oh, ai, i'm so sorry. this is terrible news, and you must be heartbroken. TRT really needs a kick in the pants.

you didn't answer my Q. are you considering plan b?

you need to formulate your poly Qs and post them here (they are hard to come up with, because you can only get Yes/No answers). he needs to have the Qs in advance for an opportunity to come clean, which will also give you more clarity in the actual poly.

Thank you, BrainHurts, alis, Pep, NB28, loveisachoice, Letty, everybody...

It helps to know that at the very least, I'm not crazy. I can't believe how long he convinced me I was the problem, and how upside down and sideways and confused I've been.

I'm far from perfect.

But I'm not the problem.

No, I'm not considering plan B. I'm considering divorce if a satisfactory course of action is not embarked upon in the very near future.

I can't take much more of this. I am very close to done.

wow. ok. take a deep breath. i've stayed away from TRTs thread recently, so i don't know what his game/plan is. but you need to protect your lovebank before it gets sent to collections for being so overdrawn. his trickle truth is very bad for you, emotionally and mentally, and will kill your M if you keep yourself exposed to it.

if plan d is the right plan for you, then it's the right plan. but don't make any decision on that yet, unless you need to file to protect your assets and kids. gosh, i wish he wasn't on here, and i *hope* he doesn't read your thread.

from what you've posted, it doesn't sound like he is anywhere close to starting recovery. CAN you plan b? if for no other reason, to get space before you go plan d? will he willingly leave your home if you ask him to? i knew mine wouldn't; that i would have to go lockout.

you, ai, need to make yourself safe, as TRT obviously is failing massively at that. how near is the "very near future?" is that today? tomorrow? by monday? what will it take for you to consider staying? what will it take for you to call it quits? sometimes it helps to write out your thoughts here (i did some major rambling going through my sitch. this place gave me clarity!).

do you work? if so, can you call in and get monday off if needed? can someone take your kids? you can't figure stuff out too well with a lot of other responsibilities. a few hours break would help a lot, and give you time to take any action you deem necessary. i wouldn't allow TRT to take up that time though. it's for you.

Here, my friend.
betrayed spouses.......JUST BE STILL

ai, your WH *is* reading your thread. this is of no help to you at all. you need to:

1. change your password
2. change your member/screen name
3. then change the title of your thread.
4. even better: let this thread die and start a new one.

frankly, i don't know if any of that will help (can a longer term poster pitch in there?). he is scheming and conniving. he can simply go through the threads until he finds you again.

you cannot clarify your thoughts and make a plan if he is heading you off at the pass.

please do this asap, for your own sake. it'll be important for YOU.

i am very worried for you right now. hang in there, sister.

There is Plan B when the hope is for reconciliation. Plan B love letter, describes a pathway back home to the marriage, etc.

There is also a sort of Plan B when the goal is divorce.
That Plan B does not write any letter, does not outline a path back home.
The divorce Plan B is strictly to maintain your sanity & peace while your divorce is pending.

Let us know if you make some sort of decision.
We are willing to help either way.

I haven't made any decisions. I'm in limbo.

It's very strange. I can't even really feel this pain right now. It's all boxed up and put away, because I'm bracing for the next emotional sucker punch. The rug has been ripped out from under me so many times since the beginning of May that there's no way I can believe there's not more coming.

I told him what I need to feel safe and be willing to recover. I gave him specific steps that would achieve that. Now I wait. But not for very much longer.

Thank you.

We've been together since just after I turned 19.

98% of my adult life has been a lie.

That is so intensely violating I can't even form a thought process or a feeling about it.

I want to believe he is capable and willing to change and make things right. But we all know what believing has gotten me so far.

And so I wait.

Sorry. I don't even know what I'm saying. Just trying to work through the thoughts in my head.

You are moving in the right direction Al. Can you feel the sense of control over your own life that you now have?

That was the beginning of finding my own peace...knowing that I had taken control of how I would be treated going forward and that I was not crazy.

Having a Plan gives you control...stick to your plan no matter what he throws in your face...stick to your plan.

(((((hugs))))

Sorry, I just realized I never answered this. This conditions that allowed his affairs to happen are...just about everything. Internet. Cell phones. Work. Going out with 'friends' by himself, and actually being somewhere else. Mostly the fact that he's always been quite sure he could make me believe ANYTHING if he just talked hard enough and emotionally abused me until I dropped it. He is the king of 'a good offense is the best defense'. Independent behaviour has been his way of life.

The new PA other woman does live nearby. I insisted we cut off contact when I caught the affair (which he downplayed as an EA). I realize I can't be sure now that no contact really occurred. No contact was broken two years ago when her brother died and we had to see (but didn't speak to) her atthe funeral. Then again this past October when she was a guest at my husband's brother's wedding. I had to see her skanky, evil face while I chased our three kids around and my husband stood up there and was the BEST MAN.

My life has become so insane it's surreal.

This is temporary Al.


No matter the outcome, you will come out of this a stronger and wiser person. Aim your thoughts in that direction and how you will get there.



Take care of yourself.

Thank you. He's still trying to make me think I'm crazy.
This is ugly.

AI,

Do you have the strength to file for separation and divorce.

Because if you do, it is time. Your husband is not willing to actually change, only to convince others that he has.

He is a manipulator but not a master manipulator, that is for sure. He is still lying. You will drive yourself insane and become a broken shattered image of your former self if you continue to endure his abuse.

It's time, AI.

What is he saying you are "crazy" about now. "Crazy" is a term that wayward men use to describe women who are demanding accountability (I suppose it's the wayward female equivalent of "controlling").

You have his number dialed now.

You are not crazy.

You are now in control over what you will engage.

This is getting ridiculous.

After making a big deal out of how CRAZY and beyond the pale my list of requirements is (list posted earlier on this thread), he's now saying he is reluctantly, resentfully, ANGRILY willing to meet them all.

But that I shouldn't expect him to be happy about it.
And I should be able to see how forcing him to do these things creates a 'master and slave dynamic'.
And I should be willing to guarantee him of what I'm going to do if he meets them all.
And that he doesn't trust me not to forcing him to jump through all these hoops just so I can ditch him on the other side.
And that maybe we should separate until the polygraph is done.
And that people would think I was insane of they knew what I was asking him to do.
And a variety of other personal attacks. About my actions throughout our relationship. Downplaying the devastation he has caused. Telling me my shortcomings and vengefulness are the reason he's not enthused about this.
Insisting that no, he's not manipulating me.
Insisting that he really does want to be here, and that he's sorry for what he's done.
But that I shouldn't expect him to be happy about doing any of this work.

I'm very calm.
I told him I understand it must be scary to embark on such a difficult journey with no complete assurance that it will be happily ever after.
But that I'm committed to building a great marriage with him once I'm given assurance by means of polygraph that the lies and secrets are all finally done.
That it's even more devastating now that I know how much he's lied to me while we were supposed to be recovering, and it's not rational for me to believe him when he says (AGAIN!) that I finally have the whole story of his infidelity.
That I don't for a second believe that, with a full knowledge ofthe breadth and scope of his lies and infidelity, that ANYBODY would think I'm insane for wanting a polygraph before we try to rebuild.
I told him I'm more than happy to hear any respectful requests he has, because I want to make him as happy and comfortable as possible as we go forward.
I told him I'm ready and willing to drop the affair talk as soon as he passes a poly, so that we can focus on building something great.
I told him I WANT to meet his needs, and I want the happy life I'm sure we COULD create.
I told him I still want this to work, but he should rationally be able to see why I can't settle for empty promises after all the trickle truth and manipulation.

He hasn't heard ANY of it. He's sticking to his guns.

Does reluctant compliance ever actually lead to actual understanding? It's like he just doesn't GET THIS. At all.

Thank you. I'm doing my best.

I see.
He's pulling my leg too.

Here is how I would respond. Over & over. And smile, because you are beautiful when you smile.

"I'm so happy you don't want to be a slave, because I will never be your master.
The really GREAT thing is, you don't have to do anything I ask you to do.
The really GREAT thing is, you can say "No". You have a choice. You are free to make your choice, and I am free to make mine. No slave & master here. Not ever. I'm not even going to try and convince you about which choice I think you should make. It is totally up to you. If you decide my requests are unreasonable, you are lucky because you do not have to do anything I ask."

END of conversation.
If he wants to fight about it, say: " You are free to make the choice best for you. I'll leave you with your thoughts."

WALK AWAY !


His bad temper makes him a poor risk for recovery.