So my husband is having an affair but I would still like to save the marriage. I have confronted him and he still denies the affair. He doesn't deny that they are friend but won't admit to the affair (whatever). I have tried to talk to him about it and he say that their friendship is no big deal. He totally does the whole flip flop thing between me and the other woman, until recently. Last Friday I caught him in another lie to cover things up. I couldn't take it anymore. I told him that I wanted him to leave. All of this has been going on for a little over 2 months and I can't take anymore emotionally. But I do still really want to save the marriage. He and I haven't spoken since last Friday (a little over a week) except for one time and with the exception of some texts back and forth about our daughter. As much as I want to work things out I felt like I didn't have a choice but to tell him to leave and stop talking to him. At this point he doesn't seem to concerned with talking to me but it seem like he thinks he wants to have his cake and eat it too. Maybe he would be happy to leave things the way they are forever. I have talked to a lawyer about separation papers just so I can protect myself. He also gives me the impression that he thinks I am just gonna sit around and wait for him. Am I crazy? Should I just give up?

Hi CArrie, welcome to Marriage Builders. What evidence do you have of the affair? Who is this woman? Is she married?

Never mind. I see we answered your questions back in May. Did you follow our advice?

Welcome Carrie and I'm sorry for what has brought you here.

You are not crazy.

Your first order of business is to SNOOP. You mention not talking to him, does that mean he is out of the home? Do not confront him with what you find yet, because it will tip your hand.

There is an Operation Investigation forum here with a lot of valuable information about snooping. Also ask any questions here on this thread, there are many people who can answer the technicalities of how to do keyloggers, get information off of phones, VAR's, etc.

What MB advice have you followed since you visited in May?
Has the affair been exposed to family friends and employer?

Oh thank you ML I just caught up on this posters previous thread.

Carrie it seems you have gotten no where in the last month+. Are you starting a new thread to try and get different advice? It will not happen as the advice you are receiving on this forum should be based on the Marriage Builders program. And you have had the best of the best posting to you in the form of MelodyLane.

Are you ready to get to work this time?

If you want to be respected by your husband and others you need to start standing up for yourself and your Marriage

I am not sure what snooping I should do. I have phone records showing that they text all the time. I found out where she lived and one night when he said he was working I drove to her house and of course found his truck. I haven't found them in bed together but even if for some strange reason they aren't sleeping together their relationship is still completely inappropriate. I also sent the OW an email and told her I knew what was going on and that it needed to stop.

Carrie if you found them at her house and have proof they text constantly - what more proof do you need?!

Do you think you need to catch them smack bang in the act before you expose?

That is at the very least an EA and I'd bet my life savings its a PA. Its down to him to end it and tell you which type of A it is with a polygraph. After exposure.

You don't need DNA evidence for a jury. You just need to expose.

Read the exposure link in Mels thread and come back here for a detailed exposure plan to blow the roof off this A.

Install snooping methods anyway though. Usually after exposure the first thing they do is call/visit the AP.

In your other thread you said you wanted to leave and go to your parents.

I wouldn't. Stand your ground for now and kick him out if you need to go into Plan B.

He needs to see some consequences and to lose his family and home.

Why should YOU, the innocent party, have to leave?

You can have your parents to stay if you need them close.

Why haven't you snooped and obtained the evidence of the affair?

What other snooping should I do. I know something is going on. I am already so crushed by this the last thing I want to read is their emails or text messages back and forth. Can I just go to plan b. As much as I want to work things out right the idea of not talking to him is good. Everytime we talk he just hurts he in some way.

Well if you have the proof have you exposed?

Another excellent radio clip on the importance of exposure and why. Dr. Harley also explains all the steps that need to be taken to recover from an affair.
Radio clip on steps to take to revover from an Affair

Carrie, you must avoid being led by your emotions. We have a logical plan for you to follow, and it will be easier on you to just follow it than anything else you can do. However if you let your emotions rule you, you will just get pinged about like a pin ball. Up one day, down the next.

Plan B is not far away. It is indeed a sanctuary and you WILL feel better.

However a rushed or ineffective Plan B is a terrible idea. It takes a bit of time to prepare for. If you do one that's easy for him to break - you wont be 'dark' and he wont take you seriously. (click the link in my sig for preparation advice)

Until you go into Plan B, you must Plan A right up until Plan B is ready. Believe me, you only feel this way because you have been in the torture of Plan C/False Recovery for months. If you do a Plan A right, even if only for a few days, it is empowering.

When you are in Plan B, you will look back and doubt how well you did when you tried to save the marriage. Everyone does. you will wonder whether he misses you/whether he should. Doing a short, effective Plan A before going dark prevents those doubts torturing you later on.

I understand that you may find it hard to see the emails. But do you really think they are any worse than your imagination?

Get a PI to deal with the evidence side of things if you'd rather. But you must take action and not be ruled by fear.

I would also suggest you see your doctor about anti depressants. Plan C has been rough on you and ADs will give you some clarity to fight for survival and keep your head up until you are able to get into a dark Plan B.

I am completely emotionally drain. At this point he seems happier not to talk to me. Even though less than 2 weeks ago he was telling me that he loved me. That is what is so hard. The last day that we all spent together was so nice. It felt so normal. If I exposed him to his work he will get fired and he doesn't speak to his family so I can't expose him to them. I want to work this out but maybe he really doesn't.

Carrie this is straight out of the wayward handbook.

If he keeps you guessing, keeps you going in circles - you will get tired and drained, right?

To drained to snoop and bust up his affair - which is what is happening. His tactic is working.

Stop watching him and judging his reactions RIGHT NOW. What he says/does/thinks/wants DOES NOT MATTER.

People in affairs are like hooked and stupid, like drunks. You wouldnt react so - or believe the words of a drunk, would you? You would just ignore it as nonsense.

If he says he loves you - lie

If he says he hates you - lie

Stop listening to wayward nonsense and work YOUR plan.

If he gets on board (with ACTIONS, not silly words) great, If he doesnt you'll be in Plan B.

I would seriosly consider those ADs and stop your ears with cotton wool whenever he talks. consider stock replies to the drunken rambling like 'Hmm interesting. Do you want a cookie?'

If he doesnt talk, fantastic. You have work to do.

Please snap out of this mindset.

He's a wayward. He has no idea what he wants and his opinions and thoughts do not matter to your plan at all.

We are only interested in you and your plan.

Please listen to Indie. She's right. Waywards become completely different people from the way they were before. It's uncanny how drastically they will change. The thoughts are no longer rational; they often become hateful. They suddenly reject everything they once loved and held dear.

This is all NORMAL behavior for a foggy wayward. You have to look at your H as though he's an alien. Be the best actress you can be. Pull yourself back emotionally so that you are always pleasant, like you would have to be if you were on the job as a customer rep to a very difficult customer. He is akin to a drunk. You wouldn't pay attention to a drunk, right? They ramble and act stupid and that's what you expect. Waywardness is no different.

Even though you are hurting beyond measure, this is the best tactic for you to take. Doing things the MB way will hurt LESS than the alternative and will eventually bring you serenity.

You will be better off emotionally and physically if you go to your doctor and get some mild depression or antianxiety medication. They will really help you get through this. It's not forever and they won't change you or make you feel drugged. They just help your brain work better and will help drag you out of the black hole.

It is so true. He is a completely different person. He definitely doesn't seem to care about anything important. He goes for several day without even a call or text to just check on our daughter. That is the kind of stuff I am so shocked by. We have had several conversations over the last few months and in spite of the fact that the talk seemed to go well of course nothing changes for long.... I know shocking right. I feel I don't have a choice but to go to plan B. I am going to give my doctor a call today about getting on some medication. You guys are completely right about my emotions. They are out of control and consuming me. Most nights I don't sleep and am not eating. I need something to help me.

OK, sort the ADs out first.

We need to get you into MB warrior shape.

Then your priorities are as follows

1) Eat - whenever and whatever. Make a rule to bite something, (anything) whenever you feel anxious and your mind starts spinning. Bananas or nuts are good. As you chew say (silently!)'I am working my plan. I am having a bite'.
2) If you cant sleep, nap. If you cant nap, lie down and rest, breathing deeply to the pit of your stomach (This really can be enough, I didnt sleep for four days in Plan A). Drink lots of water too.
3) Install your snooping tools
4) Draw up your exposure plan. Read the exposure thread and then post here for guidance on how to proceed.