here, most people who haven't learned about Marriage Builders think the same thing... at first. Dr. Harley has saved 1000s of marriages using these methods and even though it feels counter-intuitive, it works. Once you learn a little more, you might understand better the reasoning behind it.
Who is your wife? It would be helpful to know so we can help her too. It's best if you don't post to each other's threads though so you both can receive individual advice.
Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage ********************* “In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists.” Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
...At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature. I apologize if I sound disagreeable or argumentative but I need help realizing some of these points. I suppose I don't have a question but maybe this is the way I am introducing myself to the other members here. Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated.
Welcome to MarriageBuilders, Jack.
OK, let's not argue about boundaries or exposure, let's talk about the concepts.
First, re: boundaries --to start with, 3 questions for you: 1) How'd you meet your other woman? 2) How did you get into an affair with her? 3) Why do you think you got into an affair?
As for "total exposure," depends on what you mean by this. What about it do you find objectionable?
By the way, I'm a guy who had an affair. My wife & I have saved our marriage & made it better than it was before the affair. I did some things right, and a few things wrong, and can tell you lots more.
Last question for starters: How long ago did you come clean to your wife; and what prompted you to come clean?
Me: FWH, 50 My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold DD23, DS19 EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09 Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009 Married 25 years & counting. Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband. "I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol "Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
I decided to end the relationship. We went to see a counselor which helped me a bit, but until recently I didn't realize it didn't do much for my wife. She has been carrying alot with her while I thought we were on the road to recovery. I changed jobs,haven't spoke to the OW at all since the day I left that job. I haven't even seen her until the other day when my wife and I went to lunch and she was there. I have no desire to see the OW again and the only feelings I can associate her with are shame and selfishness. I am 41 and 3 mos. seems like a very short time but it has left such an impression on us that even when we say we have been together for 12 years I feel there should be an asterik in there with a note that say "except the time J was screwing around". My concern is primarily for my wife in that she will never be able to trust me again and that is a terrible thing. My family would not disown me but I do not see the importance of them knowing or putting them through that type of disappointment. My wife has confided my actions to her sister and 2 best friends. Her parents do not know. Their reaction especially her mother's - very unpredictable. My desire is to meet her needs and communicate in a healthier way. We are following a plan. We have been completing the questionaires and discussing them and it's worked out great. Conversation always seems to go back to my affair. I don't expect a do over or a complete washing away but at what point can we exhaust the hurt and mistrust ? Just some things I think about. How has anyone here tried to deal with any of these things. I often think my own guilt and remorse gets in the way.
Welcome to Marriage Builders, jack! What is your wife's posting name?
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At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature.
That's okay. You don't have to. Yet. I think you will come to accept the concepts here as you continue to read. You're going to be reading posts by members who have recovered their marriages and are practicing the very concepts that have taken you aback. You may also read some threads by members who have not been able to recover their marriages because one or both spouses don't follow those same concepts.
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I apologize if I sound disagreeable or argumentative but I need help realizing some of these points.
No harm, no foul. This is very new to you, and you have been wayward. That's a normal initial reaction.
D-Day 2-10-2009 Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever! Thank you Marriage Builders!
Jack, the reason that exposure is so important is because the more people that know, the more people to hold you accountable. Shining the light on our misdeeds makes them much less attractive for the future; it makes us safer to others. And more importantly, exposure would provide more support for your wife and your marriage. Dr Harley recommends that the affair be exposed to your family and your children for this reason.
Many of your family will be upset, and rightfully so. Adultery hurts your families, too. But you can deal with that by making amends to your wife.
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My concern is primarily for my wife in that she will never be able to trust me again and that is a terrible thing.
It is a rational thing. She should not have trusted you in the first place. It is too much trust that leads to affairs. Now that you know where your weaknesses lie, you will take steps [steps = boundaries] to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Here is what Harley has written about trust:
Originally Posted by Dr Harley
"One topic is loss of trust. How can a spouse ever trust an unfaithful partner again? My answer is that the spouse should never have been trusted in the first place. I shouldn't be trusted by my wife, and I shouldn't trust her. The fact is that we are all wired for infidelity, and under certain conditions, we'll all do it.
The way to protect your marriage from something that has been common to man (and women) for thousands of years is to recognize the threat, and do something to prevent it from happening. Basing a marriage on the Policy of Radical Honesty and the Policy of Joint Agreement goes a long way toward preventing an affair. Being each other's favorite leisure-time companions, and not being away from each other overnight are also important safety measures. Meeting each other's most important emotional needs, avoiding Love Busters and building an integrated lifestyle, free of secret second lives, are all ways to affair-proof your marriage. With these measures in place, we end up trusting our spouses because an affair becomes almost impossible to achieve."
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt
...My concern is primarily for my wife in that she will never be able to trust me again and that is a terrible thing.
Then you'll want to work at learning about boundaries until you get the concept. Because demonstrating that you understand boundaries is the only way you'll restore increments of trust, over time.
Originally Posted by jack70621
...Conversation always seems to go back to my affair. I don't expect a do over or a complete washing away but at what point can we exhaust the hurt and mistrust ?
Hard to tell from the online format, but I get the sense that you're expecting (or hoping) her to get over this fairly quickly. Lengthen your time horizons, my friend. For your wife, emotionally-speaking, the affair didn't end when you ended it; it ended when you confirmed it for her; it ended only when you stopped the deception. So it's still extremely fresh for her. Don't think weeks or months. Recovering from the trauma of infidelity takes a couple of years. But it can be done. If you follow Harley's "4 Rules" of Protection, Care, Honesty and Time, her anxiety will lessen, over time (and not in linear fashion where each day is better than the one before, but rather on a "roller-coaster" curve, gradually dissipating).
Originally Posted by jack70621
How has anyone here tried to deal with any of these things. I often think my own guilt and remorse gets in the way.
You're thinking of it wrong: Guilt isn't an obstacle! It can be your friend! See, it means you've got a functioning conscience. That means you're less likely to do this stuff again. Be grateful you feel guilt.
As for remorse -- well, it's not quite a synonym for "guilt." Rather, remorse is "guilt + ", in the sense that it is a motivator -- it leads you to take actions to try to help your wife heal & to help her feel emotionally-safe with you again, and actions to help her improve your marriage. Not a paralyzing, self-focused guilt, but a motivating, "I'm gonna be a better person" guilt. Make sense to ya?
P.S. -- I asked you several questions on my first post to you. Looking forward to your answers.
Me: FWH, 50 My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold DD23, DS19 EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09 Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009 Married 25 years & counting. Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband. "I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol "Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
Recovering from the trauma of infidelity takes a couple of years.
I'm three years past D-Day, jack. With my completely remorseful husband helping me heal myself and our marriage, it still took a year for things to start settling down into some sense of 'normalcy'. It has taken longer than that to get to a point of a semblance of trust, but I will NEVER trust him 100% again. And I don't want him to trust me, either, although I have never been unfaithful to him. That sense of 100% trust can lead to a complacency that leaves the marriage vulnerable to an affair.
All of this, from a silly affair that lasted only a few months.
I was recently triggered by a totally inconsequential thing that was only remotely related to the affair. It is THAT damaging to your wife. You're going to have to do some heavy lifting to help her, friend. You've made a good start by coming here. Open your mind up a bit to what can really help her and I think you'll be in good shape.
D-Day 2-10-2009 Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever! Thank you Marriage Builders!
I had an affair working on 2 years ago. Although deep down my wife knew this when I told her I didn't want to be married anymore I haven't come cleann about it until recently. I have been trying to shove my cruelty's and lies down for so long. It is something I will never forgive myself for, so I haven't asked for her's. It lasted aprox. 3 months. There are no minmizing my actions even if some may think there are reasons other than selfishness that people stray. I accept that I made a conscious decision to turn my back on our marriage, children ,family and friends by NOT communicating my needs to begin with. I took the route of a crook and a quitter. I didn't say easy b/c the energy it took to carry on the affair, to hide it, and lie about it was merely a fraction of what it takes to express my needs and trust my wife with that as she up to this point had trusted me.. My wife is a member also and has encouraged me to at least read some posts (besides hers)and possibly start posting myself. Honestly I am taken back by some of the suggestions I have read on here. At this point I don't totally agree with harping about boundaries or lack thereof causing infedelity, totally exposing an affair, and some of the other suggested solutions that are very absolute in nature. I apologize if I sound disagreeable or argumentative but I need help realizing some of these points. I suppose I don't have a question but maybe this is the way I am introducing myself to the other members here. Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated.
Hi Jack,
Welcome to MB. loosening of boundaries is often a conscious action. Let me ask... What was it that caused you to seek out another person besides your spouse? There was a reason you chose to not share with your wife and a reason you chose to devote time and affection to another woman.
CV
Celtic Voyager Married 22+ years 3 young adult children
Jack, I'm copying an apology letter so you know what one looks like;
This is copied from the notable posts thread
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I just wanted to share this and see what you all thought....here goes. I'm sorry is so easy to write, hard to say, and incredibly painful to feel. Compared to feeling truly sorry, writing it and saying it looks & feels so inadequate.
If I had never said I was sorry, and if I do not act as though I'm sorry in everyday life and especially how I treat you, writing this letter would mean nothing. In fact, under tose conditions, a mere letter would infuriate you.
In light of all this, I am more than confident of the sorrow I feel, that it shows and I have to continue to tell you I am sorry. So hopefully this letter only reinforces what is continually being expressed. My ultimate goal is to make you know that I am sorry (although I could never fully show you), by the way I live.
I'm sorry for so many things...I'm sorry for letting you down. You beleived in m e, I'm sorry for ruining your belief. For taking things that you were sure of , that I made you sure of, and turning them upside down.
I'm sorry for killing your good friend. The guy you confided in. The man you could go and talk to about something that upset you. The one you would call on when no one else would do. The one youshared yourself with. The one you were a freind to. The one you talked to for hours and hours when you were single, the one you belived enough in to walk down that aisle. "I'm sorry" doesn;t come close to how I feel for changing "I do" to "I didn't". i'll be shedding tears in my grave that only God will see.
I know this because my sorrow has buried me six feet in a casket made of regret, in a box where light and air is no more. A prisioner of the past. And everyday I am there now, And God sees the tears. And everytime I take a peak out above the ground, I see a tombstone with your name on it. And the only thing worse than being where I am is knowing where you are and knowing that I put you there.
I am sorry that I separted you from your friend, the one who loved you, was commited and dedicated to you. The one you were commited to and dedicated to. The one you stayed faithful to.
I'm sorry the person who cared for me, the person I love, I hurt more than anyone I've ever hurt in the world. I'm sorry for every time during the day and night you think about what I've done. I'm sorry for every tear you shed because your husband cheated on you, had sexual relations with other people. I'm sorry that I decieved you, lied to you, misled you, I'm sorry I was a hypocrite, acting like I was faithful and doing the right things, the honorable things, when I wasn't.
I'm so sorry that I took a person out of your heart, who you were so proud of, so appreciative of the way you thought he handled your illness. I'm sorry I crushed all the good feelings you had. I hate the fact I crushed all the warm feelings you enjoyed, the good and conforting thoughts you had.
I"m sorry I replaced the one you trusted with someone you no longer want to trust. I'm sorry I blindsided you with awful and shocking news that the person you thought would always uphold you in the tough times, kicked you when you were down. No matter what I now say and do, you know I let you down in the worst possible way. I'm sorry that there are no words to soothe your pain, no magic wand to change the past.
I'm sorry for the humiliation I've caused you. I'm sorry that you ever have any thoughts at all that you are inadequate. I hate that. I know they are very painful thoughts for you to have. I'm sorry that your friend treated you like an eenemy.
I'm sorry for every second I pursued another women. I'm sorry for every second I flirted. I'm sorry for every second I was with them. I'm sorry for every second I touched them. I'm sorry for every second I plotted to be with them. I'm sorry for every second I allowed myself to be even around them, I'm sorry I ever met them. I'm sorry that I ever looked at them or spoke to them. I'm sorry I ever gave any hint or suggestion that I was interested in anyone or anything other than you. I'm sorry that you live with the knowledge that I did every one of these things. I'm sorry I violated the trust you had in me regarding these things.
I'm sorry I took my body and mind and put myself in a sexual sewer. I'm sorry that I had inappropriate and destructive realationships with other people who were somebody's daughter, mom, finance, wife,friend,sister,aunt,neighbor,cousin.
I'm sorry that I allowed other women to have inappropriate and destructive relationships with your husband, our kids dad, my parents son, my brothers and sisters brother, my aunt's nephew, my neices uncle, our neighbor's neighbor,( he names them by name) a hockey and baseball team's coach, a whole bunch of young people's former youth pastor and a churchful of people's former assistant pastor, your parent's son-in-law your brothers brother-in-law , with someone who was many peoples friend, christian brother and neighbor.
I'm sorry you had to see a moron, a loser, an idiot throw away his life, break all his dreams, ruin his wifes life and break all her dreams, disgrace his family, disgrace his wife, disgrace his kids.
I'm sorry I destroyed the fact we were faithful to one another, destroyed the specialness you felt making love to your husband. I hate all those things so much. I'm sorry that you have to feel pain for all these things when you know it's not fair. I'm sorry for all the injustice you've incurred.
I'm sorry that I dug a hole and put you in it and took away your light and air. I'm sorry that I at least temporiraly ruined our lives, your life. I'm sorry that I let our daughter down so bad. I'm sorry for all the ways this has affected her. I'm sorry she has a dad who is such a terrible, awful, rotten man. I'm sorry that I'm not the dad she deserves and never could be. I'm sorry she thought she had a great dad, that her mommy had a great husband. I'm sorry I can no longer tell her to marry a man like her dad. I can never say those words to her again, ever. I'm sorry that when I dance with her to Daddy's little girl, there will be rears of eternal regret falling from her father's eyes down onto her beautiful hair. I'm sorry that's just the way it is and there is nothing I can do to change it.
I'm sorry that you will never feel pride about me again. I'm sorry for the doubt you feel in everything I say or do. I'm sorry you dont feel confident or secure in a future. I'm sorry your not enjoying the simple pleasures you normally would, spending time enjoying thing you normally would.
I'm sorry you dont look forward to being with your husband. I'm sorry you dont miss him when he isn't home. I'm sorry you dont love him. I'm sorry you don't feel good about him, that your not happy being seen with him. I'm sorry you think you never knew him.
I'm sorry for every moment I was angry or cross with you when I was mad and disgusted at myself. I'm sorry fir every moment I didn't repent and turn from my wicked ways. I'm sorry I didn't repent after the first time, the second, etc.
Many days I'm sorry I was ever born, because today you would be happier, better off with someone treating you right, taking better care of you, with someone who stuck by you when you were sick, with someone who could give you the things you want, the affection you deserve.
I'm sorry for everyday of our lives that I wasn't a better man, that I didn't treat you right, didn't talk to you right, didn't uphold you, support you, lift you up, give you hope, make you know how special you are, every day I didn't somehow inspire you by my deeds to be a better person yourself. I'm sorry for every tim e I've ever hurt you. I'm sorry for not saying the right thing, thinking of you in little ways that would make you happy. I'm sorry for every moment you don't enjoy life because of the misery I've caused. I'm sorry, so sorry, for every moment you've had to feel, hurt, lonely, abandoned, crushed, defeted, lost, helpless, hopless, disgusted, discounted, forgotten, spit on, punched, kicked, laughed at, put down, beat up, broken, cheap, neglected, run over, spun around, disoriented, left out, depressed, sad, tearful, angry, bitter...etc.
I'm sorry I borke my vows to you. I'm sorry I didn't do what I promised. I'm sorry I wasn't man enough, wasn't good enough, didn't have character enough, strength enough, courage enough, belief enough, perserverence enough to do the things I said I would. I'm sorry I've failed at being a husband, a father, a man, a human being.
I'm sorry I broke God's heart. I'm sorry I hurt people He loves. I'm sorry that I became the man the prophet described to David, who hurt innocent people. I'm sorry I had to hear God say "Thou art the man".
I'm sorry I put so much sin between God and myself, between you and myself. I'm sorry I broke the two most important bonds I ever had. I'm sorry that, as a temple of the Holy Spirit, I defilied God's temple, because wherever I go whatever sin I do, God's presence is also brought to that place. I defiled His Word, His Law, I took all that was good and did evil. I'm sorry I showed contempt for the both of you. I'm sorry I brought Him shame.
I'm sorry I sinned against you and Him, I'm sorry I didn't repent immediately and completely, I'm sorry that when I finally told you, I didn't say everything, I'm sorry I withheld some things. I'm sorry I put you through the whole process.
I'm sorry when I wake up, when I work, when I play, when I eat, when I fast, when I pray, when I laugh, when I cry, when I'm alone, when I'm with you, when I talk, when I am silent. I'm sorry when I run, when I walk, rest, think, meditate, listen, understand, when I don't understand, when I hope, when I fear, when I'm in despair, when I'm uplifted, I am sorry when you do all these things, when you anthing, when you do nothing, I am sorry.
I am sorry right now. I will be sorry tommorow and eferyday and night after tommorrow, through sunshine, rain, every season, every year, every moment, every breath, I will always be sorry until God Himslef wipes away every tear. I am sorry that if I run over a mountain, or wim an ocean, I can't change what I've done and what it's done to you.
I'm sorry enough to give you my dollar , my only dollar everyday, knowing I don't have a million days. (end of letter)
The last sentence is refering to our counseler giving the analogy of him owing me a million dollars and he can only pay me one dollar a day. Wow, quite a letter huh?
If I were a wayward they would scare me too, so I fully understand. Welcome to Marriage Builders! 
