Doro, try this: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2558780&page=1

Dora, the only WS that is not worth it are those who won't take accountability and who won't CHANGE. Those who do the hard work and give their betrayed spouses just compensation are very much worth it. When we see that, we encourage the BS to stick it out unless he really wants to leave. [which is his right]

And I want to applaud you for telling your husband the truth. I know that was tough. THAT does impress folks here.

p.s. it is a blessing from God that you hooked up with Steve Harley. You have no idea how blessed you are to get him. He is about the ONLY counselor who will try to influence your husband to give you another chance. And Steve is VERY persuasive. If Steve is convinced you are sincere [and you sound pretty sincere to us] he will try very hard to convince your husband to give this a try.

BH came home tonight with his bag, and I tried to not let myself get excited/too hopeful, but he was only home to shower/eat, so he wouldn't bother his friends too much. He just left again. Seems like hurts more everytime.

He did seem a 'little' more angry. Which I prefer to no feeling at all. I was in the process of writing him an email when he came home (including a list of EP's that I told him I would be doing regardless if he was interested in reconcillation or not), So I sent him the email, so he could read it while he was here.

I asked if he had any questions, and pretty much all he said was, "you f-ed me up big time", and that I should do all those things for myself, but it wasn't going to mean anything to him/change his mind. I said that was fine.

Asked him if he thought he might be willing to talk with Harley on phone, and he said, 'no, there was no point'.

And then he left... I guess I'm just going to keep praying.

Thanks. I'm so very afraid. I've ruined him forever, it seems. It's hard to have hope. Have appt with Harley tomorrow. Maybe BH will change his mind someday and agree to talk.

Let us know how the appointment goes with Steve. I've read that he's BRILLIANT. I'm certain that he'll let you know how to encourage your BH to get on the phone with him too.

See, we're not all that bad, once you start clearing out the fog and getting to work that is.

DoroM,

Thanks. I'm so very afraid. I've ruined him forever, it seems. It's hard to have hope. Have appt with Harley tomorrow. Maybe BH will change his mind someday and agree to talk.

Even though your confession might not save your marriage, it is the only thing that can, at least now you won't have to keep a horrible secret for years on end.

I do agree that the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference so your H being slightly angry is a good sign.

You may want to do some research on OM to track him down, one of your BH conditions for getting back together may be contacting OMW, with the info. you have OM CAN be found.

God Bless
Gamma

So here is the list of EP's I made. I just read somewhere I was supposed to show you guys the list before I gave it to him. Oops. And then I read they were supposed to be written. Although if it were written, he wouldn't be able to read them, my handwriting is so bad.

Along with this, I told him that it was a list I was committed to doing/following not just on the condition of him agreeing to try things out, but regardless of what he decides. (explanations for you guys in parenthesis- not that you need them, you're not dumb)

1)I will never contact the OM. For any reason.
2)If he ever contacts me, I will tell you about it immediately.
3)I will not drink alcohol. Ever.(I don't drink all that often, but when I do- I drink a lot, and I make some very poor decisions.
4)I will not go to a bar situation with my g-friends if you are not with me. (restaurants are okay w/g-friends)
5)I will not be alone with another man, if it is in my power to leave the situation. (in some work situations, if I were to leave the room just b/c everyone else left the room besides one male, I would get sued for negligence- it's a very rare occasion, but I wanted to explain to him)
6)I will not have any male �friends� that I share things with.
7)I will not erase txt messages/phone history. (my phone has never had password on it.
8)I will deactivate my FB/Twitter accounts. (already did it- I've spent a lot of time on both, which could be spent better elsewhere, also- OM is on FB,)
9)I will find a job in ______, or any place you would want to live with me, even if it�s not great for my career or my career experience. (have been working out of state-b/c I couldn't find job where we live. Only working 8 days/month, but pray I can find any job where we live now)
10)I will start attending church regularly, whether I am in ___ or ___.
11)I will join a small group
13)POJA- I will never make a decision w/o your enthusiastic agreement
14)Unless ordered somewhere, we will decide my military deployments together- (w/ my speciality, this should be an easy reality. Should be able to go somewhere in the states for a few months, where he can visit. There is even one place that is not too far from where we live- but don't know about opportunities for that place)
15) I will get out of military as soon as my time is up (9/2014 as of right now, I think).


I left out the banking stuff b/c he has all of the passwords for that, so there is no way for money to be hidden.

Are there any I should add? I sincerely think that these cover all of my big issues. Someday I'll go into how we sort of semi-tried this after the first time, (and you see how well that worked).

Will definitely let you know how it goes. I went to the IC today (b/c was too late to cancel), and I was sitting there thinking, OMG- no WONDER we didn't fix anything last time! I feel like I've learned so much just in the past few days from you guys and reading on this site, that it makes the IC seem laughable. Needless to say, I've cancelled my other appointments with her, and I'm hoping to make some progress with Harley.
haha...sometimes I get my feelings hurt easily- yes, even on the internet. But I'm also like a gawker staring at a car-crash, so I came back for more. The good advice/helpful encouragement FAR outweighed my hurt feelings....

I know I could find her info on Facebook at least. Are you meaning more info than that?

Steve will tell you what to say to get him on the phone. Don't worry...

DoroM,

My H and I attended an MB seminar (what is now the online program) two years ago last weekend. I don't know what the coach said to my husband, but it changed everything for us. I believe that without MB, we certainly would have divorced. We did not counsel with Steve, but as the others have said, he has an amazing reputation.

I don't know what will eventually happen with your marriage. From reading your list of EPs, I do believe that from here on out you will be a better person, a better woman and a better wife.



AM

You asked me what I�d advise your H to do at this point. My advice is usually focused on men dealing with possible custody fights, but I also weigh in when men get cheated on and have no kids.

Yes. My advice in that case is to bail and count your blessings.

However, that�s usually because he has an unrepentant WW and more often than not is dealing with a situation where he married his WW when very young and is simply afraid to be �out there.�

In your case, however, YOU are the one seeking guidance on how to save things and you are willing to acknowledge your mistakes, rebuild, and focus your efforts on your M in addition to erecting boundaries to prevent this in the future.

So I would advise him to be skeptical, continue snooping, and let you prove yourself through your actions.

Keep in mind that the worst time for him will be about 6 months from now, when he�s over the shock and is truly questioning why he should settle for you. And don�t fool yourself. If you don�t change, he�s settling and deserves infinitely better.

I'm wondering why the husband's porn affair is not being discussed? Has this been addressed in the marriage? Is it over? Looks to me like a case of dual infidelity.

Huh? "porn affair?" "Dual infidelity?"

husband's porn affair...Looks to me like a case of dual infidelity.

Might be. But HE'S not here. And DoroM has asked for and needs our help with a specific issue - whether and how she can retain him in their marriage after her second adulterous liaison. That's keeping us (and her) busy enough for the present.

With that in mind, it might be helpful, unless you have contact with DoroM's BH, and can get him to join us on his own MB thread, to stop raising extraneous, distracting issues, okay?

Porn is horrible.

However, Palmela Handerson is not going to get pregnant and introduce an OC to the marriage. Rosie Palm isn't going to give the gift of venereal disease. And, you quite simply cannot go NC for life with you right hand.

Porn has no place inside a marriage, but it is not the same thing as an affair. Sorry. No dice.

I found about the porn issue after the first time. He had told me that in his mind, he was 'protecting us', b/c he was taking care of his 'needs' when he was away at work for days at a time, so he wouldn't be tempted with anyone else.

So then when he would come home to me, he wasn't interested and would turn me down repeatedly. He said he would stop, and I'm almost positive he did (he told me about one time when he had started to watch and then stopped). I also saw the change in him wanting to have sex with me after he stopped.

So I really don't think that's an issue here.

He did tell me he had read this thread last night (i had emailed him the MB link). Don't know how much else(if any) he read, and I doubt he'll start his own thread.

Good radical honesty, doro. I am sure you are not proud of your first post on her but you showed him it any way

You also showed him that you are taking criticism on the chin and working on yourself to create a better m, which is good Plan Aing.....

Like it.

Oh, it's an issue, as evidenced by the fact that you don't like it. He needs to stop watching porn. His excuse is a common one, but porn use is still destructive within a marriage so it doesn't fly. If he wanted to "safeguard" your marriage, ya'll coulda had some *wink wink* fun on skype or something.