Pay heed to this..

Thank you all for replying with straight-up, no-nonsense, 3rd party advice. I have taken heed.

I had a sitdown with my H. Explained that none of us can go on like this. I let him know that I didn't feel the same way anymore, that I didn't have the energy to fight for this marriage. We discussed for about two hours yesterday. He cried. I didn't. He then showered completely on his own. I made dinner while he set the table. He then cleaned up after dinner. The boys also helped out yesterday with laundry, picked up dog poop in the yard, vacuumed, took out garbage...and no one complained. Kinda nice! And...my middle son applied online for five jobs.

Today, my H was up, showered, dressed, and gone by 9:00 am. He went to the bank then to his work to catch up with his boss and co-workers. He came home and walked the dog down the block. He is now at my youngest son's baseball practice. He moved slow and was breathing heavy from the pain (I call him Darth) but he kept going.

Could be a miracle. We'll see. I'm back to work tomorrow and the kids are back to school. Hope he keeps this up when alone.

It's a step but we are still a long ways from where we need to be. I still feel tense when in the house with him and actually feel relieved to go back to work tomorrow.

I appreciate the support. Please don't let go of me yet! I still don't know if I could leave him, but I do need to try to make the situation better.

To add...

My H has been to many doctors the past two years. This is Worker's Comp so we are tied to their timing and their doctors. He finally had fusion surgery on his upper back in February and once that heals, he will have another on his lower back. He is waiting on the next appointment with his neurosurgeon.

He is also in Pain Management. Had an appointment two weeks ago and is due again the last week of April for another.

He has a lawyer to deal with his Worker's Comp and another lawyer who helped him apply for Social Security.

This situation exemplifies one of my lacks in understanding MB. And it has personal relevance.

To Dr H and to MB in general, what does ��in sickness and in health� really mean?

There appear to be two complimentary problems going on simultaneously here.

1. If one�s EN�s are not being met in the way they want them met, MB says negotiate, Plan B then separate. Nowhere is anything written about considering the causes of one�s spouse not being able to meet one�s EN�s. The causes do not appear to matter to MB other than with regard to possibly tailoring a remedy. (This attitude is in fact the running gospel regarding the emotionally broken BH on WPG�s thread.) What does MB say about a spouse who gets physically sick or injured and can no longer meet the other spouse�s EN�s? What is there to negotiate? What is the use of a Plan B? Only separation remains, as cruel and as selfish as that sounds.

2. The spouse who is physically ill or injured is also an adulterer (present to former irrelevant). Not only are the other spouse�s EN�s not being met in the way they want them met but just compensation is also no longer an option. What does MB specify (there are no recommendations in MB, there are only very specific plans with very specific steps - otherwise one is not following MB) for the other spouse to do then? Does the fact that the ill or incapacitated spouse was an egregious adulterer when they could be such make any difference? (It does to me - but that�s just me. What does MB say in this situation?)

Also, I am wondering why this adulterous, incapacitated spouse cannot loose 125 pounds, start serious physical therapy, and get the necessary additional expert medical help. There are not many back problems that cannot be fixed these days, even if it means fusing his spine. Why is he not doing what it takes, even if he has to go on public assistance? It sounds to me like he is wallowing. Perhaps divorcing him is what this BW needs to do so he can get on Medicaid. (However, as a taxpayer I don�t particularly like that solution.)

Where does MB lay down the line between injured spouse, unmet ENs, just compensation and separating? In general and when the injured spouse is/was the adulterer.

And lastly, �There are no trips. No sex. No movies. No family outings. Nothing. I come home from work and I cook, clean, do laundry. I help him shower and lift his legs. I'm a caretaker. I can't leave him. My sons would never forgive me.�

Can you go out with female friends?

Can you stop doing your sons� share of the housework for them. Let them do it.

Speaking of your sons, why do you not plainly tell them what you posted here? If they have demonstrated no lasting issues with their father doing drugs and boinking a ho they will probably not have a serious problem with you simply taking a few steps back from his needs. They can meet their dear sire�s needs if they are so worried about him. You might start worrying they are turning out like him, though.

I get the impression you are sacrificing way too much. MB avers in no uncertain terms such sacrificing to be very bad indeed.

Eta: Medicaid

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Medicaid_vs_Medicare

Aph,

You bring up a good question here.

This topic was discussed with Dr. Jennifer Harley Chalmers when we did our phone counseling with her, shortly after reconciling from my affair.

The good doctor brought up the subject of injury and illness short/long term. She told me that it was necessary for both of us to maintain some healthy, same sex friendships where most of our EN's could be met during these circumstances.
That we were to only allow care givers of the same sex (other than family) to help us in our physical recoveries.
She explained that friends (again, same sex) and family can help to meet the shortfall of our EN's (except SF) during these times.

The one caveat in the discussion; If we did not establish a solid love bank prior to any illness or injury, either could be at great risk during this type of a time.



As far as just compensation goes, IMO, that would not apply in a situation where there has been an injury or illness. I mean what is there to forgive? It's not like they did this on purpose. The same would seem to be the case for seperation, it's not like you would move to a plan B when your spouse is injured or ill. IMO It just doesn't apply.

On a different note, If we need help to stop enabling our spouse or help to stop letting our children take advantage of us.... well that's an entirely different subject all together. And IMO, I also think that is more along the lines of what tt is dealing with.....

I agree with you. Mostly.

My question about MB just compensation had two parts, though.

I agree with your answer to the first part. Just compensation does not apply to an injured spouse in general.

What about just compensation owed by an adulterous spouse who then gets injured or becomes seriously ill and can no longer meet the BS�s ENs?

Maybe there are exceptions to this, but I haven�t seen any irl.

According to MB, just compensation is owed to the BS for the adultery, and part of MB-style just compensation is doing what it takes to meet the BS�s ENs in the way they want them met. But EN meeting, and thus the main part of just compensation, can no longer be provided due to the illness or injury. According to MB this lack of just compensation will result in one more miserable unfulfilled M after adultery. So, does this nullify reconciliation? If just compensation cannot be made for whatever reason is the next step separation?

I would think an adulterer who wants to reconcile using strict MB methods better hope they can follow through on their just compensation actions for the rest of their life, no matter what.

Maybe it hinges on the BS�s love bank balance by the time the illness or injury occurs.

To be honest, I have a basic problem with an adulterer finally starting to do what they solemnly vowed they would always and for life do in the first place being called compensation of any kind.

eta: Appears Tatertot is working her problem � which is good. This self-absorbed WH, and her sons, will need long-term motivating.

Like in the bible, when Gomer was bought at old age when her looks were gone, by her BH, out of slavery, that she herself put herself into..

So NOW you want to come back! After giving it all away to others..All what? What was important to the man? Was it her looks?

I agree, that people sell themselves short, and in that day, just like today, women are valued by how they appear, and if that is how we value them, they know it too.

Its whether they accept that and use that as their only value. Men have a lot to do with that image, but I loved my wife not because she was beautiful, (and she was, very much so), on the outside. But who she was on the inside.

But she was damaged early in life by her family, and its what she knew, when things got tough, that some men just looked at the outside, and that was power. Why do we need power? Because we are afraid.

How can you receive just compensation from someone who doesn't even have a clue what you have invested? You can't. If the dialogue is brought up to someone who only cares about themselves, and what they lost, it results in tunnel vision about themselves.

The story in the bible was about someone placing greater value on someone than they had upon themselves. But in this world, we have to communicate those values, and be on the same page. How else can we explain it to others?

Kinda like asking does the get out of jail free card still apply after time has passed and an accident occurs?

Dunno? But logic tells me that if the BS were willing to remain in the marriage after an affair, then an illness/injury is not going to run them off either.






I would agree!


This is what I mentioned in my previous post. I think it hinges a great deal on this love bank balance, and it's also why Dr. Chalmers placed an emphasis on this subject during our coaching sessions.


I know you do, and to be honest, that's why I have written that it should only be considered.... just compensation with a lower case "j" rather than Just Compensation as in "Justice" or "paying back with something of equal value". It's just that, an attempt to compensate in some manner for the damage created.

I have a piece of a quote from Dr. H where he agrees with you, mostly;





Sorry, I moved this to the end...

I believe we are back to my discussion about surrounding ourselves with family and friends that can meet our needs in the event our spouse becomes injured or ill....

I do not believe an injury or illness, that leaves us unable to meet our spouses needs, nullifies anything. After meeting Dr. Harley and his wife and watching them together, I don't believe they would feel that way either.


Aph, I know some of these questions go back to WPG's situation. And I don't think they should be blown off... I don't know what WPG is going to do, all I can tell you is that if my wife were unable to meet my needs, I would continue doing whatever it took to help her recover for as long as it would take. I can say, I have not shied away from POJA or PORH while helping our marriage heal, I'm not sure that's been the case with WPG and it's definitely not been the case with tt.

Without sustained radical honesty(PORH)over an extended period of time, no one can say they have been doing whatever it takes to recover and/or heal their marriage!

Yeah so true, and because the truth always comes out in the end, the fakers and manipulators are always found out. They can't or won't keep up the charade, because they think they deserve so much more.

Radical honesty is something both must trust and strive for, because if only one is honest, and used by the other in manipulation, one becomes a martyr and the other spoiled rotten.

Its a buyers mentality, and there is nothing to lose, because you are investing in each other, for life, and they are you, and you them.

A new person, molded from two, equal in Gods eyes, but different people all the same.

If anyone is afraid to be honest about any and everything, with someone they want to live with and love forever, then frankly, they are dishonest with themselves first.

It is all before us, and those things hidden in a marriage, are just misunderstandings and trust issues waiting to blossum into lies and deciet.

We reap what we sow, and the seeds in our minds are often the most dangerous

Was a miracle this day, praying for another for you tommorrow, and until miracles are the norm

I haven't checked in lately because I've been busy. Busy with work and activities and busy in my head. I wrote a letter to each of my sons telling them they needed to pitch in, clean up, support the family. My oldest son has bought groceries for the family (on his own) and done chores around the house. The other two boys have also helped out a little less reluctantly than before. Meaning - they have stepped up. I don't want to put too much pressure on them as they are doing their best to end the year with positive grades in school and are in baseball.

My husband is an assistant coach for my youngest son's team. He cannot physically coach but his wealth of knowledge of the game has been inspirational to the team. He is getting out, is involved in something he loves, and has more better days than previously. He does still have times of sullenness and depression.

My feelings for him have not changed. He still makes me angry. To me, he is a burden. We went to a wedding last weekend. It was small and intimate. During the ceremony, I had to keep pinching him to keep him awake. When walking to the reception area, the boys and I had to wait for him and we were the last to arrive. The seating was tight and it was difficult to get him in and out of his seat. I had to give him extra room and was so uncomfortable I couldn't move or enjoy my meal with him leaning against me. We socialized with people we hadn't seen in a few years and the conversations were all about him and his injury. I heard his story at least 5 times during the day. I finally left him to pursue my own conversations with other guests. He felt abandoned.

The other day while reading the Facebook site of a local TV station, I saw the OW had commented on a story. She sounded so ignorant and crass in her posts. I took pride in the fact I am much more intelligent and tactful than her but the trigger for me seeing her name and picture lasted a few days. Yes, I took it out on my H. He didn't know why I was so angry.

I'm not being fair, I realize that. But I have given up and accepted so much in the past 20 years that I am feeling selfish to the point that it is MY TIME! I will be taking a business trip out of town in June and am thinking of spending an extra day just for me. I long to visit a museum or aquarium where I do not have a monkey on my back.

We marry "for better or worse and in sickness and in health" but I don't think we ever fully understand that until it beats us over the head. We also marry to be faithful. My marriage vows meant everything to me. When I walked down the aisle 20 years ago, I had no 2nd thoughts. I was deeply in love with this man and never doubted my decision. I can confidently say that there were no "signs", no doubts, no second guessing. I wasn't a fool. Now...I am. I should have gotten out when I had the chance. That chance is over.

I have read all the replies given to me and I appreciate every one of them. I have to fix myself before I can fix my marriage. I'm broken.

Last week, my best friend in the whole world died in my arms. My cat was almost 18-years-old and I had to let her go. I have never felt so incredibley lonely as I do right now.