I'm in a pretty tough crisis right now and am trying to navigate and figure out what to do. I have 2 kids aged 6 and 8. My husband has been pretty out of control for alot of years now. It would really take pages and pages of writing to even explain alot of what's gone on. On top of all the troubles I found out that he had sex with another female through the month of May. I found this out while we were out of town last week on vacation with our kids and another couple of friends.

Through the last two days, he has opened up about the fact that he has been doing this on and off throughout our marriage. I've always had trust issues with him because my intuition tells me something hasn't been right. Also his explosive, impulsive behaviors over the years shows me he's in alot of anguish and pain but I wasn't aware of multiple cheating. Its almost like an ego driven out of control guy who has a heart and feels shame and guilt but obviously nothing has changed his behavior up to this point. I know he loves me and our children, but I think he is truly sick.

Throughout the years i've seen his crazy behavior and its been a constant tension in our marriage for him to grow up and change and quit putting us at risk. Many things have happened down the line that i've swept under the rug in the hope that change would happen. We were sued by a neighbor because he didn't put up boundries with this guy and he came after us for money ect with one of husbands businesses. Thats just one of the many problems and crazy things that have happened. Overall I knew he had flirtatious tendencies and inappropriate behavior with women but I had no idea of what has really been going on. He's covered this all up and held it in and it's damaged him. He says he deletes things out of his head to deal with how big of a loser he feels about himself. He also has always been very forgetful, scatterbrained and impulsive.

Now that I know, it really explains alot to me about how he is so disconnected from me because he feels shame and disgust for himself from what he said. I seriously feel he has some real mental issues and he said to me that there are times he can do something, and then just erase it from his mind like he doesn't have a conscience. When I look at him he is crying in pain so the guilt is there and the sadness and wanting to be different is something he wants so bad, he says.

This is all a huge shock to me. Altough things have been hairy and crazy for years, I always said to myself welcome to life this is my craziness and I've been waiting for change to happen. I haven't wanted to give up hope as we have so many years and time invested together and my biggest fear is divorce and putting the kids through that. The stress and tension is really bad right now but I told him I really don't want him to move out. Part of me is worried if I let go too soon it will be the end because he really mentally is shut down.

He says he's prayed and asked God to change him over the years because he hates himself. He looks at us and knows what a liar he has been. He says he wishes he wasn't like this, and refuses to believe there is any hope for us after the bombshell he has dropped on me. Even before we were married he confesses to being inappropriate, but I don't know all the details.

We have already set appointments individually with a therapist, both Christian based and another Dr. for marriage counceling. We have never done therapy before, and probably should have gone long ago. Part of me thinks his level of selfishness and lack of conscience can't be fixed but I do feel relief that he told me whats been going on and it actually explains so many years of why all these problems were happening.

I don't want to be divorced or have this happen to our family. But in all honesty, he has put ME at risk by having partners outside our relationship and for that I just don't know.

The carpet has been pulled out from under me and I'm just not sure other than praying and seeking counceling I can do.

He was seeing a Stephens Minister (Christian individual) about 3 months ago through the church we are members at. I encouraged him to go because I thought it could help with all the problems he had before with bad decision making, choosing to be around people that take advantage etc etc.

He loves our kids so much and asks me if there is any way I can get past but I can't even answer that right now, i'm in shock and don't want to accept all the 'good' times we had he has been keeping all this from me. I just don't know what I can do - maybe he's just cut out to be this guy. His heart seems so torn down and i've seen this over the years. I feel very sad for him and the path he's been on. I've really tried to help him over the years sort out messes that he creates and I think i've been an enabler because I know he loves us and I keep waiting for change. He's very involved with the kids and is a good dad. I'm really at a loss what to do and am anxious to see my councelor on Tuesday. The stress and grief is hard to cover up around the kids. The crazy thing is we were supposed to close on a peice of land in two week, and had already met with an architect to build a house. I had to cancel the contract and since my house is for sale i'm thinking about taking it off the market so I can focus on what i'm going to do. I'm so confused and heartbroken.

hello, carol, and welcome to MB. i am sorry you have to be here.

your post is very long. the important point is:

your WH has confessed to multiple PAs.

now that you know, you need to pull out of the shock and make a plan. what is your goal? do you want to try to recover your M? if so, there is a step-by-step plan to do so. you will have to step out of your role as enabler, and this is hard, but can be done.

you need to stop thinking about him and his various excuses for his behaviour. whatever has happened to him in the past, whatever his mental/emotional/health state, he is an adult and is making his own choices, regardless. this is an important realisation. there is NO excuse to step outside the M.

and of course you have trust issues! your WH is untrustworthy!

it is good you have put the new house on hold. you need to see if your M is going to make recovery before you start any big project like that.

so, do you want recovery? or do you want out?

either way, it's your decision, and you cannot take either lightly - both are tons of work; however, you are entitled to either one. MB is not about marriage at all costs - you are entitled to divorce if you choose to. i do not know if you are Christian (i think you mentioned church & christian counselor), but even God allows for divorce in the case of infidelity. that should show you there are no excuses! :O)

i'm writing a book here too. you should not cover up around the kids. they are probably scared, because they can feel the tension. exposure is going to be one of your next steps, and you can start by telling your children the truth, in an age appropriate way. make sure you use the word "adultery" instead of "affair;" that way you can emphasize the wrongness of it (our culture thinks "affairs" are romantic...::blerg::).

Thank you for the reply. I think my mental state right now is very bad and the confusion about what to do now. He hasn't left our home but is staying upstairs. I just feel like he is someone I didn't know, and I'm wondering if he is capable of changing for himself or for me. Right now because i'm so focused on why he feels entitled to do whatever he wanted I can't seem to grasp or hold on to anything. I'm going to wait and see what the councelor says about seperating but like I said before Im not sure if that is the answer. All I know is that my state of shock went from bad when I found out about the female in May to disbelief when he told me this morning that this has been a pattern for him. Now I feel like a made a big mistake having children with a man so selfish.

Hi Carol, welcome to Marriage Builders. You are in the right place. There is a very strict path to recovery that has been hit by serial cheating and you won't get that from counseling. I would forgo the counseling, which is a distraction, and focus completely on restoring your marriage.

The solution won't be found in counseling, but will come from dramatically changing your behaviors.

The way to save your marriage is to first affair proof it. That involves several steps:

1. complete honesty about all of his affairs
2. spend all of his leisure time with you
3. never spend the night apart again
4. change the environment that led to his affairs, for example, if he meets these women at work, he would need to find a new line of work.
5. develop a completely transparent lifestyle where you have accesss to everything, cell phones, etc
6. never have opposite sex friendships and eliminate all social networking

Once the first steps are completed, you should use the basic concepts of Marriage Builders and create a romantic relationship. Here are the basic concepts: here

And lastly, I would expose his affairs to your family, friends, children, pastor, any husbands of his affair partners. The more people who know the more people to hold him accountable.

I would get the book Surviving an Affair and follow the plan outlined in it.

Carol, I would go to him with the above plan I outlined and see if he will agree to it. If he will, there is hope. If not, you should ask him to leave and get a legal separation/divorce.

carol, listen to mel. your IC will likely tell you to separate so you can "think things over," "have some alone time," and "figure things out." that's all rubbish. they don't have a clue.

if you can afford counseling, we all recommend contacting the counselling center here. their focus is saving marriages, period.

Hello,

Have you ruled out the possibility that your husband has adult ADHD?

Affair is one thing that you will get tremendous help from this site to deal with, and if both of you and your husband are willing to use the concepts here, you probably will be healing from it successfully. But ADHD is a different issue that creates a lot of struggles and tension in marriage.

Forgetfulness, irresponsibility, reckless behavior, thrill seeking, emotional immaturity... Those are some of the symptoms of ADHD.

Are you familiar with the policy of joint agreement (POJA)? If both are willing to accept this POJA and live by it, certain issues often fails POJA, then there might be more serious things to deal with (addiction, mental...)

I found out about my ADHD after he had his affair.

Wow, that is so ironic that you ask if he possibly has adult adhd! I've been saying this for years! Its also another struggle for him and because I end up pickup up and taking care of everything that he forgets to do I become an enabler. Also his attention to detail and impulsiveness leads me to believe that he has major issues. He also gets extremely frustrated with himself because he's CONSTANTLY losing things, misplacing stuff and making promises that he doesn't keep which puts a wall between us. Its like his mind is always elsewhere when he is with us, always spinning and always thinking. I've told a close friend for years, she also has adhd and she keeps telling me he needs to get help. It just seems like things just keep getting crazier and crazier with him over the years. His business decisions are scattered and therefore we've been taken advantage of, sued, he's gotten into physical fights with people, and now this with the affairs. The reason I can't walk away right now is because I know his heart and I truly believe there is something in him that wants help and wants to change, or so he says he is in pain. He has appt to see therapist and i'm going to tell him to mention the adhd. He even says he blocks things out, can't remember stuff. I'm not sure if it's an excuse for his current behavior, but I do know that he struggles SO much with his forgetfulness, impulsive and inmature behavior and makes choices without thinking clearly.
I'm so glad you mentioned that. It does make me feel better to have someone here acknowledge that may be part of his issue because i've been saying this for YEARS!

About a year ago I was having lunch with a girlfriend and my husband called me. He was in a RAGE, which isn't unusual when he is so frustrated. He had an appointment on the other side of town and the house was locked. Because he lost his garage door opener and his keys he coudldn't get in so he called me screaming and yelling and freaking out. The old me would have left my lunch and run to let him in, but i am so sick of doing that. When I got home from the lunch he had kicked the front door open, the frame around the door was completely broke off.
This is the craziness i've been living with, just one of the many, many instances.

Carol, lots of people have ADHD and it most certainly does not cause affairs. I know it is tempting to explain this all away with a mental illness, but it is not the cause of his affairs. Nor does it make any difference WHY he has affairs. If your husband is beating you up does it matter WHY he is doing it? Or is it important to remove yourself from his circle of abuse?

If your husband wanted to change, he would change. It is really that simple.

It is scary that you would stay with a spouse that is this destructive and dangerous. It is clear you are in denial, Carol. I am sorry anyone mentioned ADHD on this thread because I see you are anxious to use that as a new excuse to put off the inevitable. All you are doing is enabling your husband. You are helping him be a bad man and doing so at your own expense.

Carol, these steps are the only steps that will save your marriage. If your husband won't agree to this, your marriage won't make it:

I totally agree I have enabled his behavior Im not denying that at all. He isn't happy with all the choices he has made and hates himself for all the hurt he has caused. Im not in any way saying his affair has anything to do with whether he has ADHD or not! I'm just relating the fact that all of his behaviors and impulsiveness and relationship problems have led to a wall between us, obviously, which in turn he had an affair.
This man has never laid a hand on me. His reckless behavior is always directed at himself. I've never been physically abused by him, but definitely mental and verbal. I'm not in denial, i'm explaining my situation. I know what challenges I have in front of me and yes I have been an enabler and put up with more than most would have.

Carol, you do understand that his adultery is more abusive than physical assault? It is as traumatic as assault or rape. This is why when a spouse will not commit to a program of recovery that protects you from his destructive behavior that Dr Harley recommends separation. Women have nervous breakdowns and suffer years of post traumatic stress disorder from being in marriages like yours.

Did you read my list of things of what it will take to recover this marriage? All you have to do is take him that list and ask him if he will agree to it.

If that is the case, is he willing to go to any length to change his behavior and make just compensation to you?

Yes, I understand what you are saying Melodylane. I am going to print it out and give it to him. We both need help. We can't do this on our own. I realize this site says not to do counceling but I need to talk to a councelor and so does he seperately. He has already set an appointment for himself. 3 months ago he reached out to a minister in our church and talked to him.
I don't know if his behavior will change, I don't know what will happen. I know I am part of the problem with being an enabler and doing this dance back and fourth with him. He says he will do whatever he can to change and wants that for himself and for our family. Seeing a therapist may open up his heart and help him work on himself without me there nagging and enabling etc etc. Currently we are seperated in our home on different sides of the house. Because there are trust issues It gives me a small sense of ease if he is here while we start therapy rather than being in an apartment. I meet with a therapist next week. We still may need to seperate I don't know i'm very confused. He is also very confused lets not forget he just got caught less than a week ago so the affair he was having for a month is still fresh. I don't know if what we have is fixable, there has been alot of bad times. I'm not blaming adhd but I can definitely tell you it creates his instability.
I'm giving him a shot to change, we have never been to therapy before. We have two kids its worth a shot for them and we have been together married for 11 years, together 14. I am 36 he is 38.

Carol, therapy is a distraction when you could be working on your marriage, though. That is my point. I think therapy is nice, but what about your marriage? Your marriage is in critical condition and needs to be addressed. Therapy will not help you with that.

You do understand that Marriage Builders has the most effective plan of recovery in your situation? Many of us here are in fully recovered, romantic marriages because we followed Dr Harley's very specific plan of action.

What needs to take place NOW is that your husband needs to agree to the conditions that I outlined above.


Go show him the list and ASK him. That is how you know. You will know if he agrees to your conditions and then makes those changes. He can start making those changes today.

I would let him know that this is what it will take to keep you in this marriage. If he won't agree to those conditions, then Dr Harley would suggest that you separate. You are not separated if you live together. If he won't agree to all of those conditions I would ask him to move out.

Your husband does not need "therapy" to change. He needs to make a decision to change. He can do that today for free.

Waiting for therapy is a needless distraction when you could be working on your marriage.

I disagree. I guess this website isn't for me. I believe therapy helps TONS of people in a crisis situation. Depression and all sorts of other problems cannot always be handled by two people who have a printed out sheet of paper with a list of what should happen now. If it were that simple, we could all have the spouse we want. Sometimes you need a third party to help, especially when you've been through major trama, stress, emotional pain etc. And I believe that's what my husband and I have both been through and need help.

Carol, what I am giving you is not some "list" off the internet. It is a tried and true program developed by Dr Bill Harley, a clinical psychologist with 40 years experience saving marriages from infidelity. Many of us here are in fully recovered marriages today because of these steps. There are few therapists, counselors or pastors who have any idea how to save a marriage.

Marriage counselors, for example, have an 84% failure rate and have a higher personal divorce rate than the general population. They are destructive to marriages and have no plan to save your marriage. Individual counselors do not help your marriage either, because their goal is to help you achieve personal intiatives that are usually in conflict with the principles that will create a happy, fulfilled marriage. Counseling is a disraction from resolving your marriage problems.

The way to save your marriage is to change your behaviors as suggested by this program. It really does work. You don't need to go to a counselor to change poor behaviors.

Carol, here are Dr Harley's credentials:

Willard F. Harley, Jr., Ph.D