Z, the reason you feel this way is because your lovebank is empty, and your husband has had an AO very recently. He hasn't eliminated his anger yet, and so you are skeptical of his "niceness" right now. It will take some time before you trust him again, and every time he AOs, it will set you back to square one.

Why does it always have to go back to square one? And, no, AOs aren't right. But let's say he doesn't have a single AO for a year...doesn't raise his voice, not an uncalm manner about him for a year. Then one day a year from now, he gets upset, slams a hand down on a table, says "Damn!" really loud. Now let's say he catches himself after and apologizes.

Does this mean she goes back to square one again? What about 10 years from now? At some point, this seems like holding the past agianst someone.

I absolutely do not mean to minimize the impact of AOs. They're wrong. My wife and I stopped engaging in them long ago. I guess I have trouble understanding the unsafe aspect. When I think of unsafe I think of someone that is going to physically harm your or worse in which you have the husban that throws the wife down the stairs. Or we had this woman that stabbed her boyfriend. I asked my wife when we use to ahve AOs if she felt unsafe and she said no because she never felt like physical harm would come an that if you wanted to act like an immature jerk, that's on you to look stupid.

Maybe my and my wife's ability to detatch ourself from taking this stuff personal makes us look at it differently.

This is an excellent question !!!

Kilt-Boy

I think that any person (male or female) with what Dr Harley describes as an "electric fence personality" (EFP) will very quickly jump to "square one" during any sort of disturbing event.
It is MY OPINION that the EFP has a very difficult time discerning a minor infraction from a major one.



Dr Harley

The electric fence personality is a subject I will probably explore more, in the future.

Take care, Kilt-Boy.

Edit to add:

"Kilt Boy" is a term of endearment. I met Randall Wallace when he was wearing a kilt, and all of us SPQs affectionately called him "Kilt Boy".

I know for me, it took a long time to stop feeling at square one, months of feeling cared for and like I mattered. But I was checked into the marriage. I don't get the gist that Zhamila is checked in or particulary interested in keeping the marriage.

Zha, you kind of blasted back into here with problems in this marriage after a period of absence, having been here before with problems in your last marriage including infidelity. Do you think you moved too quickly into remarriage, before you were ready to be a true partner?

Emotions are not logical like that, kilted.
She cannot control how his AOs make her feel. That is not the same as holding the past against someone. Emotions are emotions.

But you are minimizing AOs.
They are unsafe because the person having the AO is INSANE and could do ANYTHING. People who have no history of violence have killed or maimed their spouse during an AO.

That may not terrify some, but for others it takes a very long time to get over.

When we start telling someone how they SHOULD feel, we're a little off base. Marriage Builders is not about changing how you feel.

I had the same problem, Prisca, when I got here (well, for a couple of years,, actually) with people telling me that I should change my feelings instead of lettiing what my H did bother me.

Most of those posters are no longer here, thank goodness.

I feel like Zha has a problem with the emotion of anger, and not just the outward expresion of it, and also a problem with control. If she discontinued her VS catalog, and that was the problem with her husband getting the mail, then he should be able to get the mail without a problem.

I always get the mail at my house. Not because of what is delivered, but because I am home and do the bills. My H once complained that he never got the mail. So I told him to get it, and put the bills in the clip I use. He said that was too much work. So I get the mail.

The point Prisca is making in this post is that things will be better after Mr. Z has a track record of abstaining from angry outbursts, and after they are further into the distance.

In my opinion, discussing why things feel terrible when there has been a recent angry outburst, and suggesting that it doesn't have to be this way, is distracting and demoralizing for this poster in need of help, and her husband. I believe she needs to know that it can be better, after awhile, assuming her husband makes the needed changes.

Markos, have you or prisca heard the show yet?

We will as soon as it's in the archives, CWMI.

Oh. I figured you would have listened before commenting, since it was rebroadcast for 24 hours.

Given that his last AO was 2 days ago, my advice would be no different.

That you had time to comment but not listen to her H? Umm...I don't know what to say about that. Except perhaps you jump the gun.

Markos even commented that he didn't read her thread before commenting.

Whoops!

Unless Dr. Harley said something along the lines of "Your AOs are no problem at all, Mr. Z." Which I highly doubt.

CWMI, the fact that AOs are extremely destructive to a marriage and to Z's lovebank is a given. I do not need to hear Mr. Z's side of the story to know that.

And *I* have read her thread.

Dr. H had both of their sides, as did SH when they were working with him, and neither of them had the same advice you did, Prisca. Do you wonder why?

Was Dr. Harley's Advice "Your AOs are not a problem, Mr. Z" ?

Dr. H's advice was to negotiate beyond what Zhamila wanted until they reached enthusiastic agreement.

Zhamila says Do This, Mr. Z does, then he resents her for it because they don't negotiate. You'd know this if you heard the show or read the posts after it. You are very focused on his anger, understandable, but as someone who has tried to negotiate with a person who won't, I will tell you, it is quite difficult to not get angry, especially when you are working toward a good outcome for everyone.

One way to start eliminating anger, is to eliminate the TRIGGERS for anger.

This would mean; if you have a spouse constantly committing Love Busters, it would likely be best to separate while a) you learn to control your anger, and b) your spouse learns to avoid other Love Busters.

Trying to control any emotion while having SDs, DJs, AOs, or anything else piled on is a setup for failure.

Its also a rather convenient "out" from negotiation.

Don't like the way things are going? Instigate an AO! Now anger is "the problem!"