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Great work, Hill! I would say it sounds like you are right on the money.

You will find that after it has been "a long time" (that could be a few days, or a few weeks) since you have been disrespectful, things show some signs of changing.


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Originally Posted by markos
Great work, Hill! I would say it sounds like you are right on the money.

You will find that after it has been "a long time" (that could be a few days, or a few weeks) since you have been disrespectful, things show some signs of changing.

Yep sure hope so. We spend more time than we ever have together and I can honestly say after being her 4th or 5th choice to hang out with I'm back to #1. I just need to turn the "best buddy" time into "best romantic buddy" time, and I cannot do that if I continue to DJ my wife.

I think in the past I would keep that scoreboard that said if she can DJ me then it'll be even if I DJ her. She can DJ me all she wants is what I've decided, but it doesn't mean I'll do it back. At some point she'll see that she has no reason to DJ me.


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Originally Posted by Hilltopper1972
For example I sent her a text 10 mins ago about working out together, then put kids down, then massage, then xoxo! After texting all morning back and forth, I got no response from this text.

Well if you specified the xoxo then she may be feeling pressure she doesn't like. I know some women who feel like their men (and I have NO idea whether or not YOU do) have badgered them for SF get really sensitive about any suggestion for SF. I'm just saying maybe try to do something like a massage without any expectations a couple times. I know this will be difficult but maybe your wife might need it to feel loved? You know physical affection that doesn't lead to SF?


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Originally Posted by JessicaGC
Originally Posted by Hilltopper1972
For example I sent her a text 10 mins ago about working out together, then put kids down, then massage, then xoxo! After texting all morning back and forth, I got no response from this text.

Well if you specified the xoxo then she may be feeling pressure she doesn't like. I know some women who feel like their men (and I have NO idea whether or not YOU do) have badgered them for SF get really sensitive about any suggestion for SF. I'm just saying maybe try to do something like a massage without any expectations a couple times. I know this will be difficult but maybe your wife might need it to feel loved? You know physical affection that doesn't lead to SF?

We are well past that stage in this journey and there was a time yes that I definitely DJ'd my wife about SF. She has made it clear that she wants me to ask for things, SF being one of them. This doesn't mean that she won't say no and I've learned(am learning) how to deal with that. The act itself is typically very "chore-like" which hurts me deeply but I think will change when she crosses that threshold of love.


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Originally Posted by Hilltopper1972
We are well past that stage in this journey and there was a time yes that I definitely DJ'd my wife about SF. She has made it clear that she wants me to ask for things, SF being one of them. This doesn't mean that she won't say no and I've learned(am learning) how to deal with that. The act itself is typically very "chore-like" which hurts me deeply but I think will change when she crosses that threshold of love.

Yes it is very hard to deal with "no". I'm learning that myself. But keep up the good work with the no DJ's. Hopefully it will make all the difference.

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Hill, I'm sure you've been told this but while you may not be able to control how you feel, you do control how you respond. A simple, "I understand that you're upset, if you'd like to talk about it, I'd love to listen." Leave it there. If she snaps at you, repeat, "I understand that you're upset but please do not snap at me/raise your voice at me/speak down to me/"etc (whatever it is). You do not snap at her, yell at her, disrespect her, etc.

You simply verify how she is feeling, let her know you are open to discuss, but you will not be treated or spoken to poorly. My wife used to be the queen of speaking disrespectfully to me. It is very rare that that she is anymore and it gets nipped in the bud quickly. However I can't respond to her ina jerk tone telling her not to treat me like a jerk. YOu have to lead the example.


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Originally Posted by kilted_thrower
Hill, I'm sure you've been told this but while you may not be able to control how you feel, you do control how you respond. A simple, "I understand that you're upset, if you'd like to talk about it, I'd love to listen." Leave it there. If she snaps at you, repeat, "I understand that you're upset but please do not snap at me/raise your voice at me/speak down to me/"etc (whatever it is). You do not snap at her, yell at her, disrespect her, etc.

You simply verify how she is feeling, let her know you are open to discuss, but you will not be treated or spoken to poorly. My wife used to be the queen of speaking disrespectfully to me. It is very rare that that she is anymore and it gets nipped in the bud quickly. However I can't respond to her ina jerk tone telling her not to treat me like a jerk. YOu have to lead the example.

Yes that is what I'm doing is leading by example. Small example just now. I was cleaning up after a messy dinner last night and put a yogurt our 18 mo old was eating in the fridge and failed to put tin foil on it. I was just home for lunch and my wife said, "Do you really think baby will eat this now since there was no foil on this?" She wasn't asking a question mind you and she has left baby's food on counter, in cars, and everywhere else every day for a year. I just figured she is a busy mom with three kids and it's intense and if you leave some thing out and it goes bad then that is just part of life so I never say anything to her about it. I did it just this one time and she sent a snide comment my way. My heart told me to point out her hypocrisy and ask her who she thought she was to be the pot calling the kettle black. I did not. I just apologized. The way I view the world is that people can behave anyway they want, but the moment they cross the line into the hypocrisy zone it really irks me. I tend to take the path of least resistance I suppose. My solution to seeing something left out that is bad is to just throw it away. My wife sees thing differently, she wants to point it out and sometimes do it with disrespect. I have no problem letting her know when something bothers me, but for now I need to work on eliminating my DJs for a week or two before I add another step.


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Hill, you might find that as your DJs go down in frequency, hers will too. Also, as her love bank fills it could get better.

Sometimes when my H and I are having a rough time, I find myself pointing out everything that he is doing wrong. It's sort of a passive aggressive way to try to make the other person feel as bad as we do. It's a terrible habit but it's hard to admit to it in the moment.

I find that if my H responds negatively, I feel justified in being negative. If he doesn't, I feel guilty afterward.

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Good job. But if you feel her comment is snide and a swipe at you, then it's okay to point that out.

"Oh I'm sorry, I'll remember foil when I put foods in the fridge from now on. Next time I'd appreciate it if you just stated your request. I feel insulted by the way you brought that to my attention." Then tell her you love her and ask her how her day was.


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Originally Posted by kilted_thrower
Good job. But if you feel her comment is snide and a swipe at you, then it's okay to point that out.

"Oh I'm sorry, I'll remember foil when I put foods in the fridge from now on. Next time I'd appreciate it if you just stated your request. I feel insulted by the way you brought that to my attention." Then tell her you love her and ask her how her day was.

I don't know about this kilted_thrower. After all she isn't fully on board with MB and assuming that she meant that comment as an insult could be a DJ? I think I'm right in that. Considering that he is trying to FILL not DEPLETE her love bank so he can get her on board with this plan I don't know that responding that way would be effective at the moment.

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Originally Posted by Penni4Thoughts
Hill, you might find that as your DJs go down in frequency, hers will too. Also, as her love bank fills it could get better.

Sometimes when my H and I are having a rough time, I find myself pointing out everything that he is doing wrong. It's sort of a passive aggressive way to try to make the other person feel as bad as we do. It's a terrible habit but it's hard to admit to it in the moment.

I find that if my H responds negatively, I feel justified in being negative. If he doesn't, I feel guilty afterward.

So true. That really resonates. I've seen the aftermath both ways. I've seen when I don't react, she always come back to me and do something nice for/to me. If I do react poorly she never apologizes and we continue the conflict.


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Originally Posted by JessicaGC
I don't know about this kilted_thrower. After all she isn't fully on board with MB and assuming that she meant that comment as an insult could be a DJ? I think I'm right in that. Considering that he is trying to FILL not DEPLETE her love bank so he can get her on board with this plan I don't know that responding that way would be effective at the moment.

I understand what you're saying, but this isn't an MB specific thing. Hill feels disrespected by the way his wife is talking down to him.

Think about if your husband were to say to you, "you're silly for thinking like that." Well, you'd feel insulted. He might not have meant it as an insult and doesn't view it as an insult. However, out of respect for you when you tell him you feel insulted when he says that to you, he should stop.

If she tries to argue with him, that's okay. He then simply says, "I'm simply telling you how I feel and nothing more." Then he changes the subject. So he can continue to feel insulted over and over again and she continues her disrespectful interaction and he eventually blows up or he can do drive by honesty.



My wife is notorious for setting stuff down and then forgetting where she put it. I kept saying to her, "if you'd just put your keys on the key holder, then you'd know where they are." She finally said, "You know, I don't like it when you tell me that." I didn't feel my comment was disrespectful. But she did. And that's what matters. So I quit saying it to her.

Last edited by kilted_thrower; 07/09/12 03:05 PM.

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Originally Posted by JessicaGC
Originally Posted by kilted_thrower
Good job. But if you feel her comment is snide and a swipe at you, then it's okay to point that out.

"Oh I'm sorry, I'll remember foil when I put foods in the fridge from now on. Next time I'd appreciate it if you just stated your request. I feel insulted by the way you brought that to my attention." Then tell her you love her and ask her how her day was.

I don't know about this kilted_thrower. After all she isn't fully on board with MB and assuming that she meant that comment as an insult could be a DJ? I think I'm right in that. Considering that he is trying to FILL not DEPLETE her love bank so he can get her on board with this plan I don't know that responding that way would be effective at the moment.

That is correct, if I didn't convey that very well, I will now. She meant it 100% as a DJ. Secondly since she is not on board with MB, but knows the lingo since she participated in the forums for about 3 months, she'll get a bad taste in her mouth that I'm preaching. I'm kind of trying to do the MB program incognito.


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Originally Posted by kilted_thrower
Originally Posted by JessicaGC
I don't know about this kilted_thrower. After all she isn't fully on board with MB and assuming that she meant that comment as an insult could be a DJ? I think I'm right in that. Considering that he is trying to FILL not DEPLETE her love bank so he can get her on board with this plan I don't know that responding that way would be effective at the moment.

I understand what you're saying, but this isn't an MB specific thing. Hill feels disrespected by the way his wife is talking down to him.

Think about if your husband were to say to you, "you're silly for thinking like that." Well, you'd feel insulted. He might not have meant it as an insult and doesn't view it as an insult. However, out of respect for you when you tell him you feel insulted when he says that to you, he should stop.

If she tries to argue with him, that's okay. He then simply says, "I'm simply telling you how I feel and nothing more." Then he changes the subject. So he can continue to feel insulted over and over again and she continues her disrespectful interaction and he eventually blows up or he can do drive by honesty.



My wife is notorious for setting stuff down and then forgetting where she put it. I kept saying to her, "if you'd just put your keys on the key holder, then you'd know where they are." She finally said, "You know, I don't like it when you tell me that." I didn't feel my comment was disrespectful. But she did. And that's what matters. So I quit saying it to her.

A lot of truth here. We've had issues in the past where my wife doesn't respect the way I might feel about something. It is exactly as if to say, "you're stupid for feeling that way." In this particular case she could tell I felt insulted and followed it up with the usual, "I didn't mean it that way" comment. She has tougher skin than I do for sure, she grew in what I would consider an extremely disrespectful environment, and I've seen her mother insult her in some horrible ways and follow it up with a very matter of fact, "so would you like a cup of tea?" She calls me hyper-sensitive, but I consider myself quite normal and a person who knows the difference between an insult and a non-insult.


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That is correct, if I didn't convey that very well, I will now. She meant it 100% as a DJ. Secondly since she is not on board with MB, but knows the lingo since she participated in the forums for about 3 months, she'll get a bad taste in her mouth that I'm preaching. I'm kind of trying to do the MB program incognito.
Since she knows the lingo, and was participating for awhile, it is possible she knows she's being demanding/disrespectful. It is possible that she's testing you, to see if you have really stopped the DJs on your part, or if you're going to revert to your old habits and lash out at her again.



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Originally Posted by Prisca
Quote
That is correct, if I didn't convey that very well, I will now. She meant it 100% as a DJ. Secondly since she is not on board with MB, but knows the lingo since she participated in the forums for about 3 months, she'll get a bad taste in her mouth that I'm preaching. I'm kind of trying to do the MB program incognito.
Since she knows the lingo, and was participating for awhile, it is possible she knows she's being demanding/disrespectful. It is possible that she's testing you, to see if you have really stopped the DJs on your part, or if you're going to revert to your old habits and lash out at her again.

Perhaps subconsciously. She is just kind of abrasive you know? Always has been and admits it readily. There are levels of DJs and although she DJs me quite frequently, my retaliations were the "meant to hurt and sting you" kind. I'm ashamed to say I have a gift for that which I am avoiding at all costs.


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Originally Posted by markos
As an alternative to ignoring her mood, I would say focus on learning to be calm regardless of her mood. Her moods and feelings are important for you to recognize and respond to! It's just important that if she gets emotional, you do not become upset, or worse, abusive (demanding/disrespectful/angry). Even if she becomes abusive.

Everything i had said prior to this comment was a practical way of saying the same thing really just alot more descriptive ... something you could grasp and DO. My approach was not for him to IGNORE her feelings as you think I was saying .. but rather not let it bother him so much (yes i understand she will expect a response but it should be a laid back response and not return her outbursts for an outburst of his own)IE: Roll with the punches.

Take notes on her PMS time (i found this very important so I could pre determine he bad moods) ... etc ... and prepare for those times mentally and give your wife some grace for those times. I also mentioned that Hills wife would test him to see if his new "im not going to let your emotional outbursts effect me" attitude is real or not .. this "testing period" may last for a while until she feels its really true.

(re read my practical approach to rolling with the punches on page 139) that Approach works like this for me now ..

-2 weeks of "my wife can hardly keep her hands off me"
-1 week of "im the most horrible jerk in the world and DONT even think about touching me"
-1 Week of HER sucking up for her terrible emotional outbursts with TONS of thank yous for not letting it get to me and not putting up with her emotionally charged PMS week and not taking things she said seriously during that time as she says herself "during my PMS week i often dont realy know what i want and get mad for the silliest of reasons and later regret getting mad at all". I get constantly thanked for not being so sensitive anymore .. and Rolling with the punches when i dont get my needs met in a timely manner. That approach (written on page 139) allows me to be more in control of myself rather then let my unmet needs create an emotional outburst. This is me though .. and its working great for us. Combine that with the MB principals and we have GOLD! (my wife is MADLY in love with me now BTW and loves this approach that I have incorporated into myself)

Keep up the good work Hill, hopefully things turn around for you ... Keep the DJs from coming out .. stop projecting desperate energy towards your wife in regards to SF and things WILL turn around.

MNG

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Originally Posted by MrNiceGuy
Originally Posted by markos
As an alternative to ignoring her mood, I would say focus on learning to be calm regardless of her mood. Her moods and feelings are important for you to recognize and respond to! It's just important that if she gets emotional, you do not become upset, or worse, abusive (demanding/disrespectful/angry). Even if she becomes abusive.

Everything i had said prior to this comment was a practical way of saying the same thing really just alot more descriptive ... something you could grasp and DO. My approach was not for him to IGNORE her feelings as you think I was saying .. but rather not let it bother him so much (yes i understand she will expect a response but it should be a laid back response and not return her outbursts for an outburst of his own)IE: Roll with the punches.

Take notes on her PMS time (i found this very important so I could pre determine he bad moods) ... etc ... and prepare for those times mentally and give your wife some grace for those times. I also mentioned that Hills wife would test him to see if his new "im not going to let your emotional outbursts effect me" attitude is real or not .. this "testing period" may last for a while until she feels its really true.

(re read my practical approach to rolling with the punches on page 139) that Approach works like this for me now ..

-2 weeks of "my wife can hardly keep her hands off me"
-1 week of "im the most horrible jerk in the world and DONT even think about touching me"
-1 Week of HER sucking up for her terrible emotional outbursts with TONS of thank yous for not letting it get to me and not putting up with her emotionally charged PMS week and not taking things she said seriously during that time as she says herself "during my PMS week i often dont realy know what i want and get mad for the silliest of reasons and later regret getting mad at all". I get constantly thanked for not being so sensitive anymore .. and Rolling with the punches when i dont get my needs met in a timely manner. That approach (written on page 139) allows me to be more in control of myself rather then let my unmet needs create an emotional outburst. This is me though .. and its working great for us. Combine that with the MB principals and we have GOLD! (my wife is MADLY in love with me now BTW and loves this approach that I have incorporated into myself)

Keep up the good work Hill, hopefully things turn around for you ... Keep the DJs from coming out .. stop projecting desperate energy towards your wife in regards to SF and things WILL turn around.

MNG

Interesting. I'd say PMS week is a few days away then, so I'll watch out for it!


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Its like a swing of a pendulum. 2 weeks it swings in my favor the other 2 weeks its not.

BTW heres how i track the PMS. Soon as her period comes i take note. THEN i move ahead 21 days in my personal blackberry calendar and set an alarm for the day her mood will be out of wack due to PMS. It may be out by a day or two but at least then I can prepare myself for the emotional turmoil that brings. This allows me to keep the outbursts at a minimum as i give grace for the next 2 weeks (pms week and period week) Usually by the time PMS week is over ... or nearing over .. is when the appologies start to roll in and the thank yous as her head clears of her PMS fog and she is able to function with normal horomone levels.

This way its no surprise when it happens ... becasue before it seemed it would sneak up on us and i would react negativly and wonder where my wife went. Well its clockwork now ... and if i dont keep track of it my wife gets rather disappointed becasue she likes the warning that its coming or any day now .. etc. This helps her with her co-workers too .. so she can perpare herself to not get bent out of shape with the other ladies in her office and helps her bite her tongue when she would normally have lashed out at others as well and not just me.

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Originally Posted by MrNiceGuy
Its like a swing of a pendulum. 2 weeks it swings in my favor the other 2 weeks its not.

BTW heres how i track the PMS. Soon as her period comes i take note. THEN i move ahead 21 days in my personal blackberry calendar and set an alarm for the day her mood will be out of wack due to PMS. It may be out by a day or two but at least then I can prepare myself for the emotional turmoil that brings. This allows me to keep the outbursts at a minimum as i give grace for the next 2 weeks (pms week and period week) Usually by the time PMS week is over ... or nearing over .. is when the appologies start to roll in and the thank yous as her head clears of her PMS fog and she is able to function with normal horomone levels.

This way its no surprise when it happens ... becasue before it seemed it would sneak up on us and i would react negativly and wonder where my wife went. Well its clockwork now ... and if i dont keep track of it my wife gets rather disappointed becasue she likes the warning that its coming or any day now .. etc. This helps her with her co-workers too .. so she can perpare herself to not get bent out of shape with the other ladies in her office and helps her bite her tongue when she would normally have lashed out at others as well and not just me.

MNG smile

We'll definitely get a grasp of when PMS rolls around because I could swear my wife disappears for an entire week frequently. I've heard the apologies as well.


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