His strategy is to try and get you to adjust your conditions so he doesn't have to adjust his life to meet your conditions.

I lived with someone who was never truthful.
Unless I caught him in a lie.
Unless I discovered something.
Unless I investigated.

And then he only admitted what I could prove.

I had to become a pro at asking the "right" question.
Because he would only answer what he was asked, so he thought it was ok to leaving information out -- if I hadn't very specifically asked EXACTLY for the information.

It can drive you out of your mind.

I would NEVER allow myself to live in that environment again, where I don't know the TRUTH of my life.

then:

starfish. Ths is why your WH is trying to go the "counselor" route to pry it out of him. It worked very well for him previously. He is hoping that it will work again. And he is going to drag it out for years as it is stuck deep inside.

Don't fall for this.

Wow I thought FIL was a supporter of yours? Nice.

Starfish, it may well take time to come clean, but he can decide to do it tomorrow. He knows it, too. The only thing stopping him is motivation.

Right now he knows that if he can get you to 'just trust' he can continue getting massive dopamine hits from random women, over and above the hits he gets from you.

The addiction to the dopamine highs - more addictive than crack cocaine - is what motivates him right now. He knows full well he wouldn't get the same highs from silly skanks, unless he has you to
cheat on..

It is quite serious that he took the poly to purposefully lie. That's wayward even for a wayward. He will prob have to hit bottom hard to rid himself of addiction.

While his needing help is prob true, you can't stick around to do it because a)you create half the dope he is addicted to and b)you'd have a nervous breakdown.

Without you meeting needs, his A highs are inadequate and get lower and lower until he becomes miserable. He will hit rock bottom. This is the point where waywards reconsider whether their addiction is worth it. Some see this as motivation to change, some don't.

Meantime you will have gone 'cold turkey' yourself by not contacting him which will make a divorce hurt less, if one is meant to be.

My FIL left me a message this morning wanting to know how I was doing, told me he loved me etc. and to give him a call later when I had a few minutes. I haven't called him back yet.

I relalize what you are saying about him hitting rock bottom and believe he was close to it yesterday, but then he heard my voice on the phone and he started to feel better.

Precisely! You got it. We BS stop the wayward from hitting rock bottom. That's part of the reason Dr H tells us to step aside and allow rock bottom to happen in Plan B.

Without rock bottom the addict is sitting in a crack factory with zero reason to leave

In the military, they break down their new recruits so they can mold them into the soldiers they need them to be. Think of Plan B as that, for you, and for your WS. You are at your bottom when you enter Plan B, and you help your WS by allowing them to hit theirs.

You will get to build yourself up into a person who can have a fulfilling marriage.

Yup, that is an excellent description of Plan B Scot.

The first few weeks are NOT FUN. Complete strip down of the soul. I would say there are two days where things peak which particularly suck. Perhaps the most awful days of my life, worse than Dday (its where the real sting of infidelity hits, without any shock to cushion the blow). Though I'm agnostic, there was a point I begged God to help me. I'd do it all again tomorrow tho.

Because you come through that short term withdrawal so strong. Its easy to be happy very soon after. Like a catharsis. The following months of Plan B just build you up more and more, day by day I honestly could handle anything now.

Yes, I think I'm almost ready for Plan B. He is at a bar again tonight... I'm sure he is eating too, but I know drinks are involved.

Should I call my FIL back? What should I say to him?

Ill defer to the vets but I wouldn't bother trying to garner his support or anything. You asked him to support you. Its up to him what he does after that. Call him to be civil if you want, but don't put yourself out. When my very loving and supportive FIL went about town telling everyone WH 'wasn't really' in an A after exposure, I just let the matter drop without a word.


The end bit of Plan A, where you begin to flag and they are still flaunting their bad habits in your face, is so hard I know.

If you still need an intermediary, I'd be happy to help out as an email IM. If you want to, just ask the mods for my email addy.

I think the first step for you is to stop your snooping.
Don't check the venues for now.
They will cause you to try to outguess and react to him.

You don't need that in plan A at this point.

You won't snoop if you ever go to plan B.

Snooping is testing your Taker right now.

It will need to be commenced if you ever truly try to rebuild the marriage. You aren't there at this juncture.

Yes, I would call him back. And tell him that you know your H is not telling the truth. Explain to him that your H is going to have to come clean and pass a polygraph in order to continue the marriage. Remind him that it would be ludicrous to give him the benefit of the doubt after his long history of dishonesty.

Also, I don't agree you shouldn't be snooping. You are supposed to snoop and need to know what he is doing.

Reading makes a great point. Snooping is usual in Plan A, but after a failed poly you KNOW he's lying - the details will only bug you.

Maybe give the password/snooping tools over to a trusted friend and only have her tell you anything if its significant. I wouldn't dwell on evry bit of intel at this point.

She needs to continue snooping until she goes into Plan B. Snooping is PART OF Plan A and she has no reason to stop and every reason to continue.

starfish, keep watching him as long as you can.

The best way to get through the snooping while in Plan A is to KNOW that the pain WILL end once you enter Plan B. I continued to snoop via a VAR on my WH. I am happy I did, because I knew some of his plans, ie taking my BED when he was moving out. That didn't happen. There were other things, but honestly, I would have to re-read my thread because I am so far out from it, it has no effect on me anymore. THAT'S one of the MANY things you gain from doing a PROPER Plan B. Mine still has holes, especially through the children, but for the most part, I am in total darkness, and it's a heck of a lot better than where I would have been otherwise.

Ditto


Starfish, here's how you phrase the polygraph .... Every time it is the topic.
You:" polygraph? What a great opportunity for you. (cheerfully) You are so fortunate to have that opportunity to clear yourself."

Change the definition every time the topic comes up.

Poly = opportunity

Hi Indie! Yes, I'm interested in you being my IM. How do I ask the mods for your email?
Thank you so much for offering... I'm in tears!

I will continue snooping while still in Plan A.
I'm trying to find the Plan B love letter that you sent me a few days ago. I also need to work on my addendum/criteria. Any advice for me on this?

Again, I want to thank all of you for being such a great support for me in this extremely difficult time! It means so much to me!!!

starfish, God bless your heart.