Hello All,

Well, my XWH accomplished what he set out to do, and after 2.5 years, we are divorced. I have been reading so many stats over these last few years, and am just wondering if they are going to shake out..... Or am I in that 'lucky' small percentage where he and his (still married) affair partner are going to make it?

I will try to be brief - (okay, sorry, it is not)
Left me after 19 years of marriage for the secretary and her two children from 2 different relationships. Completed this within a 3 month period. Yes, I now know that if they are going to really leave - they do within 3 months. Yep. Check. I was completely shocked, had no clue, you know, the way it always is when it goes down this fast. Found marriage builders too late.

He STILL is DEEP in the fog. It's still all my fault. He is SUCH a victim. Boo hoo...... Officially moved in with her 6 months after leaving me and the children. It's been two years now that they have lived together. Insert Dr. H's stat about 85% of couples who live together don't make it. Her husband has been pushing for annulment. She's dragging her feet but they are getting closer.

So they have surpassed the 2 year mark of the affair being out in the open. Court orders (no paramour contact) kept her away from my kids (thank God) DD 11, DS 14. WH fought me for custody, visitation, everything. Even brought in a GAL and Pych Eval (yep, I'm the crazy one ;)) Surprise, surprise - I continued on and ended up with full custody and him standard order visitation. Add in that he had to take parenting classes (above and beyond what the court makes everyone take), and couldn't 'introduce' his OW ( oops, children were in school together - same class, even) until after his parenting class is complete, then special 'limited contact introduction weekends' have to happen - another 6-8 weeks. First one - not successful......Then they get to attempt to cram 6 of them in a small 3 bedroom house.

I have moved on, focused on my children 100% and we are doing well. Lots of therapy and not cramming another new partner down their throats has helped. Camping, exploring places we could never go before (he was a workaholic and we always were waiting for him). Financially we are in desperate, desperate shape, but we appreciate what we have and I can come up with great things on a shoestring budget. He sees me calm, happy, and relaxed. And he comes across angry, agitated, and as I mentioned before - a huge victim. Of course he projects all of that onto me, telling me I am. I find that most funny - he has practically no access to me except the final court date, and 3 mediation sessions to divide contents (boy did I learn a lot about myself in those!!! (from his perspective, that is). It was most enlightening! Twisting every little detail like the best of them! Lol! At least it was a good laugh. I just smiled polietly and kept to the business at hand...... He is now threatening to take me back to court over two unresolved larger household items.

He and his OW do have a similar low activity lifestyle and love of the business, where as my wings have been set free and I can go, go, go! My kids love it! He also looks very different - slimy, long hair, etc., now takes PLENTY of time off of work. Which I admit, I am jealous about because I wish he would have spent that time with our family.

So where do the stats come in here? Can any of you read this objectively (if this is enough info) They have surpassed many milestones....am I going to have to work on accepting his affair partner in my children's lives? Is that going to have to be my final frontier?

Thanks for any input......

BetterDays, it sounds like you have made lemonade out of the lemons your WH handed you. The only thing I would suggest to you now is to completely Plan B your wayward. He doesn't deserve a moment of your time, and giving any is disruptive to YOU.

Enjoy those kids. They grow up really fast.

Yes time to NC your WH.

He is too busy still rewriting your marriage history and justifying his affair.

His is fogged up and most likely stay in denial to the truth.

Keep making lemonade and enjoying your life.

As to watching to see if statistics will catch up with WH is pointless. There are many people in this world that never get the consequences they deserve.

But your WH having to live the rest of his life with the POSOW me be the best consequence he will ever have.

BDA,Stats are irrelevant. This is YOUR life. I don't know your story, are you hoping to get him back after things fall apart with Ms. Whiteout? There was someone on the radio program yesterday with a similar question -- you might check that out. Some affairages do last -- most likely in abject misery...but people can endure a lot sometimes.

You would have to uphold the model of behavior for your kids. Integrity, strength, discipline, honesty, serenity, stability. Your kids won't get that from your ex, it appears. And to a less extent from his new affair partner.

How do they feel about sharing their lives with the woman who helped bring on their family's demise?

optimism

I found an excellent radio clip from Dr. Harley, of why it's a good idea to go into Plan B after divorce. Tell me what you think.
Radio clip on Plan B after Divorce at 5:25 mark

The bigger question is why care about his future?
He is a renter and will be in the relationship as long as it suits him.

Thank you, everyone, for your input so far. I look forward to listening to the radio clips - hopefully this evening!

I have really cut off a ton of contact and do truly enjoy those spans of time. Was reading the article on Parellel Parenting here and was amazed at how much anxiety and the length that the anxiety lasts with each contact, not to mention the negative effects on the children! Yikes! I do enjoy feeling at peace and relaxed. Although not court ordered, am seriously considering setting up an online calendar to minimize unnecessary contact regarding school events/appointments/children's activities that affect drop off and pick up times. Any online calendar suggestions?

Unfortunately he is still fighting with me about the contents. Sometimes it feels like he just wants to keep me engaged. I just want him to pick up his stuff so both of us can move on with our new lives and even indicated that I'm sure he was looking forward to moving on with his new life, that I knew I sure was. Very positive and upbeat. He told me that I was surpressing my anger.....and that we were going to have to go back to court to start all over regarding the contents because I was being unreasonable. ??? He also threatened to take me back to court as we were signing our final divorce decree because he couldn't meet me in the middle regarding an hour difference in pick up times. ??? Why does he love the court threat so much?

So yes, NC will be SUCH a relief!!!! But for now, the more we go through our lawyers with this crap, the higher the bill gets!!! And I am beyond tapped out!

In response to Optimism's question of would I take him back..... If you had asked me that a year ago, it would have said, 'absolutely!' I was fresh off reading Surviving an Affair and although the path was SO narrow, I knew I had it in me to do the hard and painful required work. Even bought an inspirational Tshirt about no hill being too hard to climb. But shortly thereafter, realized that just because I was ready to do that kind of work...didn't mean he was...... That was a real awakening, and as I shared that with my therapist, she somberly agreed. Let me point out here how THICK and DEEP he is in the fog. I honestly don't thInk he has ever even had a glimmer of the destruction his actions have caused. I mean NOT A GLIMMER. The twisted stories he tells even children about how he has to pay me all of his money and he has nothing, BLOW my mind! I am in line at the salvation army for school supplies, he is at a very expensive amusement park the same day with his other family. I no longer own a car (have to borrow!), on food stamps, etc., etc.....

So although I believe with my whole heart in intact families it came down to the fact that my former husband now had no integrity, strength, discipline, honesty, serenity, or stability. You hit the nail EXACTLY on the head, Optimism. Exactly. I began to really explore with my therapist areas where his lack of character were evident throughout our marriage. I took off my rose colored glasses and saw him for who he really was, and sadly, I mourned the loss of my intact family. For my kids. For myself. For everyone else who's lives would be touched. And from that day on, I knew the door had closed on my marriage.

So why DO I care if him and the OW make it? Why do I hold onto those stats so dearly? I guess it is because my children are mere weeks away from having to move in with the OW (but only ever other weekend, and Wednesday evenings....well, and half of the holidays, plus more time in summer). So that is bringing up these thoughts of - will they actually make it? Is she a better partner for him than I was? I guess my only solice comes from those stats, hoping that my kids won't have to endure her for that long. No, they do not like her. Not one bit. They knew her before, her husband, her children, knew she worked in our office and the children saw quite clearly how quickly their seemingly perfect lives turned upside down. Without any warning. He unexpectedly moved out one day, then 2 months later told the kids that he was dating OW. Yikes!!!!! But yet I am told pretty regularly by him how much damage I am doing to the kids. The fog is downright frightening!

-BDA

Dear BrainHurts and MB Community,

I listened to the radio clip you linked and completely agree with the no contact. To prevent disruption in my life, to be sparred of the fog babbling, etc., etc.

I cannot WAIT until he removes his contents - which are stacked to the ceiling in the garage. The thought of his disgusting presence in my space would completely violate me, so it now waits in the garage for him. However, he continues to drag this out. Have given him 6 dates through the lawyer (after offering dates directly through him first) and none have been satisfactory.

So that is a huge cloud hanging over me. Then add on dealing with my kids now having to be forced to spend their visitation with the married OW and her 2 children..... Found the clip that Optimism referenced, and yes, my kids DO NOT like her and so far have even refused to look at her.

Any advice for dealing with that on my end is very welcomed....... We are in counseling, but as anyone knows in this situation, that hour every week or two isn't enough.

-BDA

As for calendar suggestions I use Google calendar.
It is free.
There are also some available for a charge of about $200 a year.

I created a calendar and then sent my ex wife the following email:


In an effort to more efficiently share important child event dates such as doctor appointments, school events, vacations, etc I have created an online calendar.
You will soon receive an email from Google with instructions on how to access this calendar online.
Thank you

As for the stuff in the garage send your husband an email and tell him the garage is being painted and all of his belongings need out within 3 days.
If they are not out they will be placed in the front yard

As for wondering if the ow is a better partner.... YES. She is a low life scum feeder as is your ex husband. They belong together.
You can do much better.
Focus on improving yourself.

I will check into Google calendars. Thx! I want to be sure he cannot alter times of what I post..... Do you know about that?

I emailed him late June - when do you want to come get your stuff? He replied that we weren't finished yet (the two undecided large items remain). IMO, he should come get the other stuff at least!

In the beginning of August I sent another email with over 10 days notice that on such and such Sat. that his items would be placed outside and ready for him to pick up at noon. He twisted that into "I was threatening to throw his items on the lawn" and contacted his lawyer, who contacted my lawyer! Thus me offering him 3 dates, then three MORE dates - all through the lawyers. Cha Ching, cha Ching! There went another $150. We have already spent a combined $1600 combined on mediating this! Never knew we should have set a date right there!

It's frustrating because I have kept all of his items in perfect condition. I boxed up and even labeled the boxes I personally packed. I did not pack up any garbage, or massive amounts of sawdust from his wood shop. HEAVY items were carried out of the basement - saving him TONS of work. He doesn't know any of this. Instead of seeing the DAYS of work I have saved him, he will be madder than a wet hen. But I cannot have that now skittish and unpredictable man in my home.
Although it would be quite interesting to see his reaction to his workshop (which resembled an episode of the Hoarders TV show) that has been turned into a freshly painted, beautifully organized art studio...... Those are the kind of projects I enjoy putting my energy into...... .

I guess that's an indication of how NC I am. We've been enjoying that space for weeks, but he's busy telling me to 'put down my weapons' and emailing me about my repressed anger...... Funny how he thinks he knows what's going on in my life......so tempted to send him pictures of that beautiful new room......

-BDA

You can place restrictions on google calendar
Go to google for more info

Make sure you take pictures periodically of his stuff dated so he cant claim damage.

You will heal so much when you get into a dark Plan B.

I recommend you use a plan B program with your ex

As far as the kids being exposed to the OW.........say nothing about it. Listen to them vent and hug them and be there for them.

Their relationship with their dad is primal. They are from him, they must work out the whole deal with him. You are not referee. You are mom. Be pure love and support and add no fuel to the fire.

Stand back from it.

As your heart wrenches from it........be kind to yourself and proud that you can withstand the angst though it really does suck. Big time.

Move all his stuff into a storage unit, pay for 30 days, have your atty sent the keys to his atty with details.

And just dont listen to the hauling.

BetterDays,
For some reason I think you may benefit from reading some of Smiling Woman's thread, if you can find it. I haven't seen her much but I believe she has a little boy who had to go with Dad and the OW a lot and they had a real time of it transitioning. It may help you to see how that situation has developed. I believe her son matured a lot through all of it even though it was difficult; a strong little kid she has there.

Scotland's situation involves kids and an OW (and I believe her kids). You might get something from her thread although I think she's up to several thousand pages. Incidentally she is the Plan B Master - so a good read as you are looking to solidify your Plan B.

That was Brain's clip you referenced above. Brain is invaluable with her links.

You may check into the legality of kids choosing which parent they want to be with more. I've heard that in some states they actually have more choice than most people believe. Perhaps if they get to a certain age they can petition the court to live with you more.

Hope all's well, BDA.

opt

BetterDays,
When I read your post, I felt like I was reading a bit of my own story. My WH left me for the secretary too - what a cliche! She still lives overseas in the country where my WH has done business for many years. It's been just about 2 years since the affair first came to light and yes they too are defying the odds and are still together. And of course, according to WH, I am the cause of it all and the one to blame.

The kicker with me is that now WH and OW have a child together. Yes, we are not yet divorced, but they had a child together. It was not unplanned either. The POSOW is 42 and they were "running out of time" and decided to have a child. They still have never lived in the same country together. He has been travelling to visit her once a month. However, they are moving here in a couple of weeks.

So yes, now I have to deal with my kids being introduced to and living part of the time with POSOW, [censored] child, and WH. I try to do as much of Plan B/parallel parenting as possible. We have a Google calendar and I try to handle any necessary communication via email. My WH also left his stuff all over the house - books, CDs, clothes - despite the fact that he moved out almost 9 months ago.

I want to throw up everytime my attorney calls me with an update on our divorce. I am trying my best to move on and be strong for my kids. They are seeing a psychologist and she has wisely advised me to be the rock in their lives. So I do my best to be there for them.

The one bright spot is that I do have a good career and income so I won't be in need of alimony (though WH is trying his darndest to avoid child support).

Just wanted to let you know that you are definitely not alone - it sucks.