OK, after WalMart today (where notebooks were ALSO $.17/ea, I might add, LOL!!!), H started yelling "CRAP! OH MY GAH, DANGGIT!" as he got in the car. I said, "What's wrong?" - I thought a pit bull was attacking his leg or something, or at least a Cockapoo.

He had stepped in gum on the parking lot.

He continued AO'ing, I asked him to please stop the AO. He said, "I'm not AO'ing!" Hmmmm. "This is disgusting, some IDIOT dropped gum on the ground! Kids, you'd better NEVER drop gum on the ground!"

I handed him a napkin so he could put it on the bottom of his shoe & it wouldn't get on the carpet (just had the car detailed - the clean don't last long with 4 kids, but we do what we can )

Later, he said, "Will you forgive me?" I said I have a hard time forgiving behavior that repeats so much. This upset him. I asked what forgivess means to him. He explained that he wants me to release him from the obligation to repay. I told him I am not able to do that, I need him to repay me by never having another AO again. This upset him again.

He called it a "little slip." Then he started pointing out all of my flaws, like when I said the F word a few weeks ago. I told him I'd be happy to talk about my problems at another time, but I wanted to stay focused on his eliminating AOs. He kept saying the F word - "so that's not a problem?" I asked him to PLEASE stop saying the F word, and that we can talk about my problems some other time (he kept saying it). I told him his anger is unacceptable to me, I do not want to continue living with an angry man, nor having my children and I exposed to his angry behavior. He promised (again) to stop.

Rrrrrr. I'm getting angry with MYSELF now. I am a fool to put up with this.

I'll try this, CWMI. ("His idea....his idea....his idea")

Did you apologize for your demanding behavior at Target, not even knowing they were the same price at walmart?

Did he pitch a fit about doing what you wanted by going to walmart instead? Or was he happy to buy them there?

I got mad about stepping on gum last week. Some idiot spit it out not six inches from the trash can. I said a bit about wth, told my kids to never be that lazy, and rubbed it off before I got in the car. If my H had told me he wouldn't forgive me for that, I'd think he was nutz.

Are you looking for someone who is happy to step in gum?

OK, here's my go at "not offering a solution:"

He came back upstairs after we stopped a conversation (we both agreed we needed a break) - but he wanted to bring up another issue. He came in the bedroom and said, "I want to talk about one more thing." I said, "Now is not a good time for me, I'm kinda worn out from before." He said, "I just want to tell you how I feel about what you did at Target." I said, "I am really worn out from our previous conversation." (my heart is still racing from all his F-bombs a few minutes ago) "I want to talk about it now. You won't even have a really brief conversation?!" (raising his voice). I just steadily looked out the window and said, "This is not a good time for me." He said, "Well, can we do it later?" "Yes, I'd be happy to talk about it later." He said, "You promise we'll do it later today?" (sheesh) "Yes, I'd be happy to talk about it later today."

Maybe I can go back to the hospital for some R&R. Come to think of it, my heart's getting all tight again.

They were YOUR f bombs, Z.

He was repeating your bombs.

If you don't want to hear the F word, first order is...don't say it.

No, she is looking for someone who doesn't have an angry outburst when they do! His AO over the gum was a huge lovebuster. He has been told this time and time again, STOP THE ANGRY OUTBURSTS! Saying sorry doesn't cut it. Only stopping it should earn her forgiveness. Why would she forgive him for something that HE KNOWS he will just do again in 10 minutes because he chooses to continue this behavior?

Z, I would take a break for a few days and not discuss anything. Since every discussion is a disaster, better to put it off for now.

So she can drop f bombs, but he can't say danggit over stepping in gum?

What were your f words about, Z?

I view the issue of the "f-bombs" as nothing more than an attempt to JUSTIFY his own angry outbursts and change the subject. He didn't just say "dangit" over stepping in gum, he had another angry outburst.

And no, she shouldn't be dropping "f-bombs" either. But using her bad behavior won't justify his. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Five year olds play that silly game: "well, bobby did it last week!!!!!" and we don't allow them to get away with it.

THAT is an angry outburst. That is not just saying "dang it."

Your post made me laugh! If there was some home improvement project that needed to be done around our house when I was growing up, my Mom would deliberately initiate normal day to day conversation in that room and sit so that my Dad was facing whatever it was that needed repair. Eventually, it would begin to bother him seeing it and he would take it upon himself to fix it without my Mom having to say a word!

Z,

By your own admission you used the F bomb recently. In the 51 years I've been on this earth, F bombs usually accompany AO's. How can you possibly hold him to the standard of never having an AO again when you, yourself, have AO's. That is a double standard or what my mother calls the pot calling the kettle black.

That being said, though, after following your thread all this time, I can't help but get the very distinct impression you have already made up your mind to divorce your husband and are just justifying it here much like WW's who are in the fog rewrite history to justify their A's. If you don't like his behavior and nothing he says or does is right, then divorce him already.

Being told over and over again to not have AOs by someone spewing f bombs at you is stupid.

Nobody ever f-bombs their way into calmness. Agree?

I completely disagree that her cussing justifies his AOs nor does she forfeit her right to object. Bringing up the "f-bomb" was his way of avoiding accountability for his AO. That won't work. There is a world of difference between cussing and having an AO.

I can't get a full quote in on this stoopid iPad, so refer back to post I am responding to to get the gist.

Set a time to return to the convos you stop. Otherwise it appears dismissive altogether. "Later" so often means "never". Say 3pm or 6pm or 9pm or tomorrow at 4, but avoid "later".

Mel, I agree with you. I am not trying to dismiss his behavior at all. What I am pointing out is that she recounted numerous instances where she has engaged in AO's and, yet, expects him to be perfect and never have another one. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Z has the incredible ability to see herself as perfect and her husband as horrid. Look at how she dismissed the Target/Walmart outcome - she pointed out the notebooks cost the same at both stores and then said "lol". I don't think that's funny. I think its abominable that she created conflict with her husband and when it turns out for naught, she makes light of it.

A short enough bit for me to quote! He brought up her behavior after he asked for forgiveness and was denied. You already said you'd be balls to ballistic if you were spoken to like she spoke to him yesterday, and that was *nice*.

I don't know why you're giving her a pass on f-bombing her H. Surely someone saying they'd prefer to shop at walmart shouldn't get a ballistic response? But being handed an f-bomb is simply an excuse for one's own behavior?

I don't even understand what you mean with this.


No, she doesn't get a pass. HOWEVER, the solution to his AO's is *NOT* "well, you did this!!!" or "you did that!!!" That isa childish distraction. The solution is to STOP IT. And until that happens, there will be no change.

In other words, SHE needs to stop it and HE needs to stop it. But as long as they are pointing to each others behavior as an ANSWER to their own bad behavior nothing changes.

That's why some of us have attemtping to get Z to change her behavior and her blaming.

What I meant above was even you, Mel, would have been aggravated by her notebook demand, and you admitted as such. And she didn't use an f-bomb in that statement. Can you imagine it being delivered with an f bomb? Why on earth would someone complaining about negotiating deliver f bombs and demands?

Does that sound like a marriage builder to you?

If you are saying she should stop objecting to his AOs, then that is not correct advice. She most certainly should object. And yes, the notebook issue would have aggravated me and I told her that. But that does not justify an AO. That does NOT mean I am condoning AOs. Even if that would have made me mad, I would not have had an AO. There is NO justification for that. NONE.

I am not understanding what you mean by blaming. She is supposed to tell him her complaints. Can you be more specific about you mean?