OG, I asked you about what he agreed to, on your other thread. The answer to that is important.

He agreed to new email, spam filter for old with continued access to all his online activity. New job is not realistic now his only job skills are all computer related. We can put all those in place but nothing will change unless he changes. He needs and should want to never hurt our marriage again and to feel that in the depth of his being right?

I can't be a prison guard, I want to be a wife in a honest marriage. I don't want to die from a thousand cuts.....in the end, I have to find some peace and if that's with him or alone, at this point I just feel so sad and confused. I remember in love must be tough, he suggest that working on yourself is helpful and puts the focus back on my healing and not obsessing over him.

Following my gut is scary.

Updates and I could really use some help in dealing with the fear of "safety".

In counseling yesterday we talked about my fear of not feeling safe based on future temptations to reconnect with her or another person. The therapist asked "what can husband do to make you feel safe?" and I responded that I felt I needed to work through it on my own,that he has done all the tangible things ( nc/etc) but how can you predict future behavior? Then the topic got derailed and went in another direction.

This morning we continued the conversations and spouse said he really wants to help me feel safe what can he do and I said. . "what will you do if the Ow tries to contact you in two years time etc..... his response was "if our marriage is close and connected then I would have no interest in re sparking the affair" to which did not make me feel safe,

I asked him, "wouldn't your ethics, feelings for me, our life together and the desire not to hurt me keep you from cheating? He said , no those are just lips service...I can say all that stuff and it doesn't make it true, because I already hurt you, betrayed you and didn't consider your feelings so the only thing that prevents me from cheating is if our marriage is solid and connected. If you are meeting my emotional need for touch and affection.

*sigh* Then it went downhill from there and he said.. "i hate counseling because we talk about the affair for two days and it just makes me want to get divorced because it's making me feel bad and we are making no progress".

This blindsiding kind of statements keeps me feeling insecure about this commitment to rebuilding. We've had several weeks of positive romantic times, which I felt were good.

I'm feeling like I am inside a tornado.

That is the correct answer. None of that will stop a person from having an affair.


And this is a load of blameshifting horsecrap that means he does not get it. Meeting emotional needs does not prevent affairs. In every marriage, there is a time where ENs are not met. Yet many people never have affairs. The reason your husband has affairs is because he has piss poor boundaries around women.

The correct answer to "what will you do if the OW contacts you again?" Is------------> "the OW CAN'T contact me again because I have changed my number and email address. I have removed any avenue of contact."

Just the fact that she CAN contact him again means he has not taken this seriously. He needs to make sure she CAN'T contact him.


Right again. You just paid money to lovebust each other and further erode the love in your crippled marriage. This is why the Harleys NEVER counsel couples in crisis together. Counseling is destructive to marriages especially when there has been an affair.


You are getting blindsided by the WRONG THINGS. Your husband is telling you what you need to hear and you don't like it because you don't understand what needs to happen here.

Drop the counselor and do something productive like get pedicures. It will be better for your marriage. Then tell your H that you both need to work on affair proofing the marriage TODAY. He needs to make that happen. If the OW can get through to him, then you are not affair proofed.

Get er done and then move on. Once the marriage is affair proofed, then don't bring it up again.

You tell your husband all the need meetin in the world will not compensate for piss poor boundaries. Lots of people have affairs whose needs are met very well. My husband is one of them! And he had an affair!

Why?

Because he had piss poor boundaries around women. So until your H mans up and takes some accountability for his affairs, nothing will change. And you will NEVER be safe.

He has cut off all ways....it was more a hypothetical questions about her and any other future women.

Thank you for the boundary reminder, I think that's what is really bothering me...he needs boundaries in place around himself in addition to the marriage.... but don't people just "move" them when it's affair fog time....I'm sure most people involved in a affair never thought they would be in that position.

I know my spouse said that stuff to....I would never cheat etc.

How can your husband cheat if his whole life is an open book, though? Will power and "ethics" did not stop him the past and it won't stop him in the future. That is true. I would focus on what his boundaries are. Such as accounting for all his time, never spending the night apart, no personal conversations with women, no opposite sex friendships, no lunches with women, etc. And you have to be able to check on him. For example, you should have spyware on his phone and his computer without his knowledge.

I would let him know that affair conversations are even more unpleasant for you but if he takes extraordinary precautions to avoid an affair, you won't feel so uneasy. Lay out what you need. And don't put words in his mouth.

I would also address his blameshifting bull crap. That is a very dangerous attitude and he needs to be a big boy and take some accountability here. Point out that lots of people don't get their needs met and they don't have affairs. But even people who have their needs met do have affairs if they have sloppy boundaries.

How are you spying on him?

Also, I would ask him to come to this forum and start posting his perspective. We will be able to tell pretty quickly if he is wayward or not. You can ask the mods to bury this thread or just start up a new name and let this thread die.

Did you see what I wrote about "counseling?"

I did and it was a light bulb moment for me...'paying to love bust"...normally our sessions graze over the affair and she spends more time focusing on how we communicate with one another, turning towards each other instead of away with distractions ( his net addiction- my desire to "chase" and solve our problems while he flees difficult discussions. How to affair proof our relationship (she recommends the books by Harley) and how to be honest with one another.

One side effect of this new honesty is he is now sharing all his sexual fantasies that he kept hidden before and they are a tad troubling only in the sense that it makes me feel like he doesn't feel protective of me.. for instance .... sorry if they offend some but I'll be frank.. We used to have "vanilla" sex, nothing too crazy and I'm not a prude it's just I never knew he wanted to branch out because he never shared ( he doesn't communicate much"

use of variety of sex toys ( plugs, dildos, pegging, sex swing, variety of female vibrators for me etc. )

Sex in public places where you could get caught.

And the one that bothered me the most...... a MMF threesome, where he said he doesn't "think" he would get jealous if I had intercourse with another man as long as he could participate and not be a voyeour, like the guy could service him as well.... *sigh*

Which just makes me feel like his feelings for me are not of a jealous protective nature but one of sharing?? I know jealousy doesn't equal love but somehow the fantasy he has makes me feel like he doesn't have that for me.

Then of course he fantasizes about FFM threesome- which I couldn't possibly see doing unless I had no emotional feelings for him...just thinking of it makes me want to cry especially at the raw stage I'm in.

He says he wouldn't be opposed to doing any of this....but that some things like the threesome could stay a fantasy...but he thinks he could handle it.

I don't even know if I can bring that up at counseling because he would be mortified that I shared that......he is very shy and would consider it a betrayal to share that with her.

How I spy... I log into his phone and his computer and check all his history etc... nothing suspicious. He gave up the iPad..doesn't use it anymore. I sit beside him when he's on the net ( just randomly pop up beside him and sit) etc...

His life is basically, go to work, calls me from work, comes home, eats, watch show, talk after kids are in bed, etc )

I'm not exaggerating when I say he doesn't have many friends. He has one elderly male coworker, but they mainly socialize via chat...he eats lunch at work with this coworker ( I call it a bromance)

No one ever calls him, visits him etc...I wish he had more friends but if I wasn't married to him he would live in a cabin like a hermit and be perfectly happy as long as he had the net....his personality is INTP if that helps.

Meanwhile, I'm the social butterfly with friends galore, and a full social life. That's where I am used to getting my conversation emotional needs met. I have tried for years to get my spouse to talk more but he just doesn't need that like I do.

I think if we only talked via the net and he showed up to have sex every other day it would suit him just fine. His companionship needs are low.

Sheesh, the more I type about our lives the more pathetic and sad it sounds.

How much UA time are you getting a week? Watching TV does not count.

Also you need to put spyware on his phone and a keylogger on the computer.

I would do a better job of spying. A WS with an IQ of 4 knows how to delete history. Install spyware on his phone and a keylogger on his compouter so you know what he is doing. It sounds to me like he is looking at porn which is why he is so into dirty sex. His sexual proclivities indicate a) he is into porn and b) would explain why he finds you so boring. Once he gives up the porn, his sexual tastes will change and he will be more attracted to you. Another symptom of porn use is viewing your spouse as only a vehicle for sexual satisfaction and nothing more.

The WORSE thing in the world you can do is engage in sex acts you don't like. And even if you did like swinging, you shouldn't do that because it is a disaster to marriage.

How much undivided attention do get in every week? What was your total last week?


Thats a good thing. Gives him more time to focus on his marriage.


He needs to get his needs met in your marriage, not outside of marriage. My H is an introvert too and doesn't need or want friends. *I* am his best friend.

oh crap, I see Brainshurt said everything I just said!

He is watching alot of porn, isn't he?

Hey Mel kimino over in recovery is calling out for your help.
End of t/j

Yes, he has always watched a lot of porn, he's been on the net since he was 17 years old ( almost 37 now) and you have a man with no social skills, only child, no friends, parents who ignore you and too much free time on his hands.

I discovered that after the affair confession....when I thought he was in his home office working, he was really watching porn and masturbating ( sometimes 3 times daily) while i was upstairs raising the kids.

How did you figure that out so quick??

He doesn't delete the history because I see the porn he looks at, mostly literotic website stuff ( erotic stories vs videos) but there are videos...mostly swinging, vanilla stuff, and sometimes she male stuff.

I would think he would delete the more embarrassing stuff.... so I know of that..

phon

Please listen to these radio clips from Dr. Harley about porn.

Radio clip of Dr. H talking about porn

Radio clip on porn

It is so obvious by his behavior. SEx to him is more about the ACT than the relationship, which is a sign. AND he likes kinky, creepy sex. ALL a sign of porn use. And ALL very bad for your marriage. He doesn't desire you because he is getting his sexual fulfillment outside of marriage.

In short, you are competing with porn stars and bizarro sex in your own marriage. And as long as that is the case, you will come up short.

If you eliminate the porn so he gets his SF need met in the marriage, he will be more attracted to you and will abandon the creepo, sick stuff.