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The Gingrich Question: Cheating vs. Open Marriagehttp://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebat...rriage/?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=thab1 This is interesting. I think they need some MB comments. Is open marriage discussed in Defense of Marriage? (That�s the one Dr H book I did not finish.) You may have to sign up for NYT on the web, not sure, to comment. It�s free. Sample from the debate: From Savage� thesis: (disclaimer � I have met Savage. I think he is honest and straightforward. Though I don�t share his views or orientations on many things): �Voters Accept Adultery, but Not Honesty
My favorite moment in Thursday night's G.O.P. debate: Newt Gingrich angrily denying his second ex-wife�s account of the end of their marriage � �Let me be quite clear: The story is false!� � and the socially conservative South Carolinians in the hall rewarding the former speaker of the House with sustained applause.
Marianne Gingrich's accusation shows that an honest open relationship is more scandalous than a dishonest adulterous relationship.
Let me be quite clear: Newt Gingrich wasn't denying that he had a six-year-long adulterous relationship with a Congressional staffer, a woman 20 years his junior, an affair that he conducted while overseeing the impeachment of Bill Clinton after his affair with a White House intern. Gingrich�s affair with a Congressional staffer is a long-acknowledged fact. That former Congressional staffer was sitting in the audience last night: her name is Callista, she�s the third Mrs. Gingrich, and she is � according to every profile written about her � a �devout Catholic.� (I was raised by devout Catholics. Devout Catholics are friends of mine. Devout Catholics do not have adulterous relationships with married men. Just sayin�.)
All Gingrich was denying with that �false!� was the allegation that he had asked his second ex-wife for an open marriage.
Newt Gingrich wants us to know that he did not ask his second ex-wife for an open marriage. An honest open relationship was never on the table. Newt and Callista�s six-year-long adulterous relationship was grounded in deceit and betrayal from the start, and Newt and Callista never wavered from the path of deceit and betrayal. Newt Gingrich was making an implicit promise to socially conservative voters: He did not ask his most recent ex-wife for an open marriage, and he will not ask any of his future ex-wives for an open marriage.
The lesson in Gingrich�s angry denial and the applause that greeted it: An honest open relationship is more scandalous, and more politically damaging, than a dishonest adulterous relationship. An honest, mutually consensual nonmonogamous marriage � which is not what Newt was proposing (you can�t negotiate an honest open marriage with your spouse six years into an affair) � is newer and somehow more threatening than the �traditional� cheating Gingrich engaged in.�As for me, no adulterer past or present will ever represent me in anything whatsoever if I can at all help it.
Last edited by Aphelion; 01/21/12 01:01 PM.
"Never forget that your pain means nothing to a WS." ~Mulan
"An ethical man knows it is wrong to cheat on his wife. A moral man will not actually do it." ~ Ducky
WS: They are who they are.
When an eel lunges out
And it bites off your snout
Thats a moray ~DS
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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From the article: According to one of his ex-wives, Newt Gingrich advocated open marriage as an alternative to monogamy or illicit sex. Of course, this was after he had strayed. Still, if her account is true, was he onto something? If more people considered such openness an option, would marriage become a stronger institution � less susceptible to cheating and divorce, and more attractive than unmarried cohabitation? I think that is cute and clever to apply a NEW NAME to adultery! Every wayward's dream! 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Yeah, that is rather disingenuous. Typical adulterer speak.
"Never forget that your pain means nothing to a WS." ~Mulan
"An ethical man knows it is wrong to cheat on his wife. A moral man will not actually do it." ~ Ducky
WS: They are who they are.
When an eel lunges out
And it bites off your snout
Thats a moray ~DS
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Too bad they didn't ask Dr H for input.
"Never forget that your pain means nothing to a WS." ~Mulan
"An ethical man knows it is wrong to cheat on his wife. A moral man will not actually do it." ~ Ducky
WS: They are who they are.
When an eel lunges out
And it bites off your snout
Thats a moray ~DS
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There can hardly be a greater oxymoron than "open marriage". It's just another way of people trying to have it both ways - to have the comfort and security of marriage AND all the fun of dating on the side, too!
If marriage is such a prison, then why do people try so desperately to hang onto it? Because they do. They try to have it both ways, because they want the benefits of both, and then are SHOCKED when they find out what really happens - that they can't fully enjoy either way.
They can't enjoy the benefits of the marriage because they're pouring off so much energy into other people and the marriage begins to starve.
They can't enjoy really being single because they have to pour off too much time and energy into trying to keep a starving marriage together.
That's not cool. That's not somebody who's enjoying life. That's just plain freaking stupid. It's never worked for anybody in the past and it's not going to work for anybody in the future.
And the one that really makes me laugh is the one about, "Well, we'd rather be honest about seeing other people instead of lying and sneaking around. He might be seeing other women, but at least I know about it!"
Really? You really are so stupid as to think ANYONE with an "open marriage" will feel any obligation to be honest about it? You've already given your "spouse" permission to date and screw other people - and you really think they're going to be honest if they think for one minute you might have an objection to a certain person or situation and possibly interfere with it? Really??
Me, BW
WH cheated in corporate workplace for many years. He moved out and filed in summer 2008.
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As for me, no adulterer past or present will ever represent me in anything whatsoever if I can at all help it. And this is one of the most troubling things I find about the current political scene. The choices we are presented as being the "best of the best" are in reality "evil or less-evil." How is one supposed to enter the polling place with those as our choices?
Preach the Gospel every day. When necessary, use words.
St. Francis of Assissi
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If marriage is such a prison, then why do people try so desperately to hang onto it? No kidding!
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Too bad they didn't ask Dr H for input. They will never ask for input from academics or professionals who support marriage and monogamy because it does not agree with their agenda.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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