Good girl.

Instead of counseling I would say you want him to work the MB program (coaching or online program).

So you aren't home with him?

When they go through withdrawal they can be real grumpy. He must follow ALL of your conditions or you will surely be in a false recovery.

No, I'm not at home until I see that nc letter. Possibly not even immediately after that.
We're trying to get money together for MB. His counselor did mention marriage builders principles to him, especially in terms of his boundaries, that's why he got the book so far.
MB definitely has to be the foundation if we can move forward, depending on his decision re the nc letter.

Hi all. Nothing has happened, just kind of down. Its my 30th birthday tomorrow, and our IM is gone, bc he thinks I should be talking to H now as H wants to try to reconcile and is seriously thinking about how he's writing the nc letter. (not good enough for me)
The buyers for the house just bailed, the real estate agent tried for over an hour yesterday to ask me to stop making mortgage payments to force a short sale until I basically hanged up on her, and my stress level is just astounding.
My friend took me for a pedi yesterday for my bday (my nails are a dark periwinkle blue - very trendy and fun, something I never try) and my parents are taking me to a major city to hang out tonight and tomorrow.

I appreciate it all, just so stressed and sad. Before the IM left he said H says he's not signing anything as he wants to work things out.
Last week I thought I had such a plan, now I feel like I'll just be in plan b emptiness for the foreseeable future.

Happy Birthday tomorrow.

Sorry about the house.

Can you find a new IM? It sounds like he is causing you too much stress. The IM is supposed to filter. No wonder you're down.

Love the nails by the way.

I have to find a new IM, that one is no longer willing to be.
I don't even know where to start as everyone I can think of to ask is telling me to run. I don't ask, but I'm certain that's what they are thinking even if they don't say it any more.

You just need someone who is willing to be a filter. Tell them you need this for you so you don't have to deal with the pain and drama from him.

So he complied with what I needed re the letter, so I saw him this week, last night actually to hang out. Things were tense, but not awful.
We made plans this weekend as well.
Then this morning he texted to let me know she texted him to leave his car open so that she could leave him a shirt he left. He didn't respond, I thought that was good. (I can see the text in the phone records, see he didn't respond)
But now he asks me if I have somewhere to be this weekend bc he needs space.
I told him he doesn't get space if he wants to try. He said he wants to see me, but he needs some time.
I'm not wrong, am I?
What do I do? I haven't agreed to move home or try yet. But this makes me feel like hell, I literally could not breath after I got the text that he needs space.
I explained how I was feeling, he said if isn't the case that he's dismissing me or trying to make me feel insecure, he just needs time.
My stomach is in knots.

He wrote you a letter but you need actions. What ACTIONS has he met of your conditions.

Why hasn't he changed his number?
NC for life with OW?
Wrote a NC letter?

Needing space means he wants to cake eat. He's not serious.
Why didn't you run it by us before you saw him?

I'm sorry, I mean he wrote the NC letter and stated his desire for NC for life with her as my main condition to see him (as well as the other conditions he met such as transparency with fb/email/phone/not going out alone) and we sent it to her. She contacted him about the shirt afterwards, he did not reply or comply - he left his truck locked.
I did not ask him to change his phone as all of his work contacts have it and I felt that as long as I can monitor it, which I can, it's fine.
And I did feel it was fine, especially as I can see he didn't answer her text, until the space request came up.
I haven't moved home or committed to anything with him...does this mean I should plan B again? Because he hasn't done anything wrong really, so how do I address that?

Ok gotcha.

So he gave you all his passwords or said he would?

I would have his number changed because she didn't take the NC letter serious and contacted him anyway. OW are relentless.

His work contacts can easily be told.

You can't recover unless there is NC for life with OW.

What other conditions do you have? Did you ever get a new IM?

He gave me all of his pw, I've checked everything, all is legit so far. His NC letter did state NC forever.
I do not have other immediate conditions besides transparency and NC, only because I am not certain about trying. He already said he is going to apologize to my family also, regardless.
I didn't end up with an new IM because he drafted the letter and the old IMsent it to me even after he said he was done, and then I agreed to meet him after I read the letter (the IM sent all of the pw as well).
I will think about the phone number, seems you are right about that.

Should I be in plan B, or see how things go? I don't understand why he would write an NC letter and then want space, unless this is false and he didn't mean the letter of course.

What is the plan to eliminate the conditions that allowed the affair to happen?

Please read these so you're educated on what to look for.
Requirements for recovery from an affair
False Recovery need voices of experience

And another.
False Recovery

I did read those, thank you.

I do know what he feels lead to the affair, and I know everything I want to know at this point about his relationship with her in the affair. He has answered my questions.
I think the sticking point is that he doesn't talk much, he has to process then talk.
For example I said to him that him processing alone is destructive and is something that lead to the affair, and he said he knows, but that he doesn't like sharing with me, never has. So I said well, you said you wanted to share everything with her, do you know why there is a difference and how could we work on that together? And he said he just always felt that way with her and never has with me. Which is true, most times he was drunk when he was really open with me.
I'm trying to follow the MB principles, trying to watch out for false R signs.
I'm on my phone, I wil add more in a bit.
Thanks.

I would also make a condition to work the MB program either by coaching or the online program.

I did speak to him about it, he agreed with the principles and agreed to follow them, we are going to work online.
However, he is still shutting down when he doesn't want to talk any longer.
He says I am attacking him. I am working on that, and eliminating lb, because I do tend to be forceful when I don't understand something.
Right now, he has boundaries that are not acceptable in our marriage (he doesnt want to talk to me about things yet, like his feelings. He wants to talk to his guy friends.) and even though he agrees he shouldn't have them, he refuses not to until he can see some change. I feel like i'm keeping my walls until I see some of his changes...I don't know how to start and take baby steps. I'm not much of a baby step person w things though i know we must start somewhere. I'm super angry that he feels he gets any boundaries, especially admitting he knows it's not the right way to be but that he's angry w me. I feel like he is blaming me for him not being able to talk about things, some of which is true at times, but mostly is just him being unwilling to change his behavior. I tried to nicely tell him this, he didn't answer.
So, how do I start?

I would call the coaching center and have them give you a plan. They will also work with your WH and that can show you.

I haven't yet had an opportunity, still trying to get money together.
Just don't feel like he has the capacity to do this. I feel like he thinks he wants to, but I don't think he feels whatever he needs to feel to really walk this difficult road. He keeps saying he's caused me enough pain, and if I want him to sign the papers he will. I want him to say he'll work hard. So if I say that, he says well I wouldn't be here if I didn't want this to work and I do want it to work, but I don't want to hurt you further when there are no guarantees.
I don't understand that. I mean, there weren't guarantees on our wedding day either and we basically vowed to figure it out together. So although we have been through this, I don't see why this day is so different, we simply have more information about how we both chose to deal with things. I feel like now that we know aren't we in a better position in some ways than that day? Am I being naive?

This is a DJ, my friend.

How are you talking to him?

If he feels like you're always on him. How is he going to want to work on it?

Are you stopping all lovebusters? You need to clean up your side.