Soooo sorry you are here. I can feel your pain.

I too experienced a FR. Until dday #2, I thought an A was the worst thing that could happen. Oh, was I wrong.

As you are now seeing first hand a FR has many many ramifications. My FWW and I are now nearly 10mos into our real R and I can share with you what worked for me but your situation is of course your situation.

Upon dday #2 hitting me like a house of bricks, I basically told her it was over. I saw no way of her ever changing her evil ways.

After about 2 weeks of weighing my options, I decided that there was only 1 way I would even consider giving her another chance. You can read my thread to see the full story. Even with the below conditions it has been an extremely difficult struggle. I mean extremely. And this is with a fully remorseful W totally on board with MB�s.

But in a nutshell:

1) N/C Letter
2) Total commitment to MB�s
3) Break all ties with friends that enabled the A
4) Iron clad tight EP�s � see my list in my thread
5) Any breach of NC or breach of ANY EP�s means full on immediate D with me fighting tooth and nail for full custody of our children. Filing D on grounds of adultery.
6) Complete and total transparency. Im talking telling me every single detail of EVERYTHING.

This was the start for me to even consider taking her back. Any hesitations or breaches to this = DONE. Still to this day these are my conditions.

Do you think he would entertain this?

I'd get him to send that NC letter. It isn't fair this poor BH is still dealing with a fantasy bubble that could be easily popped by your WH.

Be careful about choosing 'not to know'. How are you going to remove the conditions of the A unless you know about the A? Implement RH if he is likely keeping a big secret?

Knowing if it was a PA is different to hearing the nitty gritty details. It is knowing about a serious failing of character. Being able to insist on STD tests.

You don't know whether they had sex. Beware of your own BS fog.

Your recovery plan sounds a little muddled.

I'd start by giving him the MB conditions as spelled out by Dr H (letter etc)

Then I would choose an MB recovery plan which is structured so you don't have any gaps in it. Counselling centre, the home program etc.

Knowing the conditions which made the A POSSIBLE is a step you cannot skip. These will feed into your EP's.

You MUST eliminate the conditions which made the A possible.


How much information you require to move forward is highly personal. What you must consider is that now is the time to get the answers. Not months down the road.

These are the basic conditions.

You should add others which relate to the causation of the A. Some waywards can't have social networking accounts, or delete internet history for example.

1. end all contact with the OW for life. Write an NC letter approved and sent by me.

2. no more nights apart or going out without each other - create a healthy, integrated lifestyle

3. complete transparency - cell phone passwords, etc

4. no more opposite sex friendships

5. complete honesty about your affair<s> � passing a polygraph

6. commit to a marital programme for recovery of my choosing (MB)

I don't understand, do they work at the same company or not? Different buildings could still mean same company....

A WS who has not revealed whether the A was physical is someone who is still wayward.

If he is telling you this was just EA and you have a feeling it was physical, then a poly is a no-brainer.

Basically...Still hiding details of affair = no recovery.

A couple other things that caught my eye...

He shouldn't be going to the gym, period, unless you are with him. This is a hot spot for hookups and a basic EP that should be implemented, and it is also an IB. You two should be spending ALL of your free time together.

Has he given up all business travel (any overnights at all)?

Thank you all so much for your replies. I'm going to try to answer all the questions.

20years...
5) Any breach of NC or breach of ANY EP�s means full on immediate D with me fighting tooth and nail for full custody of our children. Filing D on grounds of adultery.

He is fully aware that this is absolutely one of my conditions at this point. Forgot to mention that. I'm going to look up your thread for the EPs. Yes, I do think he is willing to entertain all of what you mentioned.

Good point about choosing not to know Indie and preventing the conditions that made things possible. I am going to get it out of him if only for the sake of being able to take precautions to prevent it in the future. He knows I require radical honesty in order to move on.

Susie, the three of us still work for the same company - all different buildings. He and I work in the same department so, in discussing with others here, many agreed that him staying at this job is good for us because I can really keep a close eye on him this way. I am aware of everything he does, (we even share work calendars and emails and projects) is supposed to be doing, time & leave, etc and we report to the same supervisors. Now, since the move, he and I will be working a parking lot away from each other so it is pretty ideal. (I am currently on maternity leave) Once I go back to work, we will also be attending the same gym at the same time of day.

Overnight business travel is a non-issue and we don't go out without each other.


You all have already helped me. I now know some questions I must ask him about conditions that made the affair possible and then eliminate those conditions.

Do the supervisors know about the A and do they support separation of the APs?

I dunno. You mention good advantages being near him but it would be so easy for you to be off ill and the two of them sent to the same meeting or put on same group email - and bam, trigger.

Her direct supervisor knows and so does mine/ours.

They would never be sent to the same meeting as the two departments don't intermingle that way. However, he could be asked to provide coverage at her building in which case there is a chance they could see each other. Currently he is never asked to cover that building anymore and if it became completely necessary, he does it remotely. If a call were to come in directly for service to her area/department we are in agreement that he would do whatever it takes to not service that call.

Besides, anything that did happen, even if I were off ill, I would find out about it the next day as long as they aren't in the same building. Part of the reason that made the A possible was that he wasn't following protocol with the way he handled things in his building. Things weren't being documented the way they should've been otherwise everyone would've quickly been aware that he was spending way too much time with a certain person with no good reason. That is all removed now as he has lost the degree of autonomy he had in that building and is more accountable for his time in this new building.

The other possibility is that she could potentially be moved to any building where he is and we have agreed that he will change buildings again if that happens.

Any benefit to your being able to "watch him" if he stays at that company will be offset by his being triggered by the OW working there. This is evidenced by the fact that OWH recently contacted you to vent that OW is still in love with your H and they are not making any progress in their M. What OWH reported to you tells me she is best case being triggered, worst case scenario still having some level of contact, even if only one sided (seeing his name or information thru network, etc).

I am not sure who advised you that this would be a good idea, you may want to ask that person if they have ever seen a story here on MB of a couple recovering while the affairees continued to work at the same company, despite being separated by department or buildings or even town/state. I cannot think of any success story that has this scenario.

All the ones who had this sitch that I have seen here were not doing well in their R. Off the top of my head, back in 2007 there was a poster "fiori" whose H had an EA with a coworker. They moved to separate buildings and she watched him like a hawk. A year or so down the road, she woke up one night, H was not in bed and she drove by and he was at OW's house. She stopped posting here shortly after.

This is a corner you cannot cut, POM. There is a whole thread that Melody started regarding this topic called "I told you so!" which was written in response to a poster who believed she and her H could recovery with some "wiggle" room in some of the MB requirements.

Did you respond regarding the poly? Are you going to do this? Again, would not cut this corner. Not only do you need all the facts of this A but it will weed out if there was any other previous A's you need to know about. Will also demonstrate to your H that he needs to become radically honest.

Why did you guys never send the NC letter? Agree with indie on this point and, again, worried that there are corners being cut...

Pieces, I don't think you're going to get beaten up here. I'm sorry you've had to deal with this

Is your WH willing to leave that job? They can't work together. You know that, now.

Have you done any exposure?

Susie I think you are right about OW being triggered.

I will look up that I told you so thread.

Will he leave this job...no, probably not. It pays very well, is very secure, and he's vested (pension)as am I. It would be a huge deal if he decided to. It would mean some serious discussion. It's not impossible, just highly unlikely. I know what that means for our recovery efforts.

I am going to work on the poly. The thing about other affairs... that got me. That's definitely a possibility too.

We never sent the NC letter because when NC began I was not posting on here or even attempting to follow an MB plan. I gave up on MB back in January.

bliss - exposure was done. Everyone knows - his mom, my mom, sisters, OWH, kids, everyone knows. Formal exposure at work - no, but again, everyone knows. It would be a simple conversation with our boss as soon as I got back to work to assure they are never placed in a working situation together. Or he can have the conversation with our boss, either way. Seeing each other's names in a company directory or a random email, sure it will happen on occasion.

Ok, I think I have my homework. Thanks everyone.

It will only be a matter of time, a week, a month, a year, before they slowly get back into contact. They'll start off slow, a "hi, how are you" and it'll build from there.

It won't work.

Are you seriously willing to live every day wondering if THIS is the day that contact resumes?

Been there, done that, as have numerous other posters here. It's going to come down to which is more important--your finances or your marriage. We all understand that it isn't easy and will wreak havoc on the old bank account, but that's the reality that has been dumped into your lap.

Here you go.
I Told You So!!!!

Northwood...you are right. I don't want that and the truth of the matter is, I do still feel that way because since they do work at the same company, she will ALWAYS have some form of access to him and vice versa. Just a phone call away... there's no blocking numbers, no NOT KNOWING each other's phone numbers or email addresses...

I think that maybe I can get somewhere with OWH. Would it be a good idea to meet with him and discuss the possibility of him getting her to leave? Is it worth a shot or too disruptive to be worthwhile? From what he tells me she is still very, very wayward... to the point that he thinks she has lost her mind. (This is what he says)

It wouldn't hurt to talk to OWH and see if he can get his WW to leave, but I'd also approach it this way with your WH:

If you want me to stay married to you, I must be absolutely sure that you will never have contact with OW again. This means that the two of you cannot work together. How are you going to resolve this?

How he makes that happen is going to show you how serious he is about recovery, but I really would throw that in his lap and tell him to fix it.

I know exactly what he will say: "We don't work together anymore, it's taken care of. She will always be able to find a way to contact me and I will always be able to find a way to contact her if I really want to."

How he makes that happen... very good point.

And yes, that does tell me something. Hmm.

Getting ready to set up the lie detector ...

Is there a good thread on how to present this, questions to ask, how to prepare myself, etc?

Here you go.
Polygraph Testing