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I feel insane for having these questions and not just immediately divorcing my husband. I know I'm crazy for even contemplating saving my marriage. Here is my story. I jump around a bit so I hope you can follow:
My husband and I have been together 17 years and married 11. We have 3 children. He has been a stay at home dad for the past 6-7 years after an injury he got at work. He has been receiving workers comp benefits this whole time. We've had great times and not so great times throughout the years. When we met, he always had female friends. One friend in particular bothered me. It was an older married woman who he had a "relationship" with prior to me. I think she was more like a "sugar mama." He said they were just friends by the time I came along. I didn't like it, but I believed him so I let it go. Right before we married, I heard a voicemail from her to him where she was crying and carrying on about how she loved him and didn't want to lose him. I immediately confronted him and demanded he end his relationship with her. He said he would.
2 years ago I found out that my husband was having an affair with a woman he met on a job interview. It started out friendly and then they crossed the line. They began an emotional affair and saw each other (according to him) 10 times over 2 years. He says they only kissed and never had sex. I was devestated and very traumatized. He was remoreseful and sorry and promised the world. I truly believed that he felt my pain and anguish and would never do this to me again.
This summer, I stumbled upon a cell phone I had never seen before. Husband left it out and I didn't tell him I had it. I took it and read it and couldn't believe my eyes. There were back and forth texts from a few women. One woman was the "sugar mama" and not romantic, then there were a few outgoing texts to the affair partner from 2 years ago. My husband was asking for things back that he gave her. Another woman was a woman I had never heard of before. Those texts were very flirtatious and inappropriate. I text that woman back and basically called her every name in the book. After calming down I apologized to her and said I just needed the truth. She said she met him 6 years ago. He said he wasn't married. They "dated" for a year and a half. I basically confirmed that everything he said to her was a big fat lie. He made himself out to be father of the year and said he was divorced and had custody of my kids and did everything for them. Their "romance" fizzled because she wanted more and he wouldn't give it to her, but they remained friends. His texts to her lead me to believe that he was trying to be more again. I don't know if she was telling the truth or not, but I definitely believe that he was the "pursuer" here.
I confronted him and he admitted, reluctantly to this affair with her. He again said there was no sex, they went out a few times and she gave him a blow job. Just as the other affair, he said that his relationship was mostly by phone and email and just talking. He said he just enjoyed talking to them and the "game". Again, he was very remoreseful and sorry. I was going through some changes at the time I found it, so I wasn't emotionally ready to deal with any of it at the time. I know it sounds nuts, but I shelfed this whole thing till I was ready to deal with it.
After the holidays, I told him we need to deal with this all. I said that I would no longer deal with infidelity, the secrets the lies and everything he's done. He begged me not to leave him and promised to do anything to make our marriage work. I told him I want a divorce. That night I slept in the guest room and cried my eyes out thinking about all we've been through, my kids, our happy times. I really think I need to leave him but at the same time, I want to keep my family together. I made no promises but agreed to go to marriage counseling. We went to one session together and then one session separately. Our next session together is this week. I know you don't know my whole history, so these qustions may be unanswerable. I just had to get these out of my head so here goes:
1. How the hell could he go and get a secret cell phone to contact these women after he saw the devestation I went through the first time I found out about an affair? Does he have no conscience? No feeling?
2. How the hell can he swear up and down that he loves me and is still "in" love with me and still have a "need" to talk and be close to other women.
3. Since he basically told these women lies and built up a "fantasy" version of himself, and barely saw these women, what was he getting out of these relationships?
4. Why the hell couldn't he let go of his "friendship" with his sugar mama when he knew how much it bothered and upset me.
5. Is he a pathological liar and can never be trusted? Is it even possible for him to tell the truth? Is it possible that he will never cheat again?
6. Will I ever be able to trust him again or am I just spinning my wheels?
I'm sorry about this lengthy post but I really feel hopeless and alone at this moment and I am just grateful to be able to get these feelings out.
I am sorry that you are here. You are married to a serial cheat and while it is not hopeless, he must do an awful lot of work to create a marriage that is safe for you.
The first step is one you take alone, however. You must take this secret out of the dark and drag it into the light where everyone can see it. Your husband has a fantasy world that will shrivel up in the light of day, with everyone watching.
Can you expose these women to their friends and families? Do you have that info?
You must also expose your h�s affairs to your families, friends and children. Ask everybody to use their influence with your h to support your marriage. This must be done WITHOUT WARNING your H and in one day � all in one fell swoop.
We have letters for exposure on Facebook etc.
Last edited by indiegirl; 01/29/1201:25 PM.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
1. How the hell could he go and get a secret cell phone to contact these women after he saw the devestation I went through the first time I found out about an affair? Does he have no conscience? No feeling?
2. How the hell can he swear up and down that he loves me and is still "in" love with me and still have a "need" to talk and be close to other women.
3. Since he basically told these women lies and built up a "fantasy" version of himself, and barely saw these women, what was he getting out of these relationships?
4. Why the hell couldn't he let go of his "friendship" with his sugar mama when he knew how much it bothered and upset me.
5. Is he a pathological liar and can never be trusted? Is it even possible for him to tell the truth? Is it possible that he will never cheat again?
6. Will I ever be able to trust him again or am I just spinning my wheels?
I'm sorry about this lengthy post but I really feel hopeless and alone at this moment and I am just grateful to be able to get these feelings out.
Let me see if I can answer these questions in one fell swoop. You never properly dealt with the first affair and it seems you have a serial cheater on your hands. The lying is par for the course for cheaters. Once they are in the affair, they are "addicted" and it is hard to break the addiction. It is difficult to recover from affairs, but it is possible. He will have to have VERY STRICT EP's in place, confess the whole shebang(s) to you, and probably submit to a polygraph test. He will have to divulge all email accounts and passwords, all chats and bank info, all phones and their passwords.
You will have to do a very difficult thing as well. You will have to expose the affair to friends family and coworkers on both sides of your family and on the affair partners. (if affairs happened in the workplace.) You will have to hold him accountable on 100% openness and honesty and deal with the roller-coaster of emotions as you work towards your own healing. I am sorry you are here. It's a great place to be to recover a marriage.
Just an FYI... Expect to learn more. I am betting dollars to donuts there was full-on sex with one or more of these affair partners and probably more people than you know about. It's possible he will never cheat again, but you will have to take VERY precise steps to ensure it.
CV
Celtic Voyager Married 22+ years 3 young adult children
Just an FYI... Expect to learn more. I am betting dollars to donuts there was full-on sex with one or more of these affair partners and probably more people than you know about. It's possible he will never cheat again, but you will have to take VERY precise steps to ensure it.
CV
Agreed. He will need to take a poly
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
We understand feeling insane and crazy having to think about and deal with something like this.
Know that you are not alone in your reaction to being lied to and cheated on and that you believed him because you can only go by what someone tells you.
Whatever you choose to do with your marriage, this website and the material that goes with it will be helpful for you.
Read all you can on the concepts (linked up at the top of the page) and talk through your journey with us and we will try to give you perspective about how to move forward for your own sanity.
Hi gracie, sorry you are here. In order to recover from his affairs, his entire lifestyle will have to be changed in order to prevent him from leading a secret second life. That means he should not have access to the computer anymore unless you are home. Another suggestion might be that he gets a job that takes him out of the house so he is not free to pursue women all day long.
Another important protective measure will be to expose his affairs. Expose to your families, children and most especially to the OW's husbands. This will help lift the fog. The more people who know, the more people to hold him accountable.
Your marriage can be recovered, but it will take a radical 180 degree change on your husband's behalf.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt
I know you don't know my whole history, so these qustions may be unanswerable. I just had to get these out of my head so here goes:
1. How the hell could he go and get a secret cell phone to contact these women after he saw the devestation I went through the first time I found out about an affair? Does he have no conscience? No feeling?
2. How the hell can he swear up and down that he loves me and is still "in" love with me and still have a "need" to talk and be close to other women.
3. Since he basically told these women lies and built up a "fantasy" version of himself, and barely saw these women, what was he getting out of these relationships?
4. Why the hell couldn't he let go of his "friendship" with his sugar mama when he knew how much it bothered and upset me.
5. Is he a pathological liar and can never be trusted? Is it even possible for him to tell the truth? Is it possible that he will never cheat again?
6. Will I ever be able to trust him again or am I just spinning my wheels?
I'm sorry about this lengthy post but I really feel hopeless and alone at this moment and I am just grateful to be able to get these feelings out.
1. Dr Harley likens an affair to an addiction. An addict 'uses' and lies about using.
2. It's known in MB land as "Wanting your cake and eating it too.". Your WH is having his ENs met by 2 women. He's happy to do this because he is only looking at short term gain, as an addict.
3. He was getting "admiration". A FAKE reflected sense of self. Plus, he really did not have to actually do anything real to earn their admiration. These women are stupid. WH is lazy.
4. WH is in full addict mode. The admiration and attention this stupid woman gives your husband causes a rise in the neuro transmitter dopamine .... which feeds the pleasure center of WH's brain. The drive for more dopamine rush is greater than his desire to protect and care for you. An addict.
5. He is probably not a pathological liar. He might be trustworthy some day. Far in the future. It is "possible" for him to tell the truth. He's an addict, addicts are lazy and they lie. Yes, it is possible he will never cheat again. There is no way to know this at this time.
6. Begin by regaining trust in your judgment. Be aware of your emotions and how they might be getting in the way of accurate assessments of any given situation.
Watch this video. Do not show anything on this site to your WH. You are NOT ALONE !!!! You are not hopeless.
[video:youtube][/video]
Infidelity: What every couple should know.
What every MB forum poster should watch.
I also recommend you click on the "carrot/stick" link in my sig line. Read from top to bottom.
IMPORTANT !!! You did nothing to "deserve" this. WH is not wayward simply because of unmet needs. Plan A is not a plan to "fix" the marriage. (That comes later) Plan A is a plan to break up the affair. Plan A is both carrot and stick.
Plan A is behaving in ways that show yourself as the best long-term option for the wayward. At the same time, providing consequences for the adultery.
Plan A is emotionally exhausting and after not very long your "TAKER" will rebel and you will want to love-bust his adulterous butt. Come to the forum and vent. Do not engage in any argumentative behaviors while in Plan A. You must remain calm and in control of yourself.
PartS oF Plan A will please WH. Other parts will make him angry and accusatory.
Steady as she goes.
FOR YOU .... A VERY BRIEF PLAN A.
Quote
The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A
The carrot of Plan A
Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.
Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.
Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.
Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.
Stop lovebusting behaviors.
Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.
Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.
Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.
Offering forgiveness and understanding.
The stick of Plan A
Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.
Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.
Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.
Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.
Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.
Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.
Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Plan A is both a *carrot* and a *stick*.
And there is more ....
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Plan A is NOT a decision you and your adulterous spouse make together !!!
Plan A is a tool for the betrayed spouse to implement in order to try and stop the affair ~and~ attract the adulterous spouse BACK to the marriage
do NOT discuss this tool with the adulterous spouse
Plan A is YOUR weapon against infidelity !!! The adulterous spouse is ~for~ infidelity, not against it .... be careful NOT to reveal your secret weapon of Plan A !!!
I think it is impossible to completely stop ALL ~LB~ behaviors during the initial SHOCK of discovering your spouse is/was unfaithful
having said that
if the affair continues
once you start Plan A ... YOU must be in control of your emotional outbursts
ASK the board for HELP to do this
and some more ....
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Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.
time to take your OWN inventory
compile a list of things you historically contribute to the marriage that make the marriage work .... and do MORE of this
don't make announcements about what you are going to do ... just take action
DEMONSTRATE what an awesome spouse/contrubutor to the marriage YOU are
.... continuing Plan A ....
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Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.
re-visit the emotional needs questionairre on this site
if your spouse is ACTIVELY continuing their affair after discovery ... try to get the information about his/her emotional needs indirectly
take the questionairre answering ~as if~ you were your adulterous spouse
then take the top 3 needs and get a plan together to fill their most important needs ~when possible~
caution is required if your spouse scores high on sexual fulfillment as their emotional need ... if your spouse is sleeping with someone else YOU need to enforce the use of condom protection ... and even that is not foolproof protection you won't be exposed to a disease
GET TESTED for STDs every so often if you are having sex with a still cheating spouse
MOST people in an affair do NOT use protection <~~~ is's a fact you must face !
and ....
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Offering forgiveness and understanding.
By this I mean .... suggesting to the confused foggy affair-addicted spouse that there is HOPE for the marriage even though what they are doing is awful ... there is a map leading to home
Often their thinking is thus: "It's too late now. I've done too much damage ... my spouse could never forgive me, so I might as well continue with the affair."
You, the sane spouse, need to squash that belief that they can never be forgiven for what they have done. You do not need to forgive them right away, but offer them the hope of a future where all is forgiven.
You can word it something like this:
All of us do things we regret. When I think of some of my past mistakes, I am extremely grateful for having been forgiven by those I've hurt. I want to be in the position to offer you that same grace. I have been forgiven, so I understand what it feels like to be in a position where you hope forgiveness is possible. It is possible.
continuing ...
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Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.
Exposure is your most effective tool to end the affair !
It is important to SNOOP ~before~ exposure.
There are ways to snoop in order to gather evidence. If you have questions about snooping tactics ... go to the general Questions infidelity forum and begin a thread titled something like: ~~~> I need to snoop. Teach me everything you know!
OK ... once you've snooped and you know there is an affair ... and your spouse refuses to end the affair relationship ... you will hear:
"It's only a friendship." "You are too controling." "I love you but I am not in love with you." "You are too suspicious." "You are crazy." "Our marriage never worked." "I've never been happy." "Our marriage was a mistake from the start."
TIME for exposure.
WAT has a great exposure thread ... read it
Exposure is NOT to the 2 infidels ... they already know they are in an affair!
You expose to the other betrayed spouse first.
You expose to your family as well as your spouse's family (if appropriate) You expose to work, or neighbors, or others .... ASK the board for help regarding who to expose to
HOW you expose is important
wording something like:
I am saddened to tell you my sweetie is having an affair. It's been going on for (length of time).He/she refuses to end the affair. I want our marriage to recover from this affair. If you have any influence on my sweetie, please do what you can to get him/her to stop this dangerous affair. I want to stay married, but the affair must end.
don't forget these words
swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.
you NEVER tell your adulterous spouse you are going to expose
you just do it
more ....
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Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.
Exposure makes the infidel furious
stay calm breathe
no one can stay furious forever ... being furious is exhausting ... consumes a lot of energy ... let the furious infidel fume and exhaust his/her self
YOU stay cool
You will hear:
"That's it. We are never going to stay married after what YOU did." "I am moving out now, thanks to you." "You are getting OP in trouble at home." "Now our kids will have a broken home thanks to you."
blah blah blah
You respond to all the raging comments: I am still holding out hope for our marriage.
You stay calm
You don't argue
You don't explain
You do not preach
You do not educate
~and~ you do NOT apologize for standing up for truth and marriage and keeping your family intact
YOU calmly re-state your belief that there is hope for the marriage ....
if things get out of hand ... excuse yourself and go for a walk or a drive ...
remember ... exposure makes the already foggy spouse act insane ... but it is temporary
.....
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Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.
Plan A is often misunderstood as "acting nice"
excuse me acting "nice' in the face of an affair makes me want to puke
Plan A is taking control of one's self ...it is NOT "acting nice" ~as if~ there was no infidelity eating away at your family .... infidelity hurts like battery acid poured on your skin
am I right?
heII yes I am right
so you scared and panicky betrayed ~~~> SPEAK UP
tell the truth
"This affair hurts me. This affair is going to destroy our family. Let's get help."
If your spouse does something really thoughtless ... SPEAK UP.
"What you just said (did) hurts me terribly."
"I feel wounded by your affair."
"My heart aches for the love we used to share."
But be careful ... don't get needy or whiney or weepy ... those are love-busters
it's a fine line between telling the truth about what hurts ... and staying away from LB behaviors
ASK for help from the board
if you are unsure if what you are doing is correct... examine how much self control you have at any given moment ... and if you are feeling in control of yourself ... you are probably right on the money !
if you feel yourself losing control ... step away and re-group
>>>>>>
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Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.
You never were a perfect spouse. You never will be.
You are part of the equation of your marriage environment .. but you have no power to cause your spouse to choose an affair
The freshly wounded often look at themselves and blame themselves for their spouse's choice to go outside the marriage....
stop
Sure, this is an opportunity to take your own inventory ... but NEVER accept blame for your spouse's choice to have an affair
The issue of not meeting the emotional needs of the adulterous spouse ~before~ the affair began is NOT a reason to choose infdelity
not ever
You are responsible for your choices, not for the choices of your spouse
relax breathe
~~~~~~
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Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.
If we experience no consequences when we mess up ... there is very little motivation for us to change our wrong behaviors that have become a habit
do the infidel a favor
do not stand inbetween them and their consequences
show respect for the infidel by allowing them to feel whatever their behaviors have earned them
be it shame embarrasment fear
whatever they have earned
let it be
unpleasant consequences are what motivates changing habitual bad behaviors
let it roll
******
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A very very important part of Plan A !!!
That is some serious self-pampering .... which may include but is not limited to:
>manicures/pedicures
>dates with friends
>hire a sitter so YOU can have fun
>relaxing your usually busy schedule
>say "No, I can't do that now." when you are running out of energy
>pray and ask for spiritual and emotional support from someone wise in your circle of trust
>buy all new sheets
>paint the bedroom
>treat yourself to something sexy to wear
>try a new hairstyle
>get contact lenses or Kewl new glasses
>glam up
>buy concert/theater tickets
>exercise
Self pampering will keep your Taker happy for awhile which IMPROVES your Plan A
~~~~~~~
and finally, This is an old post of mine ... written in 2002... I was trying to put the "doormat of Plan A" issue to rest .... in my own mind. Now you can look at what I came up with, back then.
Quote
Looking back ... I can see I worked myself through a very awkward "plan A" .... although I never heard of plan A until years into recovery and I started poking around this site.
Looking back ... I can see my efforts to become differentiated ... although I did not read Schnarch's Passionate Marriage until years into recovery.
Plan A is very much complementary to Schnarch's ideas of differentiation.
Developing a positive identity within the context of a marriage struggling to overcome infidelity.
Developing a strong sense of self-worth that is valid both within and outside the boundaries of the marriage.
I can NOW see plan A as a path to greater self worth and NOT necessarily as a plan to "win back" the heart and mind of the infidel ... although that might happen.
It is a plan to differentiate myself and identify myself as a worthy person apart from the circumstances of the marriage relationship.
Plan A'ers are not like doormats to wipe your feet upon and to mis-use .... more like a *welcome home* sign... if both persons choose to re-inter the marriage!
Plan A says : "I can hold onto my better self under the worst of circumstances".
Schnarch says: "We develop a contingent identity based on a 'self-in-relationship'. Because our identity depends on the relationship, we may demand that our partner doesn't change so that our identity won't either."
Then ... comes the grenade of infidelity tossed into the marriage and the entire fusion of identities is blown apart!
The aftermath of the grenade then boils down to this question ....
WHO THE HECK AM I ... AND ... WHO THE HECK ARE YOU?
And, asking this question to the *fogged-in* infidel is pointless. They got INTO the affair because they were lost to themselves, and went searching for a new self .... and, INSTEAD of differentiating themselves ... they fused identity to yet another relationship ... actually moving away from a healthy differentiated view of their self-worth ----> I am wonderful because my affair partner thinks so.
Plan A says and demonstrates to OURSELVES: I am not some weak pathetic person deserving to be abandoned or cheated. I am demonstrating decent and loving behaviour. I am worthy of love and devotion. ... If the infidel notices .... double bonus points. If not, I become better differentiated along the way ... and I can see my strengths despite terrible and hurtful circumstances.
Once I become more fully differentiated and have stable and accurate self-worth (after the grenade) ... I am then in the position to identify healthy choices.
I can honestly say that I will be a sensational woman within this marriage... or after this marriage terminates.
I think I finally understand what I went through. I understand that I am the better woman for it. I understand my spouse is the better man for it.
That is a powerful message to myself.
The anxiety that floods the betrayed spouse is the perceived loss of identity .
Self worth and a differentiated identity is the harvest of plan A .
Yes. Your h gets a dopamine rush in the brain every time he plays his 'game' with other women.
He is addicted to the dopamine - it is a substance more addictive than cocaine.
i bet you have noticed him saying and doing crazy doped up stuff, like his ability to think is impaired?
This is from the NEVER take the word of a wayward thread (which I suggest you also read)
Originally Posted by Caracal
Originally Posted by indiegirl
That goes out of the window when they become addicts however.
Found this on another site, something I have found helpful in understanding WH's behaviour is not about me, it is ALL about him... Helps with seeing the wayward's behaviour for what it is.
Replace addicts with waywards, after all, they are one and the same. 1. Addicts lie 2. Addicts make excuses for their bad behaviour 3. Addicts are NOT in control of themselves 4. Addicts want one thing - more more, and again more 5. Addicts are master manipulators - of spouses, children, even their parents 5. Addicts don't care about long term 6. Addicts don't care about logic 7. Addicts are not reliable 8. Addicts lie 9. Addicts talk ONLY for three things : a. to pursue their addiction b. to pursue their addiction c. to pursue their addiction 10. Addicts lie 11. Addicts create walls to isolate themselves from anyone that may interfere with pusuit of their addiction a. Emotional walls - I'm done, I'm divorcing you, I don't love you b. Walls of Lies, stories, excuses c. Walls of wood and brick - they shut doors, stay away from home, dissappear for hours on end 12. Addicts lie 13 Addicts use people 14. Addicts don't care if they hurt people 15. Addicts are ill 16. Addicts aren't loyal or dependable 17. Did I mention that addicts lie? 18. Addicts recover
I question number 18 though... in my experience addicts do not always recover, or can take a very long time to do so... I would add "can" to this... Addicts CAN recover.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
You have gotten a lot of great advice from some wonderful posters. I just wanted to emphasize this since there is so much information for you to go through:
Originally Posted by Pepperband
GET TESTED for STDs every so often if you are having sex with a still cheating spouse
MOST people in an affair do NOT use protection <~~~ is's a fact you must face !
So sorry to say that I do not believe for one second that your WH hasn't had sex with any of these women. Please understand that waywards lie, lie and then lie some more [in fact, brace yourself for more information to come out before the poly]
Make him get STD testing and please get yourself tested as well and be careful until you know the results.
If you want to try and remain married to your WH, you must raise the bar high, and keep it there. As soon as WH gets the feeling you will accept "less" .... that's exactly what he will give to you.
So sorry to say that I do not believe for one second that your WH hasn't had sex with any of these women. Please understand that waywards lie, lie and then lie some more [in fact, brace yourself for more information to come out before the poly]
Make him get STD testing and please get yourself tested as well and be careful until you know the results.
This. Gracie, get tested right away. I'm sorry, but it is unrealistic to believe that your husband didn't have sex with any of these women. It just doesn't work that way.
I'm so sorry you have to be here, but please listen to what is posted to you. We can help you.
D-Day 2-10-2009 Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever! Thank you Marriage Builders!
Thank you for your thoughtful responses. I think you hit the nail on the head about the "addict" responses. He has a VERY addictive personality and has been a recovering alcoholic for the last 6 years. Since he stopped drinking, he has replaced this addiction with other addictions of some sort. I guess he thinks "Hey, at least I'm not drinking!" I think since he's been home, he hasn't felt good about himself and that has hurt his self-esteem.
Our marriage was not perfect, but not awful either. I work and have 3 kids therefore I don't have a whole lot of time to tell him or make him feel like the sun rises and sets on his behind.
The biggest question, I guess, is why? Why would he do this to me? Why would he do this to our kids? Was our whole marriage a lie? Why did he marry me? His answers are "I don't know why. Maybe I can figure it out in counseling." He also swears he loves me and is in love with me, but I just can't believe him.
I'm not sure yet what I am going to do yet. I guess I want to see how the counseling goes, but an hour goes SO fast!! He said we have lots of work ahead of us, but I wonder what the work will be.
I don't think that I am ready to out him just yet. Probably because of my own fear of more humiliation and embarrassment. He did call the sugar mama in front of me and told me her that he is trying to work on his marriage and will no longer call her and she should never call him. He made a similar call the whore from 6 years ago. The affair I found out about a couple of years ago fizzled really quickly after I sent a scathing letter to her employer outing her for being an immoral whore. The bonus of that was her husbands relatives also worked there and they all found out. Even though my [censored] husband tried to contact her after (my discovery from the secret cell), I never saw a response from her.
Last night we were talking and he said one thing that just set me off! I got angry so fast. I find myself very angry a lot lately. When I met with the therapist alone, he says it sounds like I have a real issue with suppressed rage. I think he is right.
Today we had a text war while I was at work. He said I need to get a grip because I'm going off the deep end. He said that we need to put the past in the past and work on the future. Easier said than done.
I will go and read as much as I can from what you've all posted. I am tired of being an angry [censored] all the time, and I am probably pushing him farther and farther away. This sucks!!
I would be very interested in having him take a polygraph. Coincidently, I told him that last night and he said he would. How do i go about finding a place to do this? Is it very expensive?
Today we had a text war while I was at work. He said I need to get a grip because I'm going off the deep end. He said that we need to put the past in the past and work on the future. Easier said than done.
I will go and read as much as I can from what you've all posted. I am tired of being an angry [censored] all the time, and I am probably pushing him farther and farther away. This sucks!!
Um- it isn't easier said than done. It isn't to be done at all, and doing it would be wrong. He is asking for you to put a bandaid over a bullet wound, while he is possibly sitting there reloading the gun.
You tell him no thank you. There will be no only focusing on the future, at this point.
Thanks for all the support along the way. I wish you all well. I'm outta here. Peace.
I am tired of being an angry [censored] all the time, and I am probably pushing him farther and farther away. This sucks!!
I know why your "angry girl" has come out to play. Your "Giver" is feeling used and is on overload. When this happens, your "Taker" tries to protect you.
This does not mean you have anything wrong with you. It means you are not able to continue with the "Giver" much longer. Do you understand? Have you knowledge of the "Giver-Taker" MB model?
Giver/Taker ... or as Harley says: "We all have split personalities"
The Giver's Rule ... do whatever you can to make others happy and avoid anything that makes others unhappy even it it makes you unhappy.
Everyone has a giver. EVERYONE. Freeloaders, Renters, Buyers .... criminals ... Grandma .... your MIL .... your cheating spouse.... your faithful spouse. Our Giver wants us to make a positive difference in the lives of others and it grows out of our instinct to provide care. "give until it hurts"
The Taker's Rule ... do whatever you can to make yourself happy and avoid anything that makes you unhappy, even if it makes others unhappy.
Everyone has a Taker. EVERYONE. Freeloaders, Renters, Buyers ... criminals ... Grandma ... your MIL ... your cheating spouse ... your faithful spouse ... Our Taker wants us to get the most out of life, and it grows out of our basic instinct for self-preservation. "get what you need in life"
Harley says:
"It is tempting to consider the Giver as our caring nature and the Taker as our thoughtless nature.
But that's NOT what they are.
Actually, they are BOTH caring.
Your Giver cares for others
and
Your Taker cares for you"
!!!!!!!!!!!! KEWL
Wait .... there's MORE !!!!!!! Harley goes on to say:
[i]" Both Giver and Taker also have their thoughtless sides.
Your Giver does NOT CARE how YOU feel.
and
Your Taker does NOT CARE how others feel. "
!!!!!! REALLY KEWL ... and there's more !!!!
Harley says:
" In fact your Giver is willing to see YOU suffer even to the point of deep depression as long as you continue to care about others.
Your Taker is willing to see others suffer if it means you are happy or are prevented from suffering. "
So, we ALL have a Giver and a Taker
and they are both good ... because
they both care (Giver cares for others, Taker cares for you)
AND
they are both bad ... because
they are both thoughtless (Giver cares nothing about your feelings, Taker cares nothing about the feelings for others)
~~ Here's the important point Harley makes~~
"Because each of them ignores someone's feelings, they are both shortsighted. They fail to understand that you and others should be cared for and protected simultaneously, so that no one suffers"
This quote is from a discussion about Dr Harley's book Buyers Renters Freeloaders. Take a look at the discussion, when you have the time.
