He and I both know Dr. H's concept of not talking about the A. Both of us are guilty of letting it linger. He is guilty of bringing it up and I am guilty of allowing him to control me with my guilt.

It so funny how clear this is now. I am just hoping that my H is willing to work with me and make the change in our marriage. We have had this pattern for most of our marriage and the thought of being able to change it is scary.

I have decided that no matter what I am going to change it on my end. I can't let him control me by using my A as a weapon against me.

I did send an email to the moderators about R, how do they get a hold of you and let you know what they find out?

They will email you to your email that you have on file.

15, I have just caught up on your thread. There are some similarities to my sitch. My H had a ONS very early in our M and another EA somewhere since then, I didn't find out about until a couple yrs ago and I had my own RA, so now we are in the same boat as you only I am more your BH/WH's spot.

It is SO insightful for me to read your posts. Such great perspective to see how confusing MY actions are to my WH/BH because I have pretty much done the same thing your H has been doing for the last 2 yrs. (I know for anyone who follows my thread, you are slapping your heads right now, wondering if it REALLY is the first time I realized I confuse the he77 out of him).

When I say I love him, I mean it. When I say I will never love him the same, at that moment I mean it. When I say I have hope, I mean it. When I say I feel hopeless, I also mean it. I guess what I am trying to say is, when you have every emotion in your mind all at the same time, as a BS and a WS and everything in between, depending on the exact moment of the day, mood, triggers, UA time (I will come back to this...), you can feel TOTALLY DIFFERENT than you did the moment before. It is truly a rollercoaster, emotionally.

He is blessed that you are committed to the program like you are, I have not had that blessing with my WH/BH always. When I am in the lows, the most I could hope for from him is to just push forward with the program, as everyone else has suggested to you. Keep your eye on the prize as NG always says. My WH often gets caught up in my bad mood, and allows it to defeat him, and now we are both feeling defeated, and who is fighting? No one. If you can keep yourself from doing that and keep fighting, that is golden, because someone needs to be.

UA time is CRITICAL. I have found that there is a very direct correlation to how much UA time we are getting/intimate needs we are meeting, and my feelings of hopelessness and wanting to throw in the towel. I cannot stress it enough.

It is good to hear from you UW. I have not read your thread in awhile but I know the painful rollercoaster ride you have been on. It is good to know the crazy mixed up feelings come from both sides.

I totally agree with the UA time. In fact, as I was thinking about it our UA time has really been lacking the past couple of weeks. Both of us have been busy and work and I feel like that definitly puts a void between you and give you time to ponder thoughts that can be hurtful to your marriage.

It was good to hear from you and thankyou for the support. Your advice means a lot to me.

15Y,

Is he back? Can you schedule some UA this week?

He is not back yet. I sent him an email today and we are actually working together right now. The conversation is light and casual not bitterness or awkwardness...just that underlying question of what tomorrow brings.

He told me last night that we could talk after work. I am going to ask him if he wants to get some chow after we get off. That will be some UA time even if it is just dinner.

Thanks 15! I have been on vacation. I don't know how all the posters in Florida handle the heat, good grief. Bring on the snow baby!

Yes, the crazy mixed up feelings come from both sides. I think especially when you have BS/BW on both sides it is just a crazy mixed up mess of emotion.

And such an emotional rollercoaster. At one time in life I would have been considered very laid back, mentally stable, a non emotional and level headed gal. Whatttt??? Where'd that lady go cause I haven't seen her in awhile!

I really do think the UA time is VITAL, and I'm not saying we always get it. But the fact that we don't always get it, and the weeks we don't are def the DOWN weeks, just cements the theory that it is vital to recovery (as well as maintaining an already good relationship).

I agree with UA time being VITAL. I always feel so much more secure when we spend time together, especially quality time.

I am not sure If I was ever a laid back person but now I feel like I am always on edge.

Right now I have knots in my stomach because Mr. XVY said that he wants to read over the letter I wrote him yesterday and have time to really think about it and respond to it.

We are getting together tonight to talk about it and I am so scared!!!!

"Scared" is a distracting, counter-productive emotion. You need to translate that to "aware", "motivated", and "effective".

What decisions and revelations that come out of tonight's chat may have serious consequences for your future. You understand that your future tasks will be either easier or more difficult thereafter. It's not likely that he will come to the event with a firm decision, so his judgment will be affected by what transpires tonight. That's awareness.

You must decide now how you will approach this meeting. A trembling, visibly shaken XVY is not likely to be helpful. A serious, devoted, desirable, and concerned mate is.

Be the best XVY you can be. I think apologies are long past, probably on both sides. You have a plan (MB's), you have the desire and skill to implement it, and you want to share that with him. So, you're motivated. Convince him to buy in.

Effective? Where are you meeting? Dinner? Call ahead and get the correct table. What's his favorite color? Wear that dress. How does he like your hair? Do it! Favorite scent (not overpowering!)? Wear it! Turn off your cell. Ask him to do the same. Encourage him to have a drink, but you stick to non-alcoholic libations, or order something and don't touch it. Speak slowly, looking directly at him. When he speaks, lean toward him.

If this sounds like a job interview, it's meant to. Good luck.

That is a great post NG.

Strong and steady XVY.

Good luck.
FF

Thank you NG. This gives me strength! I wrote down your three key words AWARENESS, MOTIVATION, AND EFFECTIVENESS.

FF,

I also took to heart what you said to me the other day. I have really been thinking about it and reflecting on it.

Report back to us when it is appropriate.

I can't wait to hear how it goes.

Regardless of his response, you can stay the course and be the best XVY you can be. Your children will thank you.

My sister said something powerful to me just this week, while we were talking about my life. "If your hands are clutched around (you insert name or circumstance), how can they be empty for God to fill them up"?

hugs to you. I'm walking a similar path with you.
FF

I have so much to say I don't even know where to begin!

I think I will start with with four words CLEAN SLATE and TRUE POJA (can we count POJA as one word???)

I will start with POJA. You know you really don't realize a true POJA until you have one. When you talk to your spouse and you don't get exactly what you want but you both walk away feeling truly happy and excited by the discussion...that is a true POJA. After yesterday I am not sure if my H and I have ever really had one. I'm sure we have but it has been awhile.

Here is the deal, we sat down with our current situation and we took turns talking and telling each other how we felt. He went into it wanting to walk away, I went into it wanting to pull us back together we came out of it with an agreement that made us both happy and a true realization of where we are...for the first time!!!

I realized that I have been trying so hard to fix myself and my marriage that I have neglected to see my H falling apart. I have been trying to MB him and YES he does see the positive results of MB, he is on board but he needs to help himself before he helps us!!

I'm not sure if I disclosed this info in an earlier post but Mr. XVY (as he now likes to be referred to on here) has A LOT of built in resentment, anger and pain. This dates back to his childhood. Unfortunately, his life has revolved around A's. His mothers when he was 12 and then his wife...makes me absolutely sick to think about it.

I think this is what hurts him more than anything is the fact that I went into our marriage knowing of his pain (his kryptonite as he likes to call it) from his mothers A (something that he never truly dealt with) and added two of my own on top of that. How could I do this? He ask me that, I ask myself that same question and it is almost too much to bear on both ends.

I think that only way that I have been able to get past it is the fact that I now have MB on my side and I know who I am now and what I have to do to protect myself and my H from another A.


What I have also come to realize though is that my H needs more than just MB and my changed heart. I have wanted us more than anything but yesterday I finally realized that that is VERY SELFISH. The same SELFISH desire that got me into trouble in the first place. What I truly want now is for Mr. XVY to be HAPPY again or maybe even HAPPY for the first time in his life.

I think he finally realized this too! He is going to get professional help (I know that some of you are leery about this but this is what he needs). He has such a thick wall of resentment and anger built up and neither of us know how to break it down. We both ENTHUSIASTICALLY agreed that he needs to fix himself before we can move ahead in our marriage (CLEAN SLATE).

It felt so good to come to this conclusion. Something we both agreed on something that was different that what either of us went into the conversation expecting. Something that leaves us wondering whether or not we will end up together or not...but something that gives both of us hope for a brighter future...A CLEAN SLATE!!!

So this is where we are at. One day at a time, unknown future but a future that revolves around honesty and happiness. Whether we are married or not, we are in this together and that feels good. I think for the first time XYV and Mr. XYV were honest with each other and themselves.

Our entire marriage has been clouded with guilt and resentment. We however have had enough love and desire to keep us together but my 2nd A was too much...it was the toxin that was more powerful than the love.


"I won't give up on us
Even if the skies get rough
I'm giving you all my love
I'm still looking up"

NG,

you were right. I did not get the results I wanted out of our discussion yesterday....I got so much more!!!

Are you both willing to commit to MB Coaching?
Have you scheduled your appt with Steve yet?

HDW,

I think in time that we will both be able to commit to MB coaching but right now my H needs to concentrate on himself. This is something we both enthusiastically agreed on yesterday and that is a BIG part of MB. In fact I think that POJA is one of the biggest aspects of MB, Dr. H has even said so on his radio show numerous times.

I am going to contact Steve myself and see if we are heading in the right direction but I feel really good about what we accomplished yesterday.

I disagree.
Seeing a psychologist is good for individual health.
But you need to work on your marriage.
The truth is you are headed for divorce and if you do not follow the MB plan you likely will be divorced, possibly with the psychologists encouragement.

Most psychologists encourage people to remove themselves from unhealthy environments and your husband is miserable, a mother that cheated and a wife that cheated. That's a pattern. Psychologists help people see patterns and break them.

I am sorry that you disagree. But both my H and I agree that he needs individual help to even consider moving on with our marriage. We will be looking for someone who had MB principals connected to them.

A divorce is something that I am willing to risk if it makes my husband happy. We are going to be incorporating MB practices in our marriage along with him seeking help...anti depressants a psychologist to help him deal with his resentment.

I agree with everyone on here that says you have to follow MB to a tee and not stray from them. I do not however agree that getting additional help is going against MB practices. In fact, I have actually heard DR. H talk about getting additional help as long as it is someone who is aware of MB practices and not out to destroy marriages.

Getting self help does not always mean getting selfish help. My H has some very deep emotional issues that he has buried for years. He needs help getting them out and dealing with them.

I think I owe him at least that since I am the cause of a lot of these issues. Again, I want my marriage but I want my H happy as well. Isn't that a major concept of MB? Isn't that that the point? Seeing your spouses needs and working together to help fill them?

hugs to you XVY. Been thinking about you all morning, hoping you had a good conversation.

The resentment is really a roadblock right now, isn't it ? I'm glad you are on the same team.

I have to leave now, but will be back later to keep reading.

You are in my thoughts,
FF

FF,
That is the perfect work "roadblock" my H actually says their is a defense mechanism in his brain that is not allowing him to love or trust me again. That his resentment is to great right now and he has to fix this in order to move on. I think yesterday we both came to the realization that this "roadblock" is bigger than both of us and needs to be moved.

The good news is that we are planning on doing it together with both MB concepts and additional help. I know that is scary to a lot of you because MB has been all that you needed (it was all that I needed) but my H needs more.