Oh Doro, how far you have come. Your journey has only begun, but I see good things in your future, wherever it leads you.

Good for you, Doro!

Ace,
So what's the outcome of the conversation with your wife?

I am a WW and want to say a few things to you.

You are very foggy right now. You are trying to reason with yourself and fix yourself. Yet, you are not able to abstain. It's like a drunk who tries to convince himself to go sober WHILE he's drunk.

Anyway, the only way you're ever going to be able to stop your affair is by writing OW a no contact letter and not ever seeing her again.

I understand the work thing but liken it to a crack addict saying that he'll put his crack pipe in the attic and not ever touch it again. NO ONE IS THAT STRONG!

You proved that you cannot stop the affair by going back to OW when you led your wife to believe you were recovering nicely.

I get it. I do......if I ever saw my POSOM again, I would not be able to control the rush of the feelings that would come back (doesn't matter that he's a total loser).

My POSOM is divorced as well. I wanted my cake and was eating it, too. That's what you want. That's what you're doing. You get some of your needs met by OW and the others met by your wife. That's what I was doing.

This is not fair nor is it moral to do to your wife.

You have to either write a NC letter to OW and never see her again or you have to let your wife go, so that she can find someone who will fully commit to her.

Write the letter and have your wife read it and send it. Then focus completely on your wife.
CT

Ace,

Just read through your thread and I hope with all my heart this time you do what is right for you and your wife......

What you are doing is very hurtful and selfish....

I really hope you mean you will do anything and everything it takes to make your wife feel safe and I hope that you can be trusted this time to keep the words you are speaking here about your plan and what needs to be done.

You can see that remaining in contact with the OW is not working and will never work for your marriage, you are not making decisions that have your wife's best interests at heart......

You are disrespecting everything about her and your marriage and family. It has to stop, either you stop having an contact with your OW or you let your wife go......this isn't just about you and what you want and need.

Your wife deserves to be safe and respected.

You tell her the truth and then come back here and put together a day to day plan to recover what you have destroyed, it is going to take a lot of commitment and patience.......

I truly hope you have turned the corner and that you can love someone more than you do yourself.......

We would all like to help you and your wife. But it starts with your honesty and your integrity.........

Your lost but that doesn't mean you have to stay that way........
You deserve more

Unbelievable read.

One of the main points made repeatedly to BS's on this forum is that you can't reason with a wayward. ***EDIT***

A little learning is a dangerous thing;
drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring...Alexander Pope

OWH, your use of the "can't reason with a wayward" mantra is flawed in its application here.

Its use should be, and was intended to be, directed at BSs, who when stepping into the realm of the wayward mind, immediately find themselves engulfed in tendrils of doubt, guilt and confusion. The discussion then becomes a "negotiation" where the clear direction gets lost. But BSs ARE encouraged to focus on certain concepts when forced into discussions with their wayward partners. "I am not willing to stay in an infidelity-accommodating marriage." "I will do everything possible to recover our marriage, if you are as well." These are not to be construed as "reasoning"; they are statements of principle and intent.

We here are not negotiating with this poster. Our instructions have been consistent and aligned - NC with the OW, and honesty with the BW. Fortunately (for him, if he eventually fully benefits from the advice), we have a battery of folks here with different styles and tactics of transmitting those basic needs.

There are very few WHs (many more WWs) who actually accept the guidance and the associated pain, and come out the other side. At any rate, all of those cases required some instruction, or orientation, (not "reasoning") at the start of the process before the WS understands the stakes involved in his/her own life.

A reminder to keep posts respectful and within the terms of service of this board.

***EDIT***

Please do not challenge a moderator decision on the open forum. If you have a problem with a decision, please write to the moderator concerned.

ariel.marriagebuillder@gmail.com

or

JustUss2@aol.com.

Thank you.

Update.

AS I planned I talkedto my wife on Saturday a few hours after she arrivedhome from work.

I opened the can and laid it out.
Of course the reaction is what I expected. She had thought it was just me going through some bumps in my own mind...not that it all was still actually going on.
I explained to her that I knew that was the reason that we never could succeed at our marriage recovery in the past was by my own fault.
I explained what I found out on this site, and teh advice that was given to me and what I read in the articles on this site.
I told her that she should come here with me, as I figured she said, "No" that she would rather not interfear with my apparent progress since I was actually telling her the truth.
I proceeded to try to tell her Who and wher, again, (Call BS if you want) but only her and I were there. She did not want to know.
She only wanted to know when and how the affairs tood place.
I explained that to her, and I did manage to tell her that my may casuae issues down the road and I may end up changing.

My wife and I talked for a good three hours Saturday night and she and I agreed to work through things based on the information that I presented from the steps on this site. Alot was said, and we both know that in the past we acted like things were just hunky dory right away and never addressed the issues again.
This time we are addressing them and knowing that it will be a difficult process and that we are just in the beginning part.
After that inital talk I felt much better, but knew it would not be an easy road.
I explained to my wife that she would have to be understanding of my withdrawl and seperation anxiety. And that yes I would have to communicate with the other woman one more time.
I told my wife that I would write out what I would say to her and she could read it before I sent it.
My wife told me that she did not want to because the thought of anything relating to the other woman sickened her.
She said all she wanted was to know when I talked to ther OW.
I told my wife that even though I had done all this...that I still was a respectable Man and I would not send a letter but rather talk to the OW. She agreed that it should be done that way.
Sunday was a little tense, but we spent a good Family day out and about after Church.
This morning my wife and I talked aboout some things that were bothering us, and I knew that today I would talk to the OW.
Which I did, and I told my wife when I started, and when it was over.
I did not know how the OW would take it because of the depth of the relationship between us. Was not a typical sexual afair, but actual feelings had develooped.
To my surprise she said that she too was ready to move on.
Even though it hurt to lose me, that it is for the best.
She thanked me for being man enough to actually talk to her rather than txt or something like that. She also said that I would have no worries here at work, that she would just disappear and we would never be in contact again. She would just let me be. We shook hands said good luck and parted ways. My situation at work will be OK. I know that because actually the OW was the one who suggested that I seek Help for myself, which lead me to you guys.
All the communications with the OW have ceased. Feels good to be able to work again without looking at the phone every 2 minutes.

But I do still have my eyes and emotions open.... and if I should feel a hint of dicfficulty, I will walk out on this job.

After talking to the OW, I told my wife about talking to the OW, she too felt a relief.

I did not expect my wife to go along with the part of the process where I had to take that step towards closure with the OW. But she did, and also to understand that I will have withdrawl. In return, she asked that I be understanding of the recovery process that she will have to go through after all of this. And that I should not close her out. That when I need to talk, I should come to her about anything.

So I followed everything that was presented to me to the best that I could. And Yes so far things are going good.
After the conversations here on Saturday, yes I felt trashed by you guys. But realized that basically that's what I needed to force me to take that step, no matter what the outcome.

I actually feel Like I can breath now, for the first time in years.
I know my wife and I will stay the course, and it will take time.
And still alot of hurt to come and withdrawl.
But I am confident that we will make it. I feel a level of committment that I have not felt before from myself.
Thanks
I will post here when I can our progress.

Do not rest on your laurels, Ace. Strike now.

- Order His Need/Her Needs from this site. Not only will you want to learn what is in it, but your wife will as well.
- Download the Emotional Needs Questionnaires.
- On your own, prepare a timeline of your affair. I hear you (and momentarily accept) that your wife does not want the details NOW. But it's likely if she starts the MB Program, she's going to realize that she deserves to know what and how the damage was done. Your doing it now will preclude a whole lotta "I can't remember" when that time comes.

Glad you came back. You will someday look back on 25 February 2012 as the best day of your life.

Plan a road trip with your wife soon and get the book His Needs/Her Needs on a CD/audio version and listen to it. You'll NEVER truly recover your marriage (you may stay married but the resentment with never be overcome) unless you implement a recovery plan. You already know she won't read or post here so you're going to have to lead this recovery if you want a truly exceptional successful marriage of extraordinary care.

Your wife is not being proactive because she's scared. Her willingness to trust you is a huge mistake. You may have good intentions RIGHT THIS MINUTE...but you aren't trustworthy right now and you know it. You are attempting to white knuckle something that is bigger than you can or should handle by yourself. If you really want to succeed you need to quit that job. Until you can get out of there you need accountability partners. Maybe someone other than you wife needs to know and keep an eye on you 24/7. There ARE apps available for you to have an open mic/video going on your phone that anyone could log in and watch 24/7 if they are given access. Even if they don't watch...the knowledge someone could be listening in may assist you being diligent with your commitments.

and...

"NO"...OW is not a qualified accountability partner

closure contact in person...gimme a break...as if your whore is deserving of some kind of dignified send off. You talking your wife into allowing that is a disgusting thing to do (and to post about). It makes you sound like a huge jackhole and I hope you come back to read that post someday embarrassed by how you obviously have more concern about OW's feelings than your wife's.

Mr. Wondering


p.s. - Every wayward thinks their affair was special. It wasn't. Get over it. You're a common adulterer right now. In the future you may become a repentant former adulterer. I'm married to one of those and I've got several friends in that group as well. I pray you make it into that group one day.

Ditto Mr. Wondering!

I had to laugh because you think your affair was special. ALL waywards think that (myself included).

You need to read Harley's SAA.

Thanks for all the comments.
I will take them into account.
As I said your advice is good.
However you were not in the room with my wife when the discussion was had. Nor will you be as we continue this process.
We have already discussed a plan, and will continue to formulate it and grow it as we move through this process.

I will do what I must when I must.
Right now I have a good start and feel confident in the first few bits of progress.
Nice to feel good about something....

But a little shocked to still see negative remards towards my positive progress.
And yes every one deserves respect, no matter who they are.
I am actually appalled that certain words are used to describe people. Christians do not treat others in that way, no matter how badly the situation may be.
And no, I am not being less considerate of my wife.
So say what you want, until you are in my exact shoes, and in side my own body and situation then you will not understand just eactly ther person that lies beneath the surface.
Yes a huge mistake was made by me... I am of full awareness of that...and do not need reminding of that.
All that those types of reminders do is pull me back from progress. I do not feel that I need a baby sitter.
And dispite my mistakes I know in my heart that I can make this go and work. And my marriage will be stronger.
As I said on Saturday, you (MrWondering) have fueled a fire inside me and made me agressive towards reaching my end result of recovering my marriage despite what you are saying and not agreeing with my doing or not doin.
I am and will prove you wrong, and I will succeed.

Exactly!

nESRE

Do the rest of you understand that this man still WORKS WITH his OW and does mot intend to leave?

So sending the OW a no contact letter is worthless as long as he will see her at work.

ace, I applaud you for telling your wife the truth. That is a good first step.

That being said, if you are serious about recovery, you cannot work with the OW or ever see or speak to her again. A no contact letter should be written together and sent by your wife. [we have a template] However, there is no reason to send a no contact letter when you are going to see the OW at work.

That is a hopeless situation because every contact will put your withdrawal back to day 1 of recovery. It is like an alcoholic going into the bar every day and having a drink. He can never sober up.

whoops! I see MrW did notice he still works with the OW! mea culpa......

A "mistake" is when you accidently drop your Iphone into the mailbox instead of the letter.
Letting a relationship develop between you and another person and not telling your wife. Kissing her and not telling your wife. Seeing her and not telling your wife. Making arrangements to have sex and not telling your wife. Lying to your wife about your whereabouts. Lying to your wife about working overtime. Actually undressing and having sex...

Those things are not a "mistake". Only once you realize not only how sad it is that you have allowed yourself to lower your values and betray your wife, but also once you have accepted that this was not a "mistake" but a carefully planned string of events... Only if you are honest to yourself about these things, you will see how ridiculous and haughty it is to tell all these people who have gone through the same thing, that you know better.

The drug addict is telling everyone that he can steer away from drugs. Well maybe he can. But all of us would feel a lot better if he was not living in the appartment building with his pusher. And having the same circle of friends and so on. This is just unwise.

Only a fool does the same thing over and over again and expects different results.

Dont be that fool. You are articulate. Now start making sane decisions.

Good luck,

Happyheart

Ace, I say this as someone who really wants you to succeed. There will be no progress until you truly cut off all contact with your OW. You do yourself and your wife a grave disservice by continuing to work with the OW. I understand that you can't just up and quit, but you certainly need to look for a new job.

Recovery is impossible while continuing to work with her. Your wife will live a life of hell every day you go to work there. You shouldn't put her through that.

Melody
I understand all of that....
Actually I have formulated a plan for the working with.
And Also believe that I will grow stronger, and not weaker or be set back.
See, actually I rarely ever see the OW, and have ways of making sure that it is even less, unless absolutely dictated by what the job requires.
I know I will not be contacted by her via email or Txt which was the common means for communication, In her words today, contacting me would yield no results so why waste the time.
I believe her and I know there will be no more comminication.
ACtually we rarely even talk at work in person, or on our work phones.


To also assist me in being able to continue as my work path, I have placed photos of my wife everywhere around my desk, and in my jeep. Since my wife knows I used txt and email to communiate with this OW, she has agreed to step in and fill the void of me no longer txting or emailing the OW.
And today it has been great.
Actually feels better to txt my wife and not the OW because I know that after work my wife will be there with me at home and I can spend the evening with her without thinking it's wrong.

So as I said, so far my recovery plan is working, I realize it is only the first day, and I have a long road to go yet, but just feels good to feel positive. and not feel a headache coming on.