BH,

That is what BPDs do: attach to another host. I like that description.

Mostly I feel sorry for my WW. I or anybody else cannot help her. She has to hit the bottom in order to realize that she needs help. I hope that this happen soon for her.

I admire you staying with your husband. I also agree that staying makes Seneca only if pwBPD commit fully to DBT. I hope that he will recover.

I am reading about tools for communication with pwBPD? I think that they are vey compatible with MB principles. Both of them promote empathy and love for our spouses while reminding us that we need to establish strong boundaries with them and protect ourselves.

When I exposed my WWs A I did not know that she may be BPD. BPDs are hypersensitive so What do you think A exposure did for her and the A itself? Also I sent that nasty letter to POSOM that must have hurt their relationship. My WW must hate me now. How do you combine MB and BPD tools?

Being a fixer/rescuer I would stay with her if she were to commit to recovery and DBT. However, she is in a total denial about it. Poor POSOM does not know what he is getting into. Idealization lasts typically 1-6 mo. Miine with her lasted 9 mo. After that he will be dethroned in one day or few hours!

Yes MB is very inline with dealing with BPD's. Dr. Harley told me if my WH didn't get help for his BPD/bipolar and stay in DBT and on his meds that there was no hope for my M. I was actually preparing for Plan B when he worked really hard with his Psych and got his meds. It was a tough few months for me because it took awhile to get the dosage and correct meds. I can't tell you how many different kinds we tried.

Boundaries are the most important things for a BPD. Which is what DBT teaches them. As a nonBPD I had to stop myself from the DJ's thinking. "This is so obvious why can't you get it". Until I realized the full extent of BPD's and the pain they are in did it click for me. I come from a family with no mental illness and so this was all new to me.

I combine MB tools and BPD tool parallel. I work on my validation with all of Dr. Harley's concepts. I have to watch my taker because that is the biggest hurdle for me. I set firm boundaries and live by them.

If your WW at 40 doesn't get help she probably never will and will continue to find other hosts. Yes the idealization period lasts differently for each one but not much longer than 6-9 months.

I hope you continue to heal and take care of yourself. Teach yourself what to watch out for to not attract BPDs again.

There is something in us nonBPD's that they BPD's will be and need. Figure that out and you will be ok and you will find the right person.

Was she addicted to anything? Drugs, alcohol, eating disorder?

BH,

As I mentioned my WW is a very high functioning Waif (quiet) type of BPD that looks like a saint to most people. She was not a raging BPD. She was not able to express her amger at all which is very bad. I expressed anger for both of us and that is not healthy. Instead we both should learn to express the anger appropriately.

Others do not understand how cruel, emotionally abusive she was to me after she filed for divorce. Very few would believe that she is a BPD except her ex husband. I know now more about history of that relationship.

Here is what I found somewhere:

A patient who is "High functioning" and "a quiet borderline" is able to mislead 100% of those around - Degrees of the illness..
High functioning Borderlines may rage only in front of their significant other. In fact many keep it so well hidden that Non's are not believed when they tell friends and family what is happening. Job instability may or may not be present in high functioning borderlines, but is usually found in low functioning

This is so true! It makes recovery for this type of BDP much harder. In their own mind nothing is wrong with them. My WW she likes herself the way she is right now. While she has many admirable qualities, BPD is not one of them. It destroys her own life and lives of other families. However, she is in a survival mode and right now getting love to fill the emptiness of her soul is much more important than anything else including the interest of her own kids. Active BPD make bad parents by default. Her daughter is in a great danger of becoming a BPD. My MIL is I see it now. It is a family tragedy. How do you stop this destructive cycle when my WW does not think she has a problem. People advise against telling them that directly. They somehow have to realize that.

She says that she all traits of ACOA. She has a PTSD and blames me for that!!! That is typical of BPD. She is a love addict but denies it. However, that is a big part of BPD: They are addicted to falling in love feeling and hope it will stay forever. They never learn from past mistakes that it will not. She likes to drink a lot. She may be a sex addict to but again that is sort of part of BPD where they cannot be alone (their bed is never cold).

The more I learn about it the less angry I am at her. I feel sad and sorry for her. I cannot help her. Only she can do it but she will not.

This is the key AD. There is nothing you can do if she won't get help. You would just be an enabler and taking her abuse.

You need to go NC and heal. If you've been reading about BPDs then you see that NC is the key to healing from a relationship with BPDs when you exit from them. If you don't, you will always be in their drama. Close that door my friend.

What is the status of your divorce?

BH,

I've been reading about BPD and yes everyone says NC is the way to go. I have to think about myself and my children. I do not want to be recycled again by her. Our mediation is set for next Tuesday 6-5, the only day that's he is notwithstanding the POSOM ( her current host). I know how that will end but the poor sucker does not.
At the and of my marriage I do not know who is my wife.

Interestingly in 208 Congress designated May as the Borderline Personality Disorder month! Yes this May of 2012 I became fully aware of BDP and that I lived 7.5 years with one, I also became aware that I have some of the same issues as pwBPD but in a more "normal" range. I do not like being alone but I got used to it. I do not cut myself. I have never been suicidal. However, I too have problems with anger and self esteem. We are all in the gray area: some are more gray than the others. I don't hate pwBPD. However, when you think that as much as 10 % of the general population may have it it is really scary!!!

Today I was talking to an acquaintance about BPD. Yes I am little obsessed with it. After I finished explaining what BPD is, he realized that his ex-fianc�e was BPD. She was with a BF when she met him. She dumped her BF and after 17 months she dumped him too for another host that she already secured. She too was a waif typeof BPD. Of course she was very successful, gorgeous and very smart. I'll be going after ugly girls from now on

All you people out there, spend few bucks, buy few books on BPD, study it and save yourself from a tragedy. There are people who dated pwBPD who dumped them very suddenly for no reason, and few years later they're still asking why? Are you one of those?

Can you have her OM subpoenaed to answer questions about their affair?

The way to deal with waywards/BPD is boundaries and making sure they have consequences.

What a better way then to send that message? It may be the fall that could help her hit bottom. They hate looking bad in "others" eyes!

POSOM is from NC where the law is more strict about affairs than where I am (TX). However, I understand that is rarely enforced. There is also Allienation of Affection in NC but my guess is that it is not enforced. I hope that POSOM's BW will take him to the cleaners. I provided as much information to her about the affair as I could I am sure he will not mind since all he needs is love (especially the one you get from a BPD during the idealization phase :))

I do not know if I can subpoena him in TX for an affair. However, in TX division of community property is affected by an affair and I will take advantage of that as a way of "teaching my WW a lesson" as you say not for the money. I have my own successful business.

I read today that pwBPD have emotional hemophilia and will do anything to stop emotional pain. They will even neglect their own children which is what my WW is doing right now. POSOM is the worst father in the whole world because he has uNPD (his BW says that). She also says that he is a POS and I have to agree with her. She hates my WW. I do not blame her for that.

What my WW is doing is criminal. How many more marriages and families will she destroy due to her uBPD. And she is a doctor! Little time in prison would fix her BPD quickly! How about both my WW and the POSOM losing their medical license. No way! Instead I get a letter from her lawyer and a call from the police department for exposing their affair by sending emails and making phone calls. The policeman was nice to me though He understands. I totally believe in affair exposure so much thatbI will also expose my next wife's affair

I did not tell POSOM's BW about my WW's uBPD and I do not plan to do that.

You're fortunate you aren't in Oregon where they have no fault and don't even consider adultery or alienation of affection.

My mediation is tomorrow. I will meet my attorney for coffee before mediation. I could not meet him before. I guess that is all coaching I am going to get. I do not know what to expect. I did some reading about mediation and almost everyone says it is better than litigation. We both will have our attorneys there do it will not be expensive. Personally, I think mediation came too soon (before discovery). It is mandatory in TX.

I am not thinking about mediation very much. All I am thinking is that I spent almost 8 years with a high functioning, waif Borderline and I did not know that until few weeks ago. Now that I know that she has mental Ilness I would stay to help her. Would you leave your spouse after learning that she has cancer. No! However, most people are telling me to run away. Also, was it a fantasy or a real person? I think it was a real person. Her BPD got triggered after 5 years and is now very active.

I am reading a lot. I bought 6 more books about BPD. One is called "Loving Someone with BPD" by Shari Manning. I am all about reason. The book says active BPD speak only the language of emotions! These are two different languages. Nons have to learn emotional language beacuse BPDs cannot learn the language of reason until maybe after long therapy.

Her affair with the POSOM is like watching a movie that you watched many times. You know the outcome of it. It willnbe devastating for both of them. I am even less inclined to see it as an affair but rather as a product of her Ilness. It is an affair but that is of secondary importance in her case.

It is sad to see how BPDs change their personality when they attach to a different host. The POSOM is the worst father. My WW is becoming the worst mother. She is barely spending any time with her children. She is traveling with the POSOM all the time. I am very family oriented and she was the best mother, step mom and wife while with me.

If untreated my WW will continue to destroy more marriages and families. If she were to kill someone she would end up in prison. However, her actions are not considered criminal. There is a very, very small chance of her ever recognizing that she is a BPD. I asked one expert what will happen to her if untreated. "She will die lonely and without any friends" was the answer. She has no friends right now.

Yes if BPDs do not get help they will end up alone and destroyed all close relationships.

Are you questioning whether you did enough?

BH,

I knew my WW for almost 8 years. Although BPD was dormant for most of our dating and marriage, the signs were there. I did not read them beacouse I did not know about BPD. Most people still do not know much about BPD. Being bi-polar is almost fashionable. Being BPD is not.

Yes I am questioning myself if I could have done something different had I known about her Ilness earlier. Also, I love her and I care about her and it is difficult for me to see her self-destruct and destruct other people. She will live a miserable and lonely life if she does not seek help. Being high functiioning BPD it is almost certain that she will not seek help since "what can be possibly wrong with her".

In the last minute of our divorce mediation my WW and I settled. I went into it with an open mind. Their counter offer to our "take it or leave it" offer was insulting and I was ready to walk away with my attorney but then her lawyer came running to us and gave us a much better offer that after few adjustments I accepted.

Our divorce will be final in about two weeks. I feel a strange mix of sadness and relief. My sadness is twofold: first it is the end of my marriage and our wonderful blended family and second is the realization that my wife is a borderline and that she will most likely never seek help. In her mind it is all my fault and she is fine. FYI borderlines are always victims. They cannot do wrong.

I cannot tell you how much everyone (my WW, her lawyer, my lawyer, mediator) except me hated my affair exposure emails. I stood my ground and I told them that I would do it again and that I have no regrets for doing it. If anything, due to those emails, POSOM will never be accepted into her family, she will never be accepted to his family. My WW and her children will never be allowed to be close to BW's children. All our friends know about her affairs. Her children hate POSOM and ask why I am not any more part of their life. I do miss them very much. My children see them but they do not want to see their mother (my WW) who they worshiped before.

I do love my WW since I know that she has a serious and untreated mental Ilness that is not noticeable due to her high functioning mask that she wears. I hate Borderline Personality Disorder. It is a terrible illness. If I had not figured out that she had a BPD I would have thought that something was seriously wrong with me. Now I know that I am in the "normal" range even with all my issues and she is not.

So I answered my own question. There is no hope for my marriage. Is there hope for my stbexW. I do not know.

There is hope for her my friend IF she were to get help. Most high functioning BPDs do not because they are the victim and will always have a new host.

Now what can you do for you and your children to maake sure they have the tools to handle her BPD? You've read those forums of the children of BPDs? Very, very heart breaking.

BH,

Thanks for all your support! You are right. Her attitude is: "Nothing is wrong with me. I like myself". There is no way she will admit to having BPD. In some stories that I read, BPDs who attempted suicide and were taken to ER, and were diagnozef with BPD there may have a chance of finally realizing that they have BPD. I do not wish to anyone to learn about BPD that way but sometimes that is the only way!

Yes, I read about the children of BPDs. You are right it is very heart breaking. It is such a destructive illness. Yes I am reading a lot about communication with BPDs. I wish I knew about her BPD and the communication with her long time ago. It will take a long time for me to get over this.

I would like to know more about a support group for bpd kids. Could you give me the google search terms to where you find support? Tx

I will delete this post after I found it not to cause trouble

The wonderful one I have found is bpdfamily.com it is co-founded by Randi Kreger co-author of "Stop Walking on Eggshells" and is very much aligned with MB it's all about boundaries you set. This was also recommended by his therapist and psychiatrist.

One of the my stbexW's complaints about me and the main reason for divorce was my anger and control issues. I accepted that. During our 10 month long divorce I worked hard on it so even she and everyone else noticed that I changed a lot. She told someone else that she chose POSOM because he is calm and has no anger issues. POSOM's BW told me yesterday:"Your wife does not know my husband as well as I do. He has huge anger and control issues!!!". What? Am I surprised? No I am not. It happens too often.

We have to do a nationwide study and determine once for all if the grass is really greener on the other side. Add BPD to the mix and the grass is not even green. It changes colors all the time.

I think that undignosed BPD is responsible for very many affairs and divorces. I wonder if Dr. Harley talked about it. If not I'd like him to address BPD in the context of affairs and divorces. Just think: new studies showed that at least 6 % of general population and as high as 10-12 % suffers from BPD!!! Previously it was thought that the number is 2%. Learn everything about BPD and go back and revisit your WS's history. You just may save yourself a lot of time, money and you may save your sanity. I honestly hope that is not your case.

BPD isn't responsible but
spending time alone with someone of the opposite gender is.

Walks, coffee, lunch, dinner, drinks, heck.......being alone together in a room at a workplace, gym, wherever.

Reading

I respectfully disagree. BPD in my case plays a major role. Also, BPD is a mental Ilness. One of the main characteristics of BPD is lack of boundaries which lead to all above that you mentioned. Think about someone who is threebyears old and their boundaries. That is BPD. I think that it would a huge mistake that in MB discussions Personal Disorders are not taken into account.

I agree with the principles of MB. Enforcing strong boundaries works well with BPD an other PDs. That is why most of my marriage worked well. I enforced those boundaries. Towards the end of my marriage I did not do I good job when my WW's BPD just exploded.

My point is that with a BPD you are dealing with someone who is emotionally 3 year old but looks like an adult and is exceptionally smart an successful and does not look like someone who has mental Ilness.

If you find out that your WS has a BPD it is a personal decision whether you stay or leave. I would have stayed but my wife wants divorce.

AD, people in the thick of an affair often mimic BPD behaviors so I wouldn't put much stock in that. They ALL have poor boundaries around members of the opposite and they are certainly not all BPD. It is the affair that plays the major role. Additionally, BPD is a very over diagnosed illness and Harley is doubtful that most of the diagnoses apply.