What's that saying? If you have to ask...

The woman's probably been an adulterous train wreck for a long long time.

Yep, just what is this saying? bigsky, you need to do some more digging into her past. I wouldn't even concern myself at this point with any recovery efforts. Just find her XH and see if you can find out what really happened. Rest assured, it's probably radically different from what you been told. I admire your desire to want to fix things (I'm a fixer by nature as well), but just exactly what do you think you will be fixing? Some things are worth the effort, others not.

I couldn't agree more. I really couldn't. At this point you need to protect yourself and your kids. You can't "fix" someone who isn't willing to fix themselves. She seems to be quite comfortable being a woman completely devoid of character, honesty and integrity.

You deserve better. And your kids certainly do.

Thank You all... and yes I do understand the need to heal now for sure. I was good when we met yes I was still married but I had been separated from my last wife for over a yr and was very comfortable in my skin,At that point I had been to a counselor to work out me and my mistakes in the first marriage, when we started dating so I know not to jump fast all that was left in the 1st marriage was a custody battle at that point, which I wouldn't give up custody to my ex and had to fight all the way to court.

Yes she has been like this for quite sometime I have been doing the research and yes I have talked to her EX he told me many things true and different. He admitted to abuse (verbal)but denied the (physical). He said she has been this way all her life very pretty and materialistic and would do what ever it took to get what she wanted. I tend to believe him for the only reason most of this was unsolicited in I wouldn't ask a question and he would answer.....He just told me there problems from his point if view and did not know what she had ever said about him. I could tell he had heard it before from others though. Take it for what it is though.

Yes you are correct there is no fixing this. Except for total separation for life unless she was to do certain things and even then I would be suspicious of the motives, but she has already introduced the new guy to her small group of friends and her daughter (another train wreck) and she is spinning lies even to my closest friends who have known me for yrs and know that what she is saying has a small ounce of truth but is spun to shed light on herself well and not me.And some things are just out right lies and deception.

I listened to a recording of her running me down last night that a acquaintance of mine who she doesn't know was able to get on his phone mind you she said this to a perfect stranger to her all she is doing is trying to make herself feel better about the things she has done.I can handle that I understand it.Its just sad for her she is this way.I have to be careful and just always state the truth no matter what and some of it is not so great I did neglect her as far as time, but I see now even that would have just brought this to a earlier finish, I would have been more aware of certain things at that point.

She is not the woman I met, she is the woman that she has always been I was just blinded by many things that I will not overlook in the future.

I have always admitted to not being perfect and that I could always improve but no one deserves what myself and it appears many others have been through with her. The only difference with her and I is that I am a guy that will stick even her EH thought we would make it because I am a very strong minded person with patients for many things, I understand mistakes and am willing to forgive. But I will not put my children in a environment that they will learn bad habits and traits for anyone I would eliminate them from my life if I thought I would do them harm.

And yes I could stop her from working where she does quite easily, but her motive, at that point would be for other reason than love to work this out. I will not buy her love. She would just go to another bar and work so there is no hope. I did contemplate that but its no use and it would be for the wrong reasons in my mind now even though it would be the best thing for her.

I would say I wish her the best and I actually do but its time for me to move on. I want what I had with her when she was the woman I met not the person she is.And I can have that all I have to do is look.I am different right now from when we met but I am quite positive I am a better person now. I haven't been the greatest don't take me wrong, there has been strain on our marriage but I know what it has been and I was only a very small part of it.

Oh and someone asked I am 42 yrs old. And quite good looking as my mom says.......lol

May I suggest you take what you wrote here and it with extreme caution. Until the above is resolved and you realize how adulterous your own behavior is ... your wayward thoughts will attract you back to a wayward wife.

I would proceed with healing yourself from your own bad choices.

Red Alert ... Red Alert ... This is the foggiest wayward babble written today! WOW - JUST WOW!

Your WW is/was/always has been an alcoholic adulterous woman from before you met ... she simply displayed a nicer alcoholic/adulterous version for you in the beginning. She threw you crumbs and you believed you had an entire loaf. Because you were also an adulterous man with values at the same level as your current wife.

If your standards in a woman are what you write above ... I suggest avoiding all women for life ... your picker doesn't pick em well.

A great body and great sex can't and will never sustain a marriage ... make sure your **edit** picker fully understands this. Until your own adultery is resolved ... your cycle cannot and will never end.

Please read Lovebusters and His Needs Her Needs and SURVIVING AN AFFAIR to fully understand how your adulterous, lying, independent behavior will doom ALL your relationships moving forward.

That's what I thought. That changes everything, bigsky. You were married and dating. That makes you an adulterer, do you see that? It doesn't matter how comfortable you are in your skin or however else you want to word it. You were a married man, dating a woman who wasn't your wife, right?

Yes I understand this all, that is what I went to counseling for I had to change me. I have never said I was a perfect husband in the 1st marriage big mistake on my part.So yes I do understand fixing me and the more I read from here the more I understand this.So yes I have ended that cycle for me.I am now going about how I use my picker much differently. As well as I am definitely staying away from relationships for a while till this is completely over and I have rid myself of the emotional scars.

PrayIncessantly you are correct in your statement about WW and I am reading ordered the books.